Wikipedia talk:WikiProject College Basketball

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Template:NCAA Division III women's basketball tournament navbox missing only one tournament

FYI, Template:NCAA Division III women's basketball tournament navbox is only missing 1997 NCAA Division III women's basketball tournament for completion.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 18:49, 9 March 2024 (UTC)

• Of all men's and women's tournaments in D1, D2 and D3, this is the only missing tournament.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 13:54, 19 March 2024 (UTC)
  • I will award a barnstar for the creation of this page.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 03:43, 22 March 2024 (UTC)

    Working on it. This will take me a couple days probably. Let you know when it's finished. - BeFriendlyGoodSir (talk) 05:13, 22 March 2024 (UTC)

    • • I should be clear. I said it was the only missing article. I did not check the templates to make sure none of the blue links were redirects.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 05:40, 22 March 2024 (UTC)
        • I visited the categories and this is the only missing D1, D2 or D3 men's or women's tournament.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 19:36, 22 March 2024 (UTC)

          @TonyTheTiger, Completed only missing D1, D2 or D3 men's or women's tournament (1997 NCAA Division III women's basketball tournament). - BeFriendlyGoodSir (talk) 05:25, 23 March 2024 (UTC)

          It would be good to add some independent sources of significant coverage to demonstrate WP:GNG. Otherwise, someone might do a weak WP:BEFORE and nominate it for WP:AFD. —Bagumba (talk) 06:03, 23 March 2024 (UTC)

          Yes, independent sources have been added (New York Times and CBS News). I'll see what else I can dig up. - BeFriendlyGoodSir (talk) 06:47, 23 March 2024 (UTC)

          What is the purpose of the asterisks (*) in the 1996 NCAA Division III women's basketball tournament and all the other articles. I did not add it to 1997 because I do not know what they are used for. I assumed it meant the winning team but that was not always the case. - BeFriendlyGoodSir (talk) 07:05, 23 March 2024 (UTC)

          I'd try to track down the editor of that page (User:Wmtribe2015).-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 12:12, 26 March 2024 (UTC)

          Wmtribe2015 replied. They said an asterisk by a team indicates the host of first and second round games AND an asterisk by a score indicates an overtime period. I'll go thru each year and add this as shown on 1997 NCAA Division III women's basketball tournament - BeFriendlyGoodSir (talk) 02:41, 27 March 2024 (UTC)

          It is quite unconventional to use the same symbol (asterisk) to mean two different things on the same page. That needs to be changed. Do not copy that convention. Use 2 different symbols for the two meanings. Look on the DI pages to determine what are the conventional manners of designation. Don't make up your own. Mention to him that if he has used this convention on many pages that probably should be corrected.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 03:45, 27 March 2024 (UTC)

          Got it. Thanks, - BeFriendlyGoodSir (talk) 04:48, 27 March 2024 (UTC)

          On the men's D1 article and the women's D1 article, asterisk means denotes overtime period. I have not found a symbol for the host of first and second round games outside of women's D3. Let you know if I do. - BeFriendlyGoodSir (talk) 04:53, 27 March 2024 (UTC)

          Did you go back to when early round D1 games were always hosted by one of the two teams. I think early 1980s or before.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 04:21, 29 March 2024 (UTC)

          1980 NCAA Division I basketball tournament#Bracket and 1975 also has asterisk only to denote overtime period. Should we remove asterisks that denote host of first and second rounds? - BeFriendlyGoodSir (talk) 05:08, 29 March 2024 (UTC)

          How many D2 and D3 tournaments were formated with double-meaning for the same symbol?-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 12:10, 29 March 2024 (UTC)

          @Wmtribe2015:, please see the above discussion. - BeFriendlyGoodSir (talk) 05:01, 27 March 2024 (UTC)

• (ec)Kudos. I may have made the request, but you are not doing this for me. It just does not make sense for us as a project to have 1 tournament missing from the set of D1, D2 & D3 men's and women's tournaments. Although there is very little work done outside of DI, we need to be complete. On behalf of the project I thank you for completing our set. BTW, ,on the talk page, I changed the project from WP:BBALL, which is for international basketball to WP:CBBALL, which is for college basketball. Neither WP:WSPORTS nor WP:CBBALL has a barnstar. Unless you have a strong barnstar preference, I will figure out an appropriate one.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 07:11, 23 March 2024 (UTC)

  Any barnstars are much appreciated, my first of hopefully many more to come!!! Thank you for pointing out that this needed fixing. - @TonyTheTiger - BeFriendlyGoodSir (talk) 07:13, 23 March 2024 (UTC)

  @TonyTheTiger, The Original Barnstar is perfectly fine :) - BeFriendlyGoodSir (talk) 03:16, 25 March 2024 (UTC)

Professional career chronologies

User:DaHuzyBru & User:Rikster2 can you see if anything needs to be in the infoboxes for Craig Lathen and Martell Bailey. I do not recall if I ever inquired about these guys and am thinking about GA nominations for them for the WP:CUP.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 13:47, 18 March 2024 (UTC)

I can check for CBA career tonight. Pretty sure I have looked for Lathen before. Bailey might have played too late for the CBA but you can check basketball-reference.com and see if he played in the G League. Rikster2 (talk) 13:51, 18 March 2024 (UTC)

There is no Eurobasket profile for Lathen. Bailey has a profile but it appears he never played professionally as there is no detail after University of Illinois at Chicago in 2003–04. DaHuzyBru (talk) 14:18, 18 March 2024 (UTC)

I am surprised to see nothing professional for either guy so I am double checking whether I checked before. Maybe I did. Thanks for looking or looking again.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 15:44, 18 March 2024 (UTC)

I have nothing on either player Rikster2 (talk) 03:57, 19 March 2024 (UTC)

Thanks for checking guys.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 03:59, 19 March 2024 (UTC)

User:DaHuzyBru & User:Rikster2, Chris Hill (basketball), can you add any WP:ICs from WP:RS for prose in this professional chronology.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 06:31, 27 March 2024 (UTC)

I have expanded it a little based off his Eurobasket profile. DaHuzyBru (talk) 07:30, 27 March 2024 (UTC)

User:DaHuzyBru Do you have any sources that could be used to support prose regarding his international championships?-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 18:24, 30 March 2024 (UTC)

I can't find anything substantial with a quick search apart from euroleague profile, which states "Won the 2009-10 and 2010-11 Belgian National Championship with Spirou Charleroi". DaHuzyBru (talk) 00:12, 31 March 2024 (UTC)

Team roster template: full state name vs. postal code

There seems to be an inconsistency/internal disagreement whether to use the full state name or the state's postal code for a player's hometown--currently it seems just as an estimate to be somewhere between a 25/75 split and a 33/67 split in favor of postal code. I'm planning on starting the project to make it uniform but I just want to get a gauge of what you all think might be better. I consulted WP:MOS just to be sure and in the abbreviations subpage it mentions using full name in body text, postal codes being permitted for tables but needing to use a tag on the first instance of each state, but I don't see anything about templates, which to me feels kind of like a weird in-between? I'm leaning towards postal codes just for consistency with the recruiting charts above the roster templates (and I think overall it looks cleaner), but I just wanted to get some input before making as many changes as this will be (a ton of teams across a ton of years), as well as the fact that if I go the opposite way from what consensus would've been it'd be quite a lot to clean up (which I'd happily do myself as the maker of said mess, but it's better if avoided of course). Greenday61892 (talk) 22:46, 19 March 2024 (UTC)

A template is just a means to create a table, so consider it to be a table. As for the MOS, I'm not sure what is expected re: {{abbr}} if the city–state is wikilinked. Per MOS:STATEABBR:

They can be used in tables when space is tight but should be marked up with {{abbr}} template on first occurrence.

—Bagumba (talk) 02:31, 20 March 2024 (UTC)

Yeah, that was kind of what confused me as well. I'll give this at least a couple more days to see if I get more response and otherwise start probably Friday afternoon-ish. Greenday61892 (talk) 03:05, 20 March 2024 (UTC)

I'm a fan of the postal code, personally. It's cleaner and it's considerate of the limited space in those roster templates. SportsGuy789 (talk) 04:03, 20 March 2024 (UTC)

Just an FYI I have gone ahead and started taking care of this, in favor of postal abbreviations; I've done the first few teams needing the fix in the America East and I'm just gonna work my way through the conferences from the standings section of 2023–24 NCAA Division I men's basketball season. Was hoping to find a full alphabetical list (perhaps in a category) but this honestly is just as fine. As long as all teams are listed it works.

As an aside I'm intending on doing this for any game logs if they need them as well, though I didn't notice the issue with those, even on pages that used full state name in the roster template. Greenday61892 (talk) 01:21, 23 March 2024 (UTC)

A further aside, I realized I never actually added myself as a participant but that has been rectified, ha. Greenday61892 (talk) 01:25, 23 March 2024 (UTC)

Yes, leave them full if there's space. Helpful when readers not from a particular country. —Bagumba (talk) 02:41, 23 March 2024 (UTC)

Yeah, that makes sense. So far though I've yet to see one that doesn't spill over, just by nature of how much dang information is in those boxes, but if I see one that doesn't spill over I'll keep it as is. Greenday61892 (talk) 02:53, 23 March 2024 (UTC)

Oh, I meant for the game logs. I think its a given space is short on the full roster listings.—Bagumba (talk) 03:47, 23 March 2024 (UTC)

Oh! I see. Game logs are all entirely uniformly postal abbreviations, should they be changed? Greenday61892 (talk) 12:21, 23 March 2024 (UTC)

I saw "game logs" and "full state name" in your comment As an aside I'm intending on doing this for any game logs...didn't notice the issue with those, even on pages that used full state name... but didn't process the ...in the roster template end. Basically, I mistakenly thought you meant gamelogs were already using full state name. But they aren't. The MOS is what it is. I'll leave it for you to decide how you wish to volunteer your time.—Bagumba (talk) 14:35, 23 March 2024 (UTC)

I have also noticed this inconsistency in team season schedule tables. Just looking at Oklahoma and Oklahoma State alone.-UCO2009bluejay (talk) 15:11, 29 March 2024 (UTC)

Are you talking for this year or previous years? Because at a quick glance I'm not noticing that issue for either team you mentioned, at least for the last few seasons for either. Greenday61892 (talk) 01:18, 30 March 2024 (UTC)

I changed the 90-91 today for example. It listed the entire state name instead of the abbreviation. I usually keep to the 20th century, they are more neglected across all sports generally. UCO2009bluejay (talk) 02:04, 30 March 2024 (UTC)

I'd say if it's already expanded, and there's space, then let it be. But I'll leave it to your discretion. —Bagumba (talk) 02:25, 30 March 2024 (UTC)

Scratch that. But then there's almost never space on a phone.—Bagumba (talk) 02:28, 30 March 2024 (UTC)

Ah! Fair, I'm just going from the present-back. So after I eventually finish this season I'm going to start on 2022-23. Greenday61892 (talk) 02:35, 30 March 2024 (UTC)

2024-25 Assistant coaching limits

At Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_College_Basketball/Archive_10#4_or_5_Assistant_coaches, User:CalDoesIt presented a July 1, 2023 rule change that allowed up to 5 assistant coaches. As I watch Dusty May fill out his staff, they talk as if he is still limited to 3 assistants and the next hire would fill out the staff. Are they going back to 3 next year?-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 21:41, 8 April 2024 (UTC)

List of NCAA Division I men's basketball career games played leaders

How are we going to handle the second list of non-covid exception players since the source only goes down to 152 games now and next year will probably stop at around 155 or 156?-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 04:09, 10 April 2024 (UTC)

Is the second list WP:DUE? Are there reliable sources that maintain such lists? Players from decades ago also had a disadvantage with shorter schedules and freshman ineligibility.—Bagumba (talk) 06:05, 10 April 2024 (UTC)

Well if it can be sourced, I'd support it, but if not...-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 15:27, 12 April 2024 (UTC)

@SportsGuy789:, you have been the main editor of this page in recent years. Do you know if there is a way to source the second (non-COVID) list?-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 15:29, 12 April 2024 (UTC)

I don't know of one. @Dale Arnett: is the user who added that list on 1/26/22. SportsGuy789 (talk) 16:24, 12 April 2024 (UTC)

I am pretty sure the NCAA does not keep a separate list on non-COVID era games played leaders. If not I struggle to see why the second list would be there. There is no list of games played leaders from before freshman eligibility Rikster2 (talk) 16:35, 12 April 2024 (UTC)

The NCAA now keeps separate games played leaderboards for COVID-era and pre-COVID players. See, e.g., pages 29–30 of the 2023 edition of the Division I men's record book and page 23 of the D-I women's record book. — Dale Arnett (talk) 01:48, 13 April 2024 (UTC)

It handles career games played well but for single season it messes up. On page 61 it shows two teams played 41 games in a season, but on page 4 it only lists players from one of them.-TonyTheTiger (T / C / WP:FOUR / WP:CHICAGO / WP:WAWARD) 05:48, 13 April 2024 (UTC)