Talk:Alfa Romeo/Archive 1

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Decent article - some comments

This article contains a lot of useful information and some great images. Some really good work has been done to bring together the information. Editors involved should be commended. However, it does now need some attention to develop it and make it more readable and useful for the general reader. The layout and organisation would benefit from tidying up in order to present the information in a manner useful to the general reader, and to aid navigation through the article, and loading of the article on slow devices. Currently it has a lot of minor sub-sections which consist of little more than a sentence or two, and there are a lot of images, which can make loading slow. There are also some statements that need sourcing to give them credibility, otherwise they look like editorial opinion. And some sections are inclined to be lists rather than explanations. The media section is rather long. The lead needs building per WP:Lead. These are just quick observations of matters that are distracting from the generally good content. SilkTork *YES! 10:16, 12 September 2010 (UTC)


Dubious content

The media section is unsourced, and reading through it, much is rather trivial. I am moving the entire section here for editors to look at and decide what to use in the article, and then to source it before placing it back. SilkTork *YES! 22:31, 14 September 2010 (UTC)

Media and public profile

In Italian the owner of an Alfa Romeo is an "Alfista", and a group of them are "Alfisti". Alfa Romeo is sometimes worshipped by its owners, and many models have become cultural symbols. There are many thriving Alfa Romeo owners clubs and Alfa Romeo Model Registers.

Some notable owners include Beppe Carletti (Musician, Retailer - 2000 Spider), Jeremy Clarkson (Motoring Journalist - GTV6), Roger Moore (Actor - GTV6) and Michael Schumacher (F1 Driver - Giulietta Super).

The hosting team of the popular British motoring interest show Top Gear often state that a car enthusiast must have owned an Alfa Romeo at some point before they can be considered a true petrolhead (meaning an extreme car enthusiast).

Post-war Italian cinema is replete with Alfa Romeo's, often as a result of police dramas were Alfa's are official vehicles (and remain so to this day), as well as contemporary comedies and romances, where Alfa's are taxis, and 'playboy' character vehicles.[citation needed]

In American cinema and television, where characters find themselves in Italy, Alfa Romeos, particularly the Spider (due to The Graduate, see below), dominate. Other models have featured, though sporadically.

Most on-screen appearances of Alfa Romeo's have tended towards popularly considered 'beautiful' models (such as the Spider), and 'handsome' types (such as the 116 Giulia, and Alfetta Sedan).[citation needed]

The Graduate

Certainly the most famous appearance and presence on screen of any Alfa must be the 1967's hit film The Graduate, starring Dustin Hoffman, Katharine Ross and Anne Bancroft. It gave worldwide celebrity to the "Spider". The Spider depicted on screen had its engine note accurately recorded, and electrical foibles (the non-functional fuel gauge) reproduced. On the strength of the Spider's appeal, Alfa Romeo continued sales of the Spider into the 1990s, and a special edition named the Alfa Graduate was available in the United States in the 1980s.

The entire set of scenes featuring the Spider in the Graduate were replicated in satire by Mike Myers in his comedy, Wayne's World 2. The Spider here cuts out Simon & Garfunkel's "Mrs. Robinson" when passing under a bridge (implying music being played on a radio), but still has a non-functional fuel gauge - causing it to ultimately grind to halt (fortunately at the correct church!)

The Spider was designed by Pininfarina; derived from several design studies dating back to the late 1950s, the Spider is believed to be the last design on which Battista Farina personally worked.

The Italian Job

Alfa Romeo Giulia 'Panthers' appear as Polizia cars in the 1969 movie The Italian Job. During the chase in Turin each suffers an unpleasant, yet humorous demise. Memorable 'deaths' include breaking down on top the roof of a gently sloping building dome, and being washed away by the flow of water from a weir while chasing a Mini.

James Bond

Alfas have featured on-screen in three James Bond films.

Blue Polizia Alfettas are seen in For Your Eyes Only, haring up a snowy mountainside in one shot.

One of the most prominent roles was when James Bond (Roger Moore) stole and then drove a graphite GTV6 in 1983's Octopussy. In the scene it is pursued by two Bavarian BMW 5-series police cars.

A pair of black Alfa Romeo 159 Ti cars appeared in the opening scenes of the 2008 James Bond film Quantum of Solace. They featured in the car chase with James Bond's Aston Martin DBS V12 around Lake Garda, Italy. Noteworthy attention was paid to the auditory qualities of the Alfa's, which have the characteristic 'Big V-6' sound on-screen. The same film also features a Carabineri Alfa 156. Rene Mathis also has an Alfa, a white 2600 GT coupe.

Other films
  • Michael Corleone (Al Pacino) in The Godfather drove a black Alfa Romeo 6C while in exile in Sicily. This was actually the car that was booby-trapped and explodes with Apollonia, his Sicilian wife, in it. Mary Corleone (Sophia Coppola) drove a red spider in "The Godfather, Part III".
Other television shows
  • In the television crime film series Ein Fall für Zwei ("a case for two", over 250 episodes made so far), the leading actor Claus Theo Gärtner, who plays the role of the private detective Josef Matula, has always been driving Alfa Romeo, starting from Giulia Super to the latest Alfa Romeo models.
Top Gear

In recent times, the BBC Series 'Top Gear' has had the strongest effect on the popular conception of the Alfa Romeo. Presenters Jeremy Clarkson, Richard Hammond and James May insist that nobody can call themselves a true petrolhead until they have owned one. Numerous Alfas have had screentime devoted to them over the course of the TV program's run so far. Highlights include:

Literature

In the first printing of Dan Brown's novel Angels & Demons, the members of the Swiss Guard all drive Alfa Romeo sedans (albeit inaccurately referred to as 'Alpha Romeos' throughout the book).

In the Ian Fleming novel Moonraker, James Bond becomes involved in an impromptu race with a young man driving an Alfa Romeo while he pursues Hugo Drax. This scene in the novel results in the death of the young man, the destruction of his car, and the eventual destruction of Bond's Bentley Mark IV.

Top Gear

The Top Gear comment that "nobody can call themselves a true petrolhead until they have owned an Alfa Romeo" is due to the notion that a person who buys an Alfa is doing it because they love the styling and the sporty images, and are prepared to accept the unreliability and the depreciation for the pleasure of the looks - which is the definition of a car geek or petrolhead. Most people buy cars because they are practical. Petrolheads buy cars for the love of cars - even when the purchase does not make sense. If there are no reliable sources which sum that up for us, we have to take care how and if we incorporate Top Gear's Alfa Romeo comments. Quoting directly from a WP:Primary source out of context is inappropriate. It would be worth searching carefully for a RS source which comments on Top Gear's Alfa Romeo-petrolhead theory. SilkTork *YES! 23:03, 14 September 2010 (UTC)

The term "petrolhead" is not related to an alleged high consume of gasoline by the car? I don't know the Alfa Romeo cars, but i thought the meaning was related to a low mileage/liters. GustoBLSJP (talk) 22:57, 12 May 2011 (UTC)

I believe Jeremy Clarkson's comment of "nobody can call themselves a true petrolhead until they have owned one" is a bit tongue-in-cheek. In the episode of Top Gear where they put three different Alfas (a Spider, a GTV non-Spider, and a 75) through a series of challenges, I'm not sure any of the three hosts of the show is going out of their way to show any positive feelings toward their cars. I think somehow this needs to be mentioned in the article or the bit of Jeremy's quote needs to be removed, as I'm pretty sure the quote is sarcasm at best. Figment79 (talk) 11:33, 10 October 2014 (UTC)

Henry Ford

The Henry Ford quote is featured prominently but it only rests on Ugo Gobbato's say-so, which makes it not very reliable. Statements of the kind are a topos in autobiographies. The phrase hardly sounds like Henry Ford. Why should he have said it? Was he wanting to grease up Gobbato? I suggest that instead of giving it such a prominent position it ought to go in the body of the text and be prefaced by "according to Gobbato himself Henry Ford said ... The quotation rests solely on Gobbato's testimony, for what it is worth." — Preceding unsigned comment added by Campolongo (talk • contribs) 17:50, 12 June 2012 (UTC)

So you think that he is telling lies? come on. The whole story is here you can read it http://www.afra.it/english/storia6.asp there is also reason for that saying -->Typ932 T·C 19:27, 12 June 2012 (UTC)

Yeah, on the whole I really think he was telling lies, also known as drawing the long bow. The site you refer me to rather confirms my opinion. The Ford motor company calls the story “implausible and apocryphal”, which is a polite way of saying they regard it as a whopper. It’s certainly very uncharacteristic of Henry Ford. The site you refer us to – apparently a promotional site selling Alfa Romeo parts – only tells us we have the word of Gobbato Senior and Gobbato Junior for this tale, and the latter got it from the former. So what does that prove? Then remember this is meant to be an encyclopedia, written by people who are rational and realistic and not as gullible as all hell. In fact since it's unconfirmed I think if we use it as all it should be put in the body of the text and it should be said the only source for this statement was Gobbato himself, and the Ford company called it "apocryphal", if we can source that statement. As I say, this is meant to be an encyclopedia. Not a promotional mag.Campolongo (talk) 11:53, 13 June 2012 (UTC)

Of course Ford is saying that, what else they could say than denying. I think that its reliable source, you have to believe something, there isnt such thing as 100% sure thing. Just use google and find other references, its also said in the Borgeson Alfa Romeo book, I think thats enough to keep it on the article -->Typ932 T·C 15:21, 14 June 2012 (UTC)

The head of Alfa Romeo, Gobbato comes back from America where he met Henry Ford among others and announces "Henry Ford says whenever he sees one of the cars made by my company he tips his hat.” Should we believe him? Here are three reasons for skepticism. 1) It’s unsubstantiated – Gobbato is the only source for the story. 2) It’s self-serving. Who benefits by the quote? Gobbato. Who vouches for its truth? Gobbato. 3) It’s hardly characteristic of Ford in its humility, as the Ford company apparently stated. Of course you can’t prove Ford said it or didn’t, but skepticism is definitely called for in an encyclopedia. The very fact that people contacted the Ford company asking for verification shows doubts existed - they wanted confirmation. Keep it by all means, as you say, but don’t stick it up there, outside the text, as if it were a verified quote, something Ford said in a book, a letter or in conversation with some disinterested person who could be relied on to report it accurately. Use it in the body of the text but with the usual caveat ("unconfirmed, possibly apocryphal"). That’s how an encyclopedia works.Campolongo (talk) 07:29, 15 June 2012 (UTC) I propose to remove it from its present conspicuous position, put it in the body of the text with a brief comment that the Ford motor company said the comment was "apocyrphal". — Preceding unsigned comment added by Campolongo (talk • contribs) 13:01, 16 June 2012 (UTC)

AR should NOT be characterised as a maker of 'expensive sports cars'. Entirely inaccurate.

Near the start of this article it says that Alfa Romeo 'has a reputation for building expensive sports cars'. This is nonsense, even if it might be referenced. Alfa has always produced sedans as well as sports cars, and many or most of the sports cars it's produced are NOT and were not expensive, at least in relative terms. Some of the most famous Alfa models have been mass-market sedans such as the Alfasud. It is simply inaccurate to characterise the company in this way. This statement should be removed. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 203.176.96.14 (talk) 10:46, 4 July 2014 (UTC)

Article trivia

The section under the title Media and public profile on this article basically seems a collection of trivia and pop-culture references. The WikiProject Cars convention about this says: "(...) mention of pop-culture references should be strictly limited to cases where the fact of that reference influenced the sales, design or other tangible aspect of the vehicle. It is not sufficient to note that the vehicle had a major influence on its owner or some movie or TV show—such facts belong in the article about the owner, movie or TV show." By this convention, I think most of the section content is either misplaced or it simply has not a place in Wikipedia. I see there was a previous attempt to reduce the section, but it is still oversized and plenty of pointless content. I propose trimming the content to meet Wikipedia guidelines. Thoughts? --Urbanoc (talk) 11:42, 30 June 2015 (UTC)

Honestly I'd remove the section entirely, save for the Graduate part which I'd move to the Spider page. Maybe a quick reference to Octopussy on the GTV's page too.
A well-written section on Alfa Romeos in films would be nice (dealing with their role in poliziotteschi etc.) but as it is this list of appearances simply does not belong here. —Cloverleaf II (talk) 14:29, 30 June 2015 (UTC)
I tend to agree. I will wait until tomorrow to allow more input on the issue. --Urbanoc (talk) 18:45, 30 June 2015 (UTC)

Luxury cars maker

I undid a revision by an IP that removed the "luxury vehicles" bit in the infobox. I consider that, at least by now, Alfa Romeo is intended as a luxury car manufacturer, aimed at competing with the likes of Audi and BMW as part of Marchionne's market offensive (see, for example, here). --Urbanoc (talk) 12:20, 30 June 2015 (UTC)

Quite a trivial part the one regarding the Police cars!

I am Italian, and really fond of Alfas. I have never heard this thing of the nickname "inseguimento". Ever. Google doesn’t help either. it’s not referenced it, so it can only be made up information, and for this reason I deleted it. If anybody wants to read the Italian section, it doesn’t say anything about it either: https://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alfa_Romeo#Le_Alfa_Romeo_in_dotazione_alle_forze_dell.27ordine — Preceding unsigned comment added by Look-aa (talk • contribs) 19:10, 8 September 2015 (UTC)

[ˈalfa roˈmɛːo])

Can someone look at this pronunciation? I don't think this is right. This shows a stress on the ro'. It should be on the me:. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Longinus876 (talk • contribs) 16:07, 13 July 2016 (UTC)

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Alfa Romeo Company

Alfa Romeo is still a registered company as mentioned in the article? On alfaromeo.com I could not find any reference about that.--Yammilly (talk) 19:46, 4 March 2013 (UTC)

Here is a link, which clearly shows that Alfa is rather a division of Fiat. http://www.alfaromeo.com/com/#/copyright--Yammilly (talk) 19:54, 4 March 2013 (UTC)

Cant see that link, there has been no press release any company changes lately. The company was last restructured in 2007 as you see in the Fiat Spa article. "The Fiat Group Automobiles S.p.A. companies include: Abarth & C. S.p.A., Alfa Romeo Automobiles S.p.A., Fiat Automobiles S.p.A., Fiat Professional and Lancia Automobiles S.p.A.. Ferrari S.p.A. is 90% owned by the Fiat Group.[1]" -->Typ932 T·C 03:05, 12 March 2013 (UTC)
Right. It's not a division of Fiat, it's a company of the Fiat Group. There's a difference. Dino246 (talk) 08:55, 14 March 2013 (UTC)

References

  1. ^ "Group Structure". Fiat. Retrieved 13 July 2011.

History of the Alfa Romeo Badge

The contribution to this topic is perhaps a little too brief. I am providing here a summary of Appendix I 'The Alfa Romeo Badge' from Peter Hull's excellent book "Alfa Romeo: A History", published by Cassell (London) 1964, reprinted 1969.

[The historical information provided in the Appendix was supplied by the Education Department of the Commune of Milan, and is based on the source material of Cfr. G. Bologna's 'Lo stemma del Comune di Milano e le sue porte' in Citta di Milano published in May 1959]

'The emblems on the Alfa Romeo badge are those of the City of Milan and of the great Milanese family of Visconti, who became the Dukes of Milan in medieval times. On the left is a red cross on a white background. One story says that the origins of this go back to the First Crusade when, in 1096, many Milanese soldiers were amongst the Lombards who went to the Holy Land led by Giovanni of Rho. They decided that the red cross should be their emblem, and wore it on their flag and on their chests in the hope that it would distinguish them from other soldiers. The white background was adopted when they found they had to wear white shirts over their armour to prevent it becoming hot in the sun.

On the right of the Alfa Romeo badge are the arms of the Visconti family, which afterwards became the recognised coat of arms of the Duchy of Milan. There are at least five legends purporting to explain the origin of the serpent:

1) It represents the snake which the Lombards used to wear around their necks as a lucky charm. 2) It is the dragon which, at the beginning of the fifth century AD, molested the town and surroundings of Milan, and which was attacked and killed by Uberto, squire of Angera, the founder of the Visconti family. 3) It is the viper which twisted itself around the head of Desiderio, the King of the Lombards, without hurting him. He is also believed to be an ancestor of the Visconti family. 4) It is the viper which sprang out of the helmet of Azzone Visconti (died 1339) at the battle of Altopascio (1325), and slid down his body, leaving him unharmed. 5) It represents a badge worn by Ottone Visconti, son of Eriprando, at the First Crusade in a victorious duel against a Saracen leader named Voluce.

However, the City of Milan also has a claim to being the originator of the coats of arms rather than the Visconti family.

Milan's claim is that the viper represents the bronze serpent, said to be the one Moses was commanded to lift up in the camp of the Israelites, which was brought back to Milan from Constantinople (Istanbul) by Archbishop Arnolfo II (c998-1018), and erected on a column in the church of Sant' Ambrogio, where it can still be found today. The figure in the mouth of the giant serpent is a red Saracen, which was added when the Milanese victors returned from the First Crusade in 1099. This version of the story says that the City of Milan gave the Visconti the privilege of using this badge in recognition of their heroic deeds against the Saracens in the East, and when the Visconti became the Dukes of Milan the City put this badge beside its own red cross.'

Ds1994 (talk) 20:17, 18 June 2010 (UTC)

The badge section in article could be fixed and use this as reference --Typ932 T·C 20:41, 18 June 2010 (UTC)

Cabriolet VS Roadster

I believe Spiders are Roadster and not Cabriolets, as they are two-seaters. Netrat_msk (talk) 18:21, 29 February 2008 (UTC)

History

(part moved from main article here) There was a company named Anonima Lombarda Fabbrica Automobili in 1904, and one prototype was built with constantly variable transmission. I can not find any direct link between this company, nor any evidence that what became Alfa Romeo started out buying the corporate "shell" of the defunct company, but I find it interesting and curious that another company had the same exact name at an earlier date.

Have a look here http://www.alfaromeo.com/cgi-bin/pbrand.dll/ALFAROMEO_COM/history/history.jsp?BV_SessionID=@@@@0263088031.1202384776@@@@&BV_EngineID=ccciadedfgfmlhhcefecejgdfkhdfjk.0&categoryOID=-1073750515

Its Alfa Romeo's history on their own site, and does mention both the original acronym and the buyout by Nicola Romeo. Onesti (talk) 11:48, 7 February 2008 (UTC)

Well, I can say for sure, with reference to the most comprehensive research published on the matter (Duccio BIGAZZI. Il portello: Operai, tecnici e imprenditori all'Alfa-Romeo 1906-1926. Milan: Franco Angeli. 1988) that the official history on the Alfa site you quote is simply false. Ugo Stella certainly didn't buy out Darracq! He was appointed CEO of the SAID, then led the foundation of ALFA with Darracq still owning more than 50% of the shares of the new company. After Darracq left the ALFA ownership, it was still not property of Mr. Stella's group...Sportiva (talk) 09:26, 15 April 2008 (UTC)

Alfa in America?

The article states that Alfa Romeo will return to the US in 2007. While the 8c has gone on sale in the US, as this is a limited edition (just 60 are headed stateside) does it really count as the return of Alfa Romeo? Alfa Romeo plans to launch its mainstream cars in the US in the 3rd quarter of 2009...this isn't mentioned anywhere. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 91.142.234.48 (talk) 21:55, 21 December 2007 (UTC)

"Alfa Romeo's return to United States was confirmed on May 5 2006 by Fiat CEO Sergio Marchionne. It will begin in 2008, by selling the 8C Competizione. In late 2009, Alfa Romeo will release the 159, Brera, and Spider after they receive a mid-life styling and technical refreshening. It is anticipated that a year or two later will see the introduction of the Kamal SUV, 169, and possibly the B-segment Junior (as a competitor for the MINI Cooper). Alfa Romeos will be sold at Maserati dealers throughout United States.[7]"

its there...--— Typ932T | C  22:16, 21 December 2007 (UTC)

I wonder if this section is relevant. Plans for an US return have been so many times announced and subsequently discarded that I would rate any information about such an issue as highly unreliable, certainly not worth being mentioned in an encyclopedia. Now I won't edit the article on my own as this is an opinion of mine, but I would appreciate comments on this. Sportiva (talk) 09:36, 15 April 2008 (UTC)

The British Telegraph reported that the Fiat, do to sluggish Alfa sales in Europe, will not be bring the brand to the US. It also stated that there is no plan on to do 're-badging' for Alfa like there is for Lancia-Chrysler. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Twix2247 (talk • contribs) 02:29, 4 September 2010 (UTC)

it was old news... --Typ932 T·C 06:17, 4 September 2010 (UTC)

Make article better

I modified model listing section and corrected some links and footnotes. To remove "This article or section is not written in the formal tone expected of an encyclopedia article." it still needs some work. There could be also separate section for Alfas other production: aircraft engines, trucks, vans, buses and trolleybuses. In de wikipedia there is something if someone could translate it here (http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alfa_Romeo#LKW.2C_Busse.2C_Flugmotoren= --Typ932 13:35, 20 March 2007 (UTC)

Done --— Typ932T | C  08:30, 13 April 2007 (UTC)

All of the 170,000 or so Alfas that have been produced this year have been made in Italy. That applys for all markets. Most (the 147, 159, 159 sportwagon, GT: about 155,000 units) are made at the Pomgliano d'Arco factory in Napoli, the remaining 15,000 (Brera, Spider) are built by Pininfarina at their Canavese factory in Piedmont. The 8c will be made in Maserati's factory in Modena. As part of Alfa Romeo's plan to expand to 300,000 plus units by 2010, new factories are planned in China, and later, in the U.S. To my knowledge the only Alfa's to have been produced outside Italy were produced in South Africa, and only then for a short period during the 1970's.

156 was assembled in Thailand..--— Typ932T | C  22:16, 21 December 2007 (UTC)

Many other plants in abroad countries produced (or more precisely assembled) Alfas over the years: France (Paris, 1930s), Belgium (at the Imperia factory, 1950s), Spain (at the Fadisa factory, 1960s), Malaisia (1970s), Brazil (see FNM) are those arising from the top of my memory. You are right about SOuth Africa and Thailand as well. Sportiva (talk) 09:32, 15 April 2008 (UTC)

Right hand drive models

The article states that right hand drive models are all manufactured in South Africa but this is not so as Alfa Romeos in Australia are imported from Italy and always have been. The only South African model I can think of that was sold in Australia was the 105 model with an automatic transmission. I'm also sure that the Alfas destined for Japan are made in Italy too. Does someone have anything else on this? Coldheartedman 09:36, 7 February 2007 (UTC)

Public company?

Well about the infobox... Alfa is not quite a public company. It is now just a part of FIAT, which is itself a public company (but the Agnelli family sill own more than 50% of it). The Italian page says "A division of FIAT Auto since 1986" as the company type. Can somebody edit it here please? I down't know how to say that technically in English... Thank you! —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Andylong (talk • contribs) 10:14, 21 January 2007 (UTC).

Alfa Romeo Photo's

Please add some of the following photo's to wikicommons: http://marvin.linux-box.nl/cgi-bin/index.cgi?module=album&file=Cars/Palijs%20het%20Loo%202006 http://marvin.linux-box.nl/cgi-bin/index.cgi?module=album&file=Cars/Spettacolo%20Sportivo%20Alfa%20Romeo%202006 These galeries (especially the first) contain photo's of very special Alfa Romeo's including concept cars and pre-war racing cars.

Spam Links in Alfa Romeo pages

Some Alfa Romeo pages seem to be collecting Spam in the form of external links added purely to promote a certain site, increase traffic to that site, or to improve the sites ranking in search engine results. This is not just the main Alfa Romeo page, but the individual model pages as well. Some external links and sites are valid and often contain useful information. For example the Alfa Romeo UK site has an interesting history section, but others links seem to be pure spam. I've removed some of these, but need help to cleanup all the Alfa Romeo pages, as some links may have been added in good faith, and I'm a little bit reluctant to remove links from pages that I've not yet contributed to in any other way.

In some cases it might be better to add the {{Cleanup-spam}} Template and/or add a note on the Talk Page of that article or User to discuss the reason for the link, than simply remove the link.

But if we leave the links and do nothing, then we are helping the spammers and next time we do a web search for an Alfa Romeo topic and find mainly useless spam pages, we have only ourselves to blame. --Xagent86 23:25, 9 December 2006 (UTC)

An effective tool for those areas prone to spamming, is consensus for inclusion. Adding a tag such as this in the link section can help in assuring that quality links are added. Cant stop serial spammers, but you don't have to argue with them why it was removed.
<!-- ATTENTION! Please do not add links without discussion and consensus on the talk page. Undiscussed links will be removed. -->
--Hu12 08:31, 11 December 2006 (UTC)


Incomplete

Someone added "No mention of Alfa Romeo trucks, airplanes, appliances, and WWII Axis war effort" to the "Production"-paragraph, I replaced it with the {{Incomplete}}-Template. --SoWhy Talk 17:48, 12 August 2006 (UTC)

Models listing

Missing: Pre-war cars.

The models listings are not correct. The models listed from 2010 are not corect. We live in the year 2006, DOH!

Yeah what's up with that? An Alfa Romeo Brera II for example, what the ..? It probably will have a successor yes, but at the moment that's just guessing. And I can guarantee you that it will not be called "Brera II". I removed the models listed from 2010 and the 189. Nothing is decided about the 189 and I actually doubt they will ever build the Kamal, but again, that's guessing. LPJ 08:06, 7 July 2006 (UTC)

Is the model listing not better off going on a seperate 'List of Alfa Romeo Vehicles' page along with the timlines? qwertytam 01:38, 27 February 2007 (UTC)

Good start

The original author of this page had inline images from the Alfa website on them. Wikipedia has a policy against including inline images from other sites - its much preferred to upload them to the wikipedia using the link.

However, even assuming that was done, there is an issue about the copyright and trademark status of those images. Alfa owns the copyright on both - they both certainly fit into the definition of "artistic work" and there is no exception for advertising. Robert Merkel

Other than that, good start on the article.

Well..., let's do without. :-(
(just to explain why) Always considered that when the firm works so much in ads to have its logo everywhere, there is an evident lack of reserve on it. However, the first included image was the original 1910's logo, that is more than 70 years old, italian limit for copyright. So, half crime, but double regret :-)

The addition discusing the Dedion suspension is utterly wrong. The car in the reference uses a live axle, with a panhard bar. The dedion was found on early (pre-war) Alfa GP cars, and showed up again in the late 70s, on the 116 series cars starting with the Alfetta and followed by the GTV6, Milano/75, and SZ/RZ. Don't want to hurt anyone's feelings, but I'm going to delete that section.

I've removed :

"Since the 1960s, Alfa Romeo cars have a particular "fault": second gear (manual) is very hard to enter, so it needs the driver to pass just for a fraction of second through the neutral gear (both in acceleration or in deceleration). This manoeuvre, called the "doppia" or "double Débraillée" (double declutch), distinguishes real drivers from "Sunday" ones."

Why ? - this is a "double debrayage" , - what's described isn't a double debrayage, - the double debrayage has to be done with all unsynchronized gearboxes, Italian drivers know this because the early Fiat 500s had a fully unsynchronized gearbox - the Alfa have synchronized gearboxes but it's true that on the Guilia (but not on the Alfasud for instance) the second gear synchro didn't age very well, - you need this only to enter a lower gear no need to do this to enter a lower gear. Ericd 16:58, 19 Nov 2004 (UTC)

A Commons file used on this page has been nominated for speedy deletion

The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page has been nominated for speedy deletion:

You can see the reason for deletion at the file description page linked above. —Community Tech bot (talk) 12:06, 19 April 2019 (UTC)

I cant see any valid reason, also I cant see the picture that was deleted-->Typ932 T·C 14:50, 19 April 2019 (UTC)

LOGO: swallowing child/man OR birthing child/man ?

Apparently Museo Storico Alfa Romeo (Alfa Romeo Historical Museum) says the logo depicts a human emerging from the snake and not the other way around. This is supposed to represent the process of man reinventing himself . The following article discusses this and several other interesting tidbits of knowledge about the logo's history. I do not read Italian so I cannot verify the sources linked to in this article but hopefully this can help the editors of this article who are fluent in Italian.

* https://jalopnik.com/alfa-gives-us-the-official-line-on-whats-up-with-their-1627173581

172.88.130.119 (talk) 15:04, 28 September 2019 (UTC)

A Commons file used on this page has been nominated for deletion

The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page has been nominated for deletion:

Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. —Community Tech bot (talk) 17:36, 28 November 2019 (UTC)

New models for 2022-2026

Probably worth adding, but there's no information yet on what the models will be, with the exception of the Tonale in 2022.

Deepred6502 (talk) 07:07, 13 October 2021 (UTC)

Misleading section names

The article suggest that there are aircraft engines, marine engines, and aero-engines. So non-expert readers might think that the aero-engine is not the aircraft engine but completely different type of it, and not even a particular kind of the first. Otherwise aero-engines would be placed in a subsection of aircraft engines. If this level of communication satisfies you, than feel free to ignore my remarks. 85.193.211.12 (talk) 22:10, 17 May 2022 (UTC)

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