Talk:Yahweh

Can't edit but have a question regarding translation

Yeah I am just curiouse because "adonoy" is translated as "my lords" and while "lords" is acceptable (as ooposed to "masters") i'm pretty sure the word is singular, meaning the translation should be "my lord" CarryingTheMeme (talk) 19:12, 13 March 2024 (UTC)

Shouldn't that be Adonai, as the plural form of Adon (lord)? That is the etymology of the name Adonis. Dimadick (talk) 21:51, 13 March 2024 (UTC)

You mean in the third paragraph? I just noticed it too and thought it was a mistake, so I came to this Talk page to bring it up. But then I looked a little more into it and I think it's just the "royal we". See here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Names_of_God_in_Judaism#Adonai ("Adonai" אֲדוֹנָי literally means "my lords". There's also "Adoni" אֲדוֹנִי which means "my lord", but that's something different. Notice how the "Adonai" has a kamatz ("a" sound) beneath the "n", whereas "Adoni" has a hiriq ("i sound"). According to Wiktionary https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/אדוני#Hebrew , the two words have different etymologies. "Adonai" is "Adoni-" + the "-i" suffix, whereas "Adoni" is "Adon" + the "-i" suffix.) 2601:49:8400:26B:5C37:1DD:4D2F:4D1 (talk) 23:58, 6 May 2024 (UTC)

 Done Normally in Biblical Hebrew the singular possessive suffix is -i and the plural possessive is -ai but certain kinds of words (some names of God, terms for qualities like "youth" or "blindness", etc.) are given an abstract grammatical plural. GordonGlottal (talk) 19:08, 12 May 2024 (UTC)

Liberty University

Hey @Potatín5 I saw that you sitecited Liberty University as a source here. However, I'm not entirely sure it is a reliable source.

I think it's inclusion here goes against Wikipedia:Reliable sources. CycoMa1 (talk) 14:44, 27 April 2024 (UTC)

Issue with earliest biblical literature

Here, I have a slight issue with a certain claim in this article.

It is in regards to the claim about what Yahweh was like in earliest biblical literature.

That claims uses the Song of Deborah, buts here is the issue with that claim. The Wikipedia article on Deborah says this

The Song of Deborah is commonly identified as among the oldest texts of the Bible,[12] but the date of its composition is controversial. Many scholars claim a date as early as the 12th century BCE,[3] while others claim it to be as late as the 3rd century BC. Some hold that the song was written no earlier than the 7th century BC.[13]

Yes I know the source also talks about the Song of the Sea. But even the article on this says this:

The Song of the Sea is noted for its archaic language. It is written in a style of Hebrew much older than that of the rest of Exodus. A number of scholars consider it the oldest surviving text describing the Exodus, dating to the pre-monarchic period.[3] An alternative is that it was deliberately written in an archaic style, a known literary device.[4] As such, proposed dates for its composition range from the 13th to the 5th century BCE.[5]

CycoMa1 (talk) 06:13, 3 May 2024 (UTC)

I also forgot to mention that the source also talks about the Blessing of Moses. Which according to that article it was written somewhere between the 11th to 6th century.CycoMa1 (talk) 18:09, 3 May 2024 (UTC)

I understand your compunctions here, but the claim in this article is not a synthesis of sources. Rather, it comes directly from the Oxford History of the Biblical World, a pretty solid source. As such, I would support the wording as it currently stands, but reasonable minds may certainly differ. Cheers. Dumuzid (talk) 18:50, 3 May 2024 (UTC)

I am basically saying I feel like the claim goes against WP:VOICE. To me this just seems like an view point by one or a few scholars.

Or there is a possibility that some things in this article are going against WP:DUE.

I don't know there is so many contradictions.CycoMa1 (talk) 20:54, 3 May 2024 (UTC)

Or maybe I'm just overanalyzing.CycoMa1 (talk) 21:22, 3 May 2024 (UTC)

By the way, I have more to say. I am just waiting for other people to reply.CycoMa1 (talk) 21:21, 3 May 2024 (UTC)

So, my sense is that the dating of the Song of Deborah as the oldest (or at least a very old) part of the bible is the prevailing theory in the academic community. Assuming I am correct about that, then I think our wording is just fine, but I am happy to look at evidence to the contrary! Cheers. Dumuzid (talk) 22:39, 3 May 2024 (UTC)

That the archaisms in the texts may be a stylistic choice (instead of an indication of date) is not surprising. But in the absence of references to external events or geographic locations, I am not certain on what the modern estimations of dates are based on. Dimadick (talk) 07:14, 4 May 2024 (UTC)

Child sacrifice to YHWH or Molech by Isreal?

The article states;<<A number of scholars have also drawn the conclusion that infant sacrifice, whether to the underworld deity Molech or to Yahweh himself, was a part of Israelite/Judahite religion until the reforms of King Josiah in the late 7th century BCE.>>. To this I must ask, why? YHWH in the Torah and Tanakh rejects and is angered by child sacrifice whether to Molech or himself multiple times. A few examples being;

”“Say to the Israelites: ‘Any Israelite or any foreigner residing in Israel who sacrifices any of his children to Molek is to be put to death. The members of the community are to stone him. I myself will set my face against him and will cut him off from his people; for by sacrificing his children to Molek, he has defiled my sanctuary and profaned my holy name. If the members of the community close their eyes when that man sacrifices one of his children to Molek and if they fail to put him to death, I myself will set my face against him and his family and will cut them off from their people together with all who follow him in prostituting themselves to Molek.“ ‭‭Leviticus‬ ‭20‬:‭2‬-‭5‬ ‭NIV

”He sacrificed his own son in the fire, practiced divination, sought omens, and consulted mediums and spiritists. He did much evil in the eyes of the Lord, arousing his anger.“ ‭‭2 Kings‬ ‭21‬:‭6‬ ‭NIV

So why do certain scholars think otherwise? To me it just seems like baseless speculation. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 31.217.165.152 (talk) 10:12, 8 June 2024 (UTC)

This is not a place where we second-guess the whole guild of mainstream Bible scholars, nor are we required to give you adult education. tgeorgescu (talk) 10:27, 8 June 2024 (UTC)