Wikipedia talk:WikiProject U.S. Census

2020 Census

It's 2019. The 2020 US census will be underway in a few months. We'll probably start getting data in mid-2021 (less than two years from now). How many of the 2010 folks are around, and who else might be interested in helping out with the new version? Two years from now is not too early to be thinking about what should happen. WhatamIdoing (talk) 21:02, 6 October 2019 (UTC)

I'm around. All the best: Rich Farmbrough (the apparently calm and reasonable) 20:29, 3 March 2020 (UTC).

Link migration project.

Please see Wikipedia:US Census Migration. -- RoySmith (talk) 15:36, 10 February 2020 (UTC)

United States Census 2000 demographics

Please see Wikipedia:US Census Migration#United States Census 2000 demographics. Yours aye,  Buaidh  talk contribs 04:09, 19 December 2020 (UTC)

Member category and userbox template

Members of WikiProject U.S. Census should place one of the following lines of Wikitext on their user page:

Wikitext	userbox	where used
[[Category:WikiProject U.S. Census members]]	none	linked pages
{{Template:User WP U.S. Census}}	This user is a member of WikiProject U.S. Census	linked pages

Yours aye,  Buaidh  talk contribs 05:40, 19 December 2020 (UTC)

Request regarding the 2020 Census

Greetings and felicitations. The 2010 Census contains the boilerplate "XX.X% were non-families. YY.Y% of all households were made up of individuals" (e.g., here). This violates MOS:NUMNOTES (which is based on general English usage—see The Chicago Manual of Style, 17th Ed., 9.5 "Number beginning a sentence" (p. 545)). I fix them manually to read "...Of all households, YY.Y% were made up of individuals", but I'd like to avoid the necessity with the next version. Can we come to a consensus about this? —DocWatson42 (talk) 10:34, 28 January 2021 (UTC)

Hello, again. Bumping this topic. —DocWatson42 (talk) 03:11, 19 August 2021 (UTC)

DocWatson42, I'm fine with that. But is the bot active this year? Ganesha811 (talk) 12:17, 22 August 2021 (UTC)

@Ganesha811: I'm sorry, but I have no idea—I'm a copy editor coming "hat in hand" to this project, rather than a participant. (Note that there is at least one other similar phrase, though less common, regarding "N% Latinos...".) —DocWatson42 (talk) 18:59, 22 August 2021 (UTC)

Ganesha811, Rich Farmbrough, Buaidh, RoySmith If we get a bot running, I would like to participate. I edit a lot of census info. 19:56, 29 May 2022 (UTC)

I'm confused

I worked on the 2020 Census and have been looking for the release of data I helped collect in remote Alaska villages, but all I can seem to find is data based on the 2019 American Community Survey. Has the data not been released yet? Beeblebrox (talk) 21:26, 14 June 2021 (UTC)

@Beeblebrox: It was in the news this past week that the data had been released after a significant delay.

• Wang, Hansi Lo (5 August 2021). "After Months of Delay, the Census Data for New Voting Maps Is Coming Out Aug. 12". NPR.
• Wang, Hansi Lo (12 August 2021). "How the 2020 Census Data Will Shape Voting Districts for the Next Decade". All Things Considered. NPR.
• "Explore Census Data" (archive, 16 August 2021), U.S. Census Bureau (quoting the message at the top of the page):

The 2020 Redistricting Data will be available on data.census.gov no later than September 30th. The redistricting legacy format summary files are now available on the FTP site. Support materials and additional information are available on the Redistricting Data Program's summary file webpage

You will likely know better than I where to find it, as I'm just a copyeditor trying to prevent the repetition of a mistake in this census's wording (see above). —DocWatson42 (talk) 03:23, 19 August 2021 (UTC)

You'd think that, but we got very little information on what happens after the data is collected. They're funny like that. What I do know is that the Remote Alaska operation was the very first field work done by census 2020, (we started in late January, in the YK Delta, so really, really cold) but it is also one of the last operations done with pencil and paper, and the sole facility for processing paper census forms went through a prolonged covid shutdown. Thanks for the links. I'll see what I can find out. Beeblebrox (talk) 21:07, 22 August 2021 (UTC)

@Beeblebrox: and @DocWatson42: The 2020 census is out for Alaska: see https://data.census.gov/cedsci/table?q=p2&g=0400000US02%241600000 and https://data.census.gov/cedsci/table?q=p2&g=2300000US0200590

A Census-designated place for a university should be separate from the wiki-page for the university

I have had a number of pages for CDPs that cover a university merged into the page for the university. (see Kean University, New Jersey (CDP) https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Kean_University%2C_New_Jersey_%28CDP%29&type=revision&diff=1090473926&oldid=1090451709) which has been redirected to Kean University. I think that they should be separate. A CDP wikipage for a university/college campus is different from the entry for the actual university and should be separate. That is why we use a different infobox for CDPs which provides census-specific information including geographic information, a map with neighboring communities, coordinates, coordinates, elevation, population density, a FIPS code, and a GNIS ID (which enable bots to identify the geography and update certain parameters). The population of a CDP does not correspond to the composition of the student body at the university; rather it only refers to those who are permanent residents on campus. For geographic entities, the demographic composition of "residents" has little to do with the university and is best held on another page. I looked for guidance but I did not see any discussion in the help pages (in fact I cannot see any CDPs for universities in New Jersey other then the ones I created). Sometimes CDP geographies are different from the subject to CDP (e.g. military bases, islands...etc). It is best to keep a standard format with standard entries and refer back to the CDP page from the subject page.Patapsco913 (talk) 19:23, 29 May 2022 (UTC)

• The overwhelming majority of CDPs are well-defined sub-communities that are located within larger communities and that stand alone from and have a separate identity different from the larger community; all of these CDPs should have their own standalone articles. There are some CDPs that don't meet this bill because they overlap with another entity. In New Jersey, this includes both Fort Dix and McGuire AFB, for which the CDP data has long been included in the articles for the military base. In terms of new 2020 CDPs for Kean University, New Jersey (CDP), Montclair State University, New Jersey (CDP), Ramapo College of New Jersey, New Jersey (CDP), Rutgers University-Busch Campus, New Jersey (CDP), Rutgers University-Livingston Campus, New Jersey (CDP), Stockton University, New Jersey (CDP) and The College of New Jersey, New Jersey (CDP) (and any I may have missed), there appears to be no meaningful difference between the college campus and the CDP. Placing them in the same article makes the data about the campus available in the college/university article, without having to switch over to a separate article that adds no context. Alansohn (talk) 19:55, 29 May 2022 (UTC)
  • But it does add information that is relevant to the census including coordinates, elevation, population density, a FIPS code, a GNIS ID, and an actual map which really are not relevant to the university wikipage. You have removed all of this information. In addition, this data will help the bots to automatically update the info. Patapsco913 (talk) 20:31, 29 May 2022 (UTC)
    • Patapsco913, if that's the issue, add the infobox to the school articles. There is nothing gained otherwise. Alansohn (talk) 21:32, 29 May 2022 (UTC)
      • Well the real issue is that CDP is a separate entity from the university (with a distinctive population composed of residents who listed the CDP as their permanent residence) and should be on a separate page. It just seems silly to have pages for 30 to 40,000 places in a specific format and then make an exception for at best a couple of hundred pages. I really do not see what benefit there is to clutter up the university page with CDP info which is not relevant to the university (ditto for military bases).Patapsco913 (talk) 21:53, 29 May 2022 (UTC)
        • What do I do about Kean University where the page is about the greater University including other campuses while the CDP is solely for the main campus? Seems odd to not have a separate page.Patapsco913 (talk) 21:53, 29 May 2022 (UTC)

Patapsco913, sorry for not seeing this before I redirected a few more, but I agree with Alansohn. CDPs are not inherently notable entities, they are merely statistical areas with no significance besides the fact that the census publishes population data about the place. The vast majority of CDPs are notable because they represent independent communities that ought to receive coverage, but in these cases there is already an article about the campus or military base. If the on-campus or on-base demographics are relevant, that belongs on the main article for the place. Reywas92^Talk 00:28, 8 June 2022 (UTC)

No worries Reywas92. The problem as I see it is that the CDP only reflects the permanent resident population of a campus which is different from the composition of the resident student body. Given that their are 30-40,000 CDPS/census places with their own wikipages (and specific census data), it does not make sense to make exceptions for what is merely a handful of CDPs. In addition, the university wikipages often encompass more than the CDP (see Kean University which is two campuses of which the CDP is only one). Patapsco913 (talk) 01:04, 8 June 2022 (UTC)

Reywas92 The only people counted in the census are those who fill the census form out using their school address and does not include students who fill out the census form using their home address (many students continue to use their home address for tax or work purposes since it is easier then changing your address repeatedly). That is why the CDP population is usually much smaller than the on-campus population. Patapsco913 (talk) 01:13, 8 June 2022 (UTC)

That is incorrect, per my edit summary on Kean University: "permanent residence", such as if a student living on campus maintains their parents' address, is irrelevant to the census. The census *should* have counted the resident student body of people living on campus on April 1, 2020, so this data is nominally accurate about the resident student body (though of course not students living off-campus). Using a different address for tax or work purposes does not mean they would have used that permanent address on the census, and anyone who did so was doing it wrong. The CDP population may be lower than expected because in 2020 many students who had been living on campus moved away during the pandemic (or because people simply did it wrong...).

It does not make sense to have separate articles describing the demographics of a campus or base, regardless if the census is counting that. Again, it's merely a statistical entity, one could also see the tract that covers the University of Washington for equivalent data, but a CDP wouldn't have been made because it's incorporated. This isn't an "exception": the other 40,000 CDPs are 40,000 communities that would otherwise not have coverage. These do have respective articles where demographic infomation could be included (but I'm not convinced it always needs to be, just as we don't need to have a page or section for the 4,996 people in that campus's tract).

For Kean, I've specified which campus areas these demographics represent. Reywas92^Talk 01:29, 8 June 2022 (UTC)

The Census Bureau will mail the census form to your permanent/tax/listed address. If the student uses his parent's address as his tax address then that is where he/she will be counted. Patapsco913 (talk) 01:52, 8 June 2022 (UTC)

Wrong, the Census Bureau mails one form to each address (not to "you"), they have no idea about anyone's tax addresses, listed addresses, or what someone considers to be their permanent or temporary address. A student will be counted at their parents' address only if their parent filled out the census form with their name on it, which would be incorrect if they didn't actually live there, regardless of taxes. Students should be counted "where they live and sleep 'most of the time.'", not what they use on IRS forms. University dorms typically use Group Quarters counting methods where administrators send information about all residents. They have no idea about tax addresses, they use the correct method of how many people live there! Reywas92^Talk 02:08, 8 June 2022 (UTC)

Makes sense but they do use your tax filing information. "The sources of information used to identify individuals’ residence are as follows: the Census Numident, the Census Unedited File, the IRS 1040 and 1099 files, the Medicare Enrollment Database (MEDB), Indian Health Service database (IHS), Selective Service System (SSS), and Public and Indian Housing (PIC) and Tenant Rental Assistance Certification System (TRACS) data from the Department of Housing and Urban Development, and National Change of Address data from the US Postal Service United States Postal Service " https://www2.census.gov/ces/wp/2018/CARRA-18-12.pdf Patapsco913 (talk) 02:28, 8 June 2022 (UTC)

• I've been troubled for a while at the way Wikipedia leans on census definitions for where and what places are. CDPs are not legal entities, they are simply an internal tool the census uses to organize data. An example I happen to know a lot about is Fox River, Alaska. It's an enormous area, the majority of it is uninhabited wilderness inside the Kenai National Wildlife Refuge, and then there's some vacation-use cabins in the Caribou Hills area, none of which are primary residences. The only actual population, even by census definitions, are in and around three small villages, Razdolna, Voznesenka, and Kachemak Selo. Literally nobody will tell you they live in Fox River. Not one person. The reason is that it is a construct that only exists in census data, and yet we let the census tell us the area is called Fox River. I'm not sure that's how we should do things. Beeblebrox (talk) 01:37, 8 June 2022 (UTC)

  Not to mention that New Jersey in particular does a crap job at defining CDPs. Even though CDPs are supposed to be "Statistical equivalents of incorporated places, with the primary differences being the lack of a legally defined boundary" and "Must generally consist of single piece of territory with a mix residential, commercial and other uses similar to that of an incorporated place of similar size". But then we get crap like Renaissance at Monroe, New Jersey, which is just a housing development/subdivision that would fail GEOLAND2. While stand-alone communities are considered notable, and most CDPs are such, this and a number of others are not. Reywas92^Talk 02:31, 8 June 2022 (UTC)

Is there a way to get population of a US watershed / drainage basin?

White Deer Hole Creek is a FA and is being reviewed for meeting FA criteria (Larrys Creek was a FA, and was delisted recently as part of the same review of older FAs). Both articles had watershed information from here, which included information like the watershed's area, population in the previous US census, and area / percentages of the watershed by forest or agriculture. This information is no longer available from the Chesapeake Bay program website, and the WebArchive links are to "URL not found" pages. Many year ago I emailed the Chesapeake Bay program asking where they got the information. Their reply was basically it was easy to get without giving me a source. My hope is that there is a database somewhere or website that I am not aware of, but someone here knows about. Anyone have any ideas? WikiProject Rivers let me know of a source for the percent forest etc., so now the most important missing piece of information would be 2020 census population of the watershed. Does anyone know how to get this data? Thanks! - Ruhrfisch _><>°^° 00:55, 22 November 2022 (UTC)

You could do it without too much difficulty if you have access to GIS tools like ArcGIS or QGIS - you'd need a shapefile of the Chesapeake watershed and a population density raster, and then could use the "Summarize within" tool or similar. I wasn't able to find an online tool that has this functionality, however, so it would have to be done offline. —Ganesha811 (talk) 17:25, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

Actually, looking further, this EPA dataset seems to have population per HUC12 watershed from the 2010 Census already pre-calculated. It would not be too hard to sum it up for the Chesapeake watershed from those smaller watersheds. —Ganesha811 (talk) 17:29, 14 February 2023 (UTC)

Thanks so much! I will look into this. - Ruhrfisch _><>°^° 03:13, 17 February 2023 (UTC)

2020 Census

Hi! It's 2024 now, and I haven't seen any 2020 census data on any articles that I've looked at; just the 2000 and 2010 census data at most. Is there any plan to add 2020 census data? I'm guessing not, given that it hasn't happened yet, but it'd be nice if someone could confirm that. AlphaPyro (talk) 06:34, 2 February 2024 (UTC)

The Census Bureau has not released full sets of its data for cities and communities. Articles will need to be updated with what little we have and use ACS and other surveys to make up for some of the categories removed for the 2020 census. SounderBruce 08:11, 2 February 2024 (UTC)