Talk:Toyokuni Shrine (Kyoto)

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Re-visiting REDIRECT

Something happened with a simple redirect -- the entire text was wiped out an replace by another page. Maybe this is no anomaly, but I'd like to understand this before we move forward. It would appear that using "REDIRECT [[ ]]" to change the name of an article with pre-existing text will effectively function as delete? If so, that presents a problem here:

OLD TEXT -- Hōkoku-jinja:

The Hōkoku-jinja is the official tomb and shrine of Toyotomi Hideyoshi, who died September 18, 1598 in Kyoto.^[1]

The shrine was demolished by Tokugawa Ieyasu in June 1615.

The Meiji Emperor directed that the shrine be restored in Keiō 4, the 6th day of the 6th month (April 28, 1868).^[2] At that time, the shrine area was expanded slightly by encompassing a small parcel of land which had been part of the adjacent Hōkō-ji.^[3]

In 1897, the tercentenary of Hideyoshi was celebrated at this site.^[4]

===========================

NEW TEXT -- Toyokuni Shrine:

Toyokuni Shrine (豊国神社, Toyokuni Jinja) is a Shinto shrine located in Higashiyama-ku, Kyoto, Japan. It was built in 1599 to commemorate Toyotomi Hideyoshi. It is the location of the first tamaya (an altar used in Shinto-style ancestor worship) ever constructed, which was later destroyed by Nobunaga Oda.^[5]

References

^ Ponsonby-Fane, R. (1956). Kyoto: the Old Capital City, 794-1869, pp. 294-296.
^ Ponsonby-Fane, p. 327.
^ Ponsonby-Fane, p. 294.
^ Ponsonby-Fane, p. 296.
^ "reibyou　霊廟". Japanese Architecture and Art Net Users System. 2001. Retrieved 2007-08-09.

My point here doesn't begin to ask about combining what were formerly two needlessly separate reibyu articles -- not yet. I just want to understand what happened in this instance; and then other corollary questions can develop, if necessary. Something is amiss, or at least it's not adequately clear to me that what happened here is a reasonable process for combining or merging what were formerly two distinct Wikipedia articles? How better to proceed from here ...? Ooperhoofd 13:07, 23 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I just meant to unify two articles referring one entity. I do not understand some of you colloquial claim (discussion with bookish words is welcomed), so I am afraid this might not be reply you want. Your argument could be on my deletion of the text to a redirect to Toyokuni Shrine. This article and the destination of the redirect must refer to the 豊国神社 at the corner of Yamato-oji and Shomen Street in Higashiyama-ku, Kyoto City. --Maxima m 05:35, 24 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

No, no -- I'm not wanting to argue. What you've done is smart, correct, better. The only question here has to do with what happens next. There is an unintended consequence when you use "REDIRECT" .... There must be a better way to proceed. I don't happen to know how better to handle this, but one way would be to use copy-and-paste to copy the text from one page to another. Then, when you use "REDIRECT" the result will be 2+2=BETTER .... Does this make it any clearer? If not, plesae let me know and I'll simply ask someone who understands the system better than both of us. In my view, it is important that you know that what you did was a very good thing; and the trivial problem which followed is relatively insignificant -- not unimportant, but minor compared to the value added contribution you made. Ooperhoofd 20:05, 24 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

(removed copy of Move page text that is unnecessary)

I hope this helps you better understand my point. Ooperhoofd 20:19, 24 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Paged moved and histories merged

I've moved Hōkoku-jinja to Toyokuni Shrine and merged the histories of the two articles. I've also restored the most current version of the article from before the move. Please let me know if you have any questions. Thanks! ···日本穣^{? · Talk to Nihonjoe} 05:16, 25 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Aggghh

Turns out there's a bunch of shrines named Toyokuni or Hōkoku, some of which are interchangeable. Opened a real can of worms here :< I will now try to organize them all. AMorozov (talk) 08:35, 26 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Update- I finished the disambiguation and redirecting pages. There may be a problem on this page though, I sense that some of the information from page merge (see above) may have actually been describing two different shrines. As such, the current article we see may be a mix of erroneous info. Since I do not have the cited resources on hand, I cannot check for certain. If someone would like to revamp this article, that would be nice. AMorozov (talk) 09:53, 26 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]

[1] Ponsonby-Fane, R. (1956). Kyoto: the Old Capital City, 794-1869, pp. 294-296.

[2] Ponsonby-Fane, p. 327.

[3] Ponsonby-Fane, p. 294.

[4] Ponsonby-Fane, p. 296.

[5] "reibyou　霊廟". Japanese Architecture and Art Net Users System. 2001. Retrieved 2007-08-09.

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