Wikipedia:Featured and good topic candidates/Ships of the Royal Yugoslav Navy/archive1

Ships of the Royal Yugoslav Navy[edit]

This good topic candidate ~~contains a lead article, Royal Yugoslav Navy,~~ is led by List of ships of the Royal Yugoslav Navy, and articles covering all the ship classes, and where they are individually notable, articles for all individual ships on the list. Peacemaker67 (click to talk to me) 03:12, 18 March 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Support Congrats on getting here Peacemaker. Iazyges Consermonor Opus meum 04:31, 18 March 2017 (UTC)[reply]
Issues: why is Category:Ships of the Royal Yugoslav Navy full of other articles? If T1-8 exist, why not T9-12? Or any MT class ones? Also, I am wondering if any people in Category:Royal Yugoslav Navy personnel of World War II, at least the admiral(s) should be included? If yes, change lead with the ships list. Nergaal (talk) 08:48, 18 March 2017 (UTC)[reply]

What other articles? The reason for T9–12 not being included is that they are not independently notable, as I mentioned in a general sense in the nom statement. The 250t-class ones clearly are, which can be seen from the individual articles. That is clear if you look at the 250t-class and Kaiman-class articles, and is a function of how old they were when WWI commenced, the 250t-class were new and were very active, the Kaiman-class not so much. The MT-class is the same, they are PT-boats that served for less than a year in a war, given their size, very little has been written about any individual PT-boats (except the one JFK captained in the Pacific). It is also highly questionable whether any of the senior officers of the Royal Yugoslav Navy are themselves notable. Of course, I'd be interested in any sources you might have that call into question my statements about the notability of individual ships. Cheers, Peacemaker67 (click to talk to me) 09:04, 18 March 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Don't understand me wrong. The topic you proposed is fine with ships as lead and removal of current lead. The overview topic (which you propose here) should contain also a list of admirals for example, Dragutin Prica, and even maybe a fork of Orders, decorations, and medals of the Kingdom of Yugoslavia. Nergaal (talk) 09:58, 18 March 2017 (UTC)[reply]

I think I understand what you are saying, remove Royal Yugoslav Navy from this topic and call it List of ships of the Royal Yugoslav Navy? Peacemaker67 (click to talk to me) 00:15, 19 March 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Yes. Until other articles relevant to the topic (but which are not ships) are also improved. Nergaal (talk) 09:59, 20 March 2017 (UTC)[reply]

About 1/3 of the articles are linked to different names than listed here. I am not sure what is the best procedure for this. Maybe put together a good introduction that details all this and others in short. Same for the book, which is a joke right now. Nergaal (talk) 10:07, 20 March 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Nergaal Will fix that. This is the first time I've done a proper good-sized book. Do you have any suggestions on a possible structure? Peacemaker67 (click to talk to me) 03:13, 21 March 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Have worked on the book, dividing it up into chapters by ship type similar to other FT/GT on ships. Let me know what you think? Have also fixed the naming issue by piping to the Yugoslav names. Peacemaker67 (click to talk to me) 06:30, 22 March 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Now it is readable. I almost suggest leaving out names with boat types so this list is more readable. Also, you need a descriptive intro paragraph. Nergaal (talk) 08:36, 25 March 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Trimmed. Peacemaker67 (click to talk to me) 08:58, 26 March 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Added intro para. Let me know what you think? More? Less? Cheers, Peacemaker67 (click to talk to me) 09:10, 30 March 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Comment - I wrote a couple of the articles in this topic, so I'm probably too involved to vote, but I do have a question: why are the monitors written out with their full titles, but none of the other vessels are? Also, the columns should probably be as even as possible - I'd suggest swapping Beli Orao and the three minelayers/sweepers, which would give you columns of 12, 12, and 11, which balances much nicer. Parsecboy (talk) 00:57, 19 March 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Fixed. Peacemaker67 (click to talk to me) 01:54, 19 March 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Comment – I notice in the list of ships you state that auxiliaries are not listed there. Is that list somewhere else? If not, can it not be created? Presumably, they were ships of the Royal Yugoslav Navy too, even if they weren't fighting ones. –Noswall59 (talk) 01:52, 8 May 2017 (UTC).[reply]

G'day, the reason the larger auxiliaries are not part of the topic is because they do not meet the general notability guideline, and therefore do not have an article, whereas the ships and classes of ships in this topic are, and do. They are, as you point out, covered by their inclusion in the list. The smaller auxiliaries, tugs and hulks are also non-notable. Cheers, Peacemaker67 (click to talk to me) 04:37, 8 May 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Director Comment - Only one Support has been made for this topic. This nomination needs more discussion for a consensus to be made. GamerPro64 17:01, 22 May 2017 (UTC)[reply]

I've listed it on the Wikicup list of articles/topics needing attention, in the hope that will attract more attention. Cheers, Peacemaker67 (click to talk to me) 23:44, 22 May 2017 (UTC)[reply]

I've also posted on the Wikiproject Military History talk page. Cheers, Peacemaker67 (click to talk to me) 01:37, 23 May 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Support - Why is patrol torpedo boat not included? Otherwise, I will just have to trust you on certain ships not being notable, as I do not have access to resources that would verify their notability. Kees08 (Talk) 19:28, 27 May 2017 (UTC)[reply]

G'day. I think that is stretching the scope of a good topic outside what constitutes "thoroughly covering all parts of that topic" when the topic is about Royal Yugoslav Navy ships. The Yugoslav PT boats were drawn from one of several models of PT boats, there isn't even significant coverage in reliable sources of the Yugoslav "MT class" of eight boats, let alone the individual boats, and the lead list of this topic already covers all of the available and admittedly basic information about the class. Cheers, Peacemaker67 (click to talk to me) 02:51, 28 May 2017 (UTC)[reply]
- My only concern would be that 250t-class torpedo boat (and other similar overarching boat groups) are included, but patrol torpedo boat is not. It seems like the summary groups may not be needed for this, and just the specific ships should be included. I am not going to make a fuss about it though, you should have enough supports now as it is anyways. Kees08 (Talk) 00:18, 22 June 2017 (UTC)[reply]
  - As a result of doing some deeper research into the PT boats pursuant to this query, with the idea of writing an article on the class, it appears that the source may not be correct about the PT boats. Several other sources state that the PT boats in question were transferred to the British under Lend-Lease in October 1944 and remained with them until the end of the war as Motor Gun Boats, and that they were handed back at the end of the war. There is even discussion of one of them supporting SOE insertions on the Italian coast, which the British would have kept control of. It appears they may have then been transferred to the Yugoslavs post-war, which would mean that they did not serve in the Royal Yugoslav Navy, and wouldn't be part of this topic. I've noted this on the lead list talk page, and removed them from it for now. Cheers, Peacemaker67 (click to talk to me) 06:53, 1 July 2017 (UTC)[reply]
    - Thanks for doing that additional research, makes sense. Changing to support. Kees08 (Talk) 05:13, 6 July 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Comment - The Schichau class link should not be italicized, no ship named Schichau. Other than that Support - Llammakey (talk) 11:11, 21 June 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Fixed. Good pick up. Peacemaker67 (click to talk to me) 01:40, 22 June 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Support To get this far on so many articles--Amazing--. auntieruth (talk) 18:54, 21 June 2017 (UTC)[reply]

G'day GamerPro64, I think all issues have been addressed now and it has sufficient support. Cheers, Peacemaker67 (click to talk to me) 06:22, 6 July 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Support This looks incredible. Congratulations, it must have been a colossal amount of work. N Oneemuss (talk) 17:01, 12 July 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Closed with a consensus to promote to Good Topic. - GamerPro64 03:56, 15 July 2017 (UTC)[reply]