Talk:Kew Gardens station (LIRR)

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Re rating the article as Start[edit]

This article has some information (such as links, like the murder), but doesn't cite sources and needs some more information to upgrade it to a "real" start class. Right now it's about a low start or high stub. --Hirohisat Talk 01:40, 21 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Q 37 route[edit]

The MTA bus route Q37, does not stop at this station. It stops at the MTA Kew Gardens Station at Union Turnpike. The road next to this line, crossing over this line, is Lefferts Boulevard. Dogru144 (talk) 23:44, 24 September 2008 (UTC)[reply]

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GA Review[edit]

GA toolbox
Reviewing
This review is transcluded from Talk:Kew Gardens (LIRR station)/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Reviewer: Bob1960evens (talk · contribs) 09:01, 26 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

I will review. I will work through the article, making notes as I go, and return to the lead at the end. Can I suggest that you mark any issues fixed with comments or maybe the  Done template. I am not in favour of using strikethrough, as it makes the text difficult to read at a later date, and it is an important record of the GA process. Bob1960evens (talk) 09:01, 26 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

History[edit]

Hopedale Station
  • In March 1879, all new rails were laid from Hopedale to Jamaica. It is not obvious exactly what this means, and it does not follow on from the previous sentence. Reading the source, I suggest "As part of a major refurbishment of the railroad, the rails from Hopedale to Jamaica were replaced in March 1879." or similar.

 Done

Maple Grove Station
  • The flag stop, with low-level platforms, was opened in order to provide better access to Maple Grove Cemetery, What is a flag stop? Suggest it needs a little explanation. Is the mention of low-level platforms correct. The ref is to a diagram which shows platforms labelled "High Pl". The final clause about better access repeats the opening sentence of the paragraph, and so is redundant. Have a try at reworking it a bit.
They were low level. https://www.flickr.com/photos/127872292@N06/41025318494/in/dateposted/
Yes. I was looking at the wrong station. Bob1960evens (talk) 17:33, 28 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

 Done

  • ...was located in back of where the Mowbray and Kew Gardens Plaza Apartments are... The "in back of" sounds a little colloquial. Suggest "to the rear of" if that is what it means.

 Done

  • but it was double-tracked by 1902. Suggest "it had been double-tracked" to go with "by".

 Done

Maple Grove Cut-Off
  • a new straightened four-track route that had low grade. The "low grade" needs clarifying. Does it mean that the line was flatter or of poorer quality?

 Done

  • The Cut-Off branched off of the original line... This does not read well. Suggest "branched from the original line".

 Done

  • the founder of Richmond Hill. Suggest a little context for Richmond Hill. Maybe just "urban neighbourhood of" or you could mention "racially and culturally integrated" as well.

 Done

  • and therefore, financially benefitted from the move. The comma needs removing, since the following clause does not stand on its own.

 Done

  • which was in the path of the cut-off... Previously, "cut-off" has been treated as a proper noun, so was "Cut-Off". Suggest standardising it for consistency, here and in following paragraph.

 Done

  • The Maple Grove station was moved... It is unclear what is going on here. Was it further down Lefferts Avenue or north of the tracks. Please clarify.

 Done

  • still were unused. should be "were still unused."

 Done

Kew Gardens Station[edit]

  • using the Maple Grove cut-off. Another "cut-off".

 Done

  • The new station, and the development accompanying, prior to its opening, Needs to be "the accompanying development" or "the development accompanying it", and "prior to its opening" would be better placed at the start of the sentence, of after the following clause.

 Done

  • With the extension of the Independent Subway System's Queens Boulevard Line to Kew Gardens on December 31, 1936, ridership at this station decreased, even as soon as July 1937. This is a single sentence paragraph, and could be joined to the previous one. "...even as soon as July 1937." does not read well. Suggest "ridership at this station decreased, with the downturn noticed as early as July 1937." or similar.

 Done

  • ...which occurred near this station and Genovese had parked her car... "And" is not a good conjunction here. Suggest "after" or "where".

 Done

  • to allow additional train cars to board. The cars don't board. Suggest "to allow boarding of additional train cars" or similar.

 Done

Lefferts Boulevard Bridge[edit]

  • The bridge has been called Ponte Vecchio, which means "old bridge" in Italian, which refers to the bridge in Florence, which has stores on either side of it. Three consecutive "which"s as conjuctions is poor grammar. Suggest "The bridge has been called Ponte Vecchio, meaning "old bridge" in Italian, and refers to the bridge in Florence, which has stores on either side of it." or similar.

 Done

  • residents have attributed it to the charm of the neighborhood. It needs reorganising, so "residents have attributed the charm of the neighborhood to it." or rewording, so "residents think it contributes to the charm of the neighborhood."

 Done

Demolition threats
  • The MTA didn't pay for the repairs... Avoid contractions, so "did not pay".

 Done

  • businesses on the bridge that the their stores would be torn Either "the" or "their" needs removing.

 Done

Platforms and tracks
  • The Main Line has four tracks; the two middle tracks not next to either platform, are used by express trains. Poor grammar. Suggest "there are no platforms on the two middle tracks, as they are used by express trains." or similar.

 Done

General
  • There are a number of imperial units which could do with metric equivalents for the rest of the world. Suggest using convert, so "300 feet" becomes {{convert|300|ft|m}} in the text, and displays as 300 feet (91 m), etc.

 Done

That is the text reviewed. I'll check the refs next. There are a couple of dead links, which you can check from the toolbox. Bob1960evens (talk) 16:17, 26 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

References[edit]

  • Ref 7 LONG ISLAND RAIL ROAD Alphabetical Station Listing and History. Returns a 404 error.
 Done fixed
  • This is now a 127-page document, and needs page numbers.
  • Ref 11 Maple Grove Cut-Off Track Map Kew Gardens. It is really difficult to see how most of the info is supported by this map. Please review the four times it is used, and explain why. Has Ormonde St become 82nd Ave? Also, grade crossing should be wikilinked, in case readers are confused, as I was, by the term.
The first time is not clear so I removed it. In one instance, it is used to indicate that there was a grade crossing to the west of the station, which is shown on the map. It is also used to indicate that the eastbound platform was extended at some point, and to indicate that staircases used to lead to Onslow Place or Onrmonde Street, not 82nd Avenue.

 Done

  • Ref 12 Collision. I can find no text to support "The station was a flag stop, with trains only stopping upon request, and had low-level platforms located to the rear of where the Mowbray and Kew Gardens Plaza Apartments are located today." in this ref.

 Done Fixed

  • Ref 13 Kew Gardens. 13(a) does not support that the station was designed by James Ware, only that the cemetery was.

 Done – Wrong page number. It is 59, not 60.

  • Ref 14 A GENERAL CHRONOLOGY OF THE PENNSYLVANIA RAILROAD... This is a 114-page document, and needs page numbers. The reopening seems to be on page 87, but I cannot find the closure.

 Done

  • Ref 17 Long Island Rail Road Main Line Maple Grove. The page deals with 1897, and not 1902, so does not cover the double-tracking. Is the link correct?

 Done I added a note. The image is used.

  • Ref 18 LIRR Branch Notes. This supports a build date of 1909-1910, but no mention of $500,000 or shortening by 328 ft.
  • "Main line cut 328’ at Kew Gardens: 1909" This is in the source. The source for the price was inadvertently moved around.

 Done

  • Ref 23 Abandoned Right Of Way. This is used twice to support the same sentence, and ref 24 which is identical also supports the same sentence. Remove two of these.
  • You have removed one of the refs, but refs 24 and 25 (formerly 23 and 24) are still identical and still support the same sentence.
They are different images. I don't see any reason to remove the second one.--Kew Gardens 613 (talk) 23:40, 2 May 2018 (UTC)[reply]
My apoligies. They are indeed different, although they appear to be he same, because only the url has changed. Bob1960evens (talk) 08:41, 5 May 2018 (UTC)[reply]
  • Ref 28 Long Island Rail Road. This supports the subway line opening on December 31, 1936, but the source says 1937.
The line was extended through Briarwood in 1937. The date it opened was on December 31, 1936.--Kew Gardens 613 (talk) 23:40, 2 May 2018 (UTC)[reply]
  • Ref 38 MTA Capital Program 2010-2014. This is a 157-page document, so needs a page number.

 Done

  • Ref 48 Long Island Rail Road Track Map V3.
It is difficult to see how this supports any of the text written.
This source supports the text describes the number of tracks in the station, including the station layout.--Kew Gardens 613 (talk) 23:40, 2 May 2018 (UTC)[reply]
  • I am still not convinced. All I can see is a mass of lines. I have tried zooming in, in case there were any more details, but even at 500% zoom, I still just see lines.
It is there. You need to know where to look. The map is very detailed. Here is the section in question.--Kew Gardens 613 (talk) 11:30, 6 May 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Lead[edit]

  • The acronym LIRR needs introducing on first occurrence, so Long Island Rail Road (LIRR).

 Done

  • The article needs a geographical context, so needs to mention that it is in the US in the first paragraph.
@Epicgenius: It generally has been a consensus not to include this.--Kew Gardens 613 (talk) 00:55, 6 May 2018 (UTC)[reply]
I think that, as long as it's noted that this is in NYC, I don't think mentioning the US is necessary, since readers around the world generally know which country NYC is located. epicgenius (talk) 01:05, 6 May 2018 (UTC)[reply]
  • The lead is a little short. It could do with mentioning the Maple Grove Cut-Off and new alignment in paragraph 2, and something from the "Demolition threats" section in paragraph 3.
 Done--Kew Gardens 613 (talk) 11:27, 6 May 2018 (UTC)[reply]
@Bob1960evens: I think that I have dealt with all of the issues you brought up so far.--Kew Gardens 613 (talk) 15:14, 29 April 2018 (UTC)[reply]

The formal bit[edit]

GA review (see here for what the criteria are, and here for what they are not)
  1. It is reasonably well written.
    a (prose): b (MoS for lead, layout, word choice, fiction, and lists):
    See comments above
  2. It is factually accurate and verifiable.
    a (references): b (citations to reliable sources): c (OR):
    See comments above
  3. It is broad in its coverage.
    a (major aspects): b (focused):
  4. It follows the neutral point of view policy.
    Fair representation without bias:
  5. It is stable.
    No edit wars, etc.:
  6. It is illustrated by images, where possible and appropriate.
    a (images are tagged and non-free images have fair use rationales): b (appropriate use with suitable captions):
  7. Overall:
    Pass/Fail:

All issues have been addressed, although I have just noticed [f82[third rail]] in the Infobox, which needs fixing. I would have done it myself, but am not sure what is intended. Please ensure this is fixed. I am awarding the article GA status.

Move discussion in progress[edit]

There is a move discussion in progress on Talk:Jamaica (LIRR station) which affects this page. Please participate on that page and not in this talk page section. Thank you. —RMCD bot 02:02, 1 May 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Trivia?[edit]

@Epicgenius: Apparently John Lindsay, while Congressman, held a campaign rally in the parking lot at the station during a run for Mayor, following the Genovese murder. Is this too trivial to include? Happy Thanksgiving to you and your family.--Kew Gardens 613 (talk) 13:19, 26 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Kew Gardens 613, thanks. If it was related to Genovese's murder (which it seems to be), I don't see why not. It may be worth saying that his platform was an anti-crime platform, though this might also fit in the Genovese murder article. Hope you and your family also have a good Thanksgiving. Epicgenius (talk) 16:51, 26 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]
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