Template talk:Cite certification

Spanish certifications

Hi. Now, PROMUSICAE has a database with certifications, available through El portal de Música site: https://www.elportaldemusica.es/awards/index

I think it would be interesting to insert a command to make possible the research through this link I inserted. Does someone agree? LuanCampSouza93 (talk) 18:02, 22 November 2023 (UTC)

@LuanCampSouza93: Interesting. I see it can be called programmatically, so we can add an option to certify by title or by artist, for example Madonna or Hard Candy. Was this what you had in mind? Muhandes (talk) 09:58, 1 December 2023 (UTC)

Yes, I was thinking about this. Specially, this link can be useful in cases that the certifcation can't be found on charts or even through the commands https://www.elportaldemusica.es/album/albumname and https://www.elportaldemusica.es/single/singlename. I already found some certs that aren't on the charts neither in that commands. LuanCampSouza93 (talk) 12:12, 1 December 2023 (UTC)

@LuanCampSouza93: I'll add this to my TDL. Muhandes (talk) 12:36, 1 December 2023 (UTC)

Ok, I'll be waiting. Leave a warning when it's finished. LuanCampSouza93 (talk) 21:40, 2 December 2023 (UTC)

@LuanCampSouza93: I finished implementing and testing the solution, and suddenly the entire search stopped working. This might be a temporary website glitch or maybe some cookie magic. For now I am delaying the implementation until we figure it out. Muhandes (talk) 17:19, 10 December 2023 (UTC)

Yes, I have noted this. There's several certs that were deleted from this archive, I don't know why. LuanCampSouza93 (talk) 01:52, 11 December 2023 (UTC)

@LuanCampSouza93: It seems to be back. I really don't know how stable it is. --Muhandes (talk) 06:06, 11 December 2023 (UTC)

Apparently, the problem still persists to me. There's a lot of certifications missing, and depending of the artist, it returns the message:

"Sorry

No awards have been founds that fulfil the established criteria" LuanCampSouza93 (talk) 22:15, 11 December 2023 (UTC)

@LuanCampSouza93: I think it might be a cookie thing. Can you try on an Incognito window? If it is a cookie thing, I'm hesitant to use this as a source. Muhandes (talk) 09:29, 12 December 2023 (UTC)

Apparently, the certs were recovered by now. I think you can go on to create a template for this. I hope there's no any longer issues. LuanCampSouza93 (talk) 18:02, 19 December 2023 (UTC)

@LuanCampSouza93: It has been some time; I'm sorry I was unable to attend to this. I checked now and the website seems to work well so I reinstated the template option to use |artist= and/or |title= t search the new database. I checked it on Hallelujah (Leonard Cohen song), The Wall, List of best-selling music artists and Whitney Houston and it seems to work. Please let me know if there are any problems. Otherwise, this is  Done. Also pinging FireDragonValo who I'm sure will be happy to know this is available. Muhandes (talk) 10:17, 1 July 2024 (UTC)

Also pinging Dhoffryn who has been using this website. Two clarifications. First and maybe obvious, this change enabled the same feature on {{Certification Table Entry}}. Second, you must not specify |certweek= for this feature to work. For backwards compatibility, Specifying |certweek= reverts to the much older style of citation, e.g., "Spanish single certifications" (in Spanish). Productores de Música de España. Select Canciones under "Categoría", select 2024 under "Año". Select 1 under "Semana". Click on "BUSCAR LISTA".. I hope this feature is helpful. --Muhandes (talk) 10:38, 1 July 2024 (UTC)

Since no one made any further requests, this is  Done. --Muhandes (talk) 14:32, 12 August 2024 (UTC)

Italian certs

About discographies whose include FIMI certs, I think would be needed a little change in command on the phrase: "Select "Tutti gli anni" in the "Anno" drop-down menu. Select "Artist" in the "Filtra" field. Select "Tutte le sezioni" under "Sezione"." Where is "Select "Artist"", it could be "Type "Artist"" instead, similar to BPI certs command, for example, that's "Type Artist in the "Search BPI Awards" field and then press Enter", due to manual search needed in this case. LuanCampSouza93 (talk) 01:48, 31 December 2023 (UTC)

@LuanCampSouza93:  Done. It's been eight months since you made this request, but better late than never. Muhandes (talk) 14:27, 12 August 2024 (UTC)

Shrinking certification units - Portugal edition

With Coldplay's song Yellow and a 5× platinum level song reaches 200,000 units in Portugal (at least that was what was shown in the table). But with a new 6× platinum level it then shrinks down to 60,000. How does that even work? How does something that it took to accumulate 200k then it gets lowered to 60k? Dhoffryn (talk) 20:44, 11 July 2024 (UTC)

@Dhoffryn: This query belongs in Template talk:Certification Table Entry, not here. As for the question itself, {{Certification Table Entry}} calculates the certified amount for Portugal based on |certyear=. If you think that's wrong, I suggest you open discussion at Template talk:Certification Table Entry and say how you think it should work. Muhandes (talk) 14:20, 12 August 2024 (UTC)

Actual subpages are still on the redirected name

@IHelpWhenICan renamed the template from "Certification Cite" to "Cite certification" back in 2011, with the reason to "Makes the template easier to find", but forgot to also move a bunch of sub-templates to the same spelling, which actually made them harder to find: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:PrefixIndex/Template:Certification_Cite/ . This should probably be fixed, along with all the uses in the code: [1]. Solidest (talk) 17:03, 5 September 2024 (UTC)

 Not done for now: I don't understand the reasoning behind this. Moving the main template made sense, as it helped editors familiar with the 'cite XXX' format, and that goal was achieved. However, moving the sub-templates requires considerable effort due to the many code changes and testing involved, so there would need to be a solid reason for it. These sub-templates are only used by experienced template editors, not regular editors. Has there been a request from template editors to make this change for convenience? As one of the few actively working on this, I doubt it. Muhandes (talk) 07:24, 6 September 2024 (UTC)

The reason behind this is you can't hide working pages behind redirects, because they disappear from the page structure and become invisible through the "page info / number of subpages" functionality. This is a problem for any editor on Wikipedia. You have to do a lot of extra work to detect their existence. And it actually breaks the coherence of pages on Wikipedia. And it's a problem for me personally when I synchronise data between Wikipedias in other languages. And I'm making this request as an actual regular template editor, even though I don't have a relevant role (which absolutely should not diminish the status of this request). I've provided a list of pages where automatic replacements should be made, which won't cause any difficulties and won't require additional tests, because these replacements are trivial. So I don't know what reasonable problems and other reasons there could be here, except for unnecessary unjustified fear. Solidest (talk) 10:18, 6 September 2024 (UTC)

These subpages should have been moved with the parent page, with redirects left behind. The template should continue to work just fine. Having a redirect with subpages is not a good situation. Unless there are valid objections, I'm happy to make these moves. Ping me in a day or two if I forget. – Jonesey95 (talk) 22:38, 7 September 2024 (UTC)

To editor Jonesey95: and CC editors Solidest and Muhandes: I'm not objecting, and you're right about the fact that the moves should have been made along with the parent; however, I do see editor Muhandes' point. It's been since 2 April 2011 that the situation has been this way, nigh onto 14 years, and several editors to include Muhandes have been using these subpage templates just as they are all these years. It's quite possible that moving them now would actually be more disruptive for editors who, like Muhandes, are "actively working on this". Frankly, I was going to go ahead with these moves and the other required fixes, but editor Muhandes' NDFN response did give me pause. Jonesey95, I was a cat whisker away from deactivating the edit request template when you responded. P.I. Ellsworth , ed. ^{put'er there} 03:17, 8 September 2024 (UTC)

I appreciate that Jonesey95 has decided to take on the task of fixing this, and it looks like we could end this discussion, but: "quite possible that moving them now would actually be more disruptive". I absolutely do not like such reasoning when it comes to templates and code. Code is not esoteric magic, and all 'possibilities' there are simply excluded by inspecting and understanding the code, and making the solution after. And I literally provided that solution by giving a link to the search results, which includes all the cases where we need to change the direct links in the code. We could swap namespaces to fix absolutely every page (11 summarily). There is nothing disruptive (from a technical side) about renaming pages, which is clear to any experienced template editor like you. And I don't understand what individual editor problems are we talking about? Changing links in bookmarks in the browser or what? This is also not the reason for not fixing such obvious problems like this one. And I'm also not in favour of the ‘no one has paid attention to this problem for 13 years’ approach, implying that this might be a reason to leave it as is. Well, you do realise that it can't be a reason and that's not how things are done on Wikipedia. Solidest (talk) 19:24, 8 September 2024 (UTC)

Not crazy about your tone, but I do understand your concerns. I don't expect you to change your mind, nor do I particularly care how this turns out (as I wrote above, I'm not averse to the page moves and edits). If the editors who use these pages would find it disruptive for them to be moved and edited, that concerns me. That is all. Heaven knows, it's happened to all of us who've been here long enough to have been affected in some adverse way by other editors' "improvements". Essentially, tho', this probably ain't no biggee either way. P.I. Ellsworth , ed. ^{put'er there} 11:03, 9 September 2024 (UTC)

Sorry if the tone sounded over the top - I really didn't mean it that way (and rewrote the text several times to avoid it). But in general I'm glad you understood my point. That even if we have a regular template editor, it's not a good idea to ignore requests from other editors when they are clearly aimed at improvement, even when everyone is already used to the current erroneous state of things. Any obvious improvement is better than habits. And I myself have stepped aside in similar cases when it came to my habits (and I didn't like it at the time). Anyway, thank you for your opinion, Jonesey95 for moving it - everything seems to work fine, and Muhandes for the huge input on these templates (I regularly migrate your changes to other wikipedias and appreciate those updates and your willingness to respond each time). Cheers. Solidest (talk) 15:33, 9 September 2024 (UTC)

This move is  Done. I updated template code to reflect the new name. I may have missed something, but things appear to be working. Please ping me for any necessary cleanup. – Jonesey95 (talk) 12:10, 9 September 2024 (UTC)