Talk:Aluminium/Archive 4

Archive 1

Archive 2

Archive 3

Archive 4

Requested move 14 April 2023

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: Withdrawn. Seems like everyone disagrees with this move, and the title was already made on a compromise. Snow close. (non-admin closure) Wikiexplorationandhelping (talk) 18:24, 15 April 2023 (UTC)

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Aluminium → Aluminum – "Aluminum" is the more common name, as shown with this ngram. Thoughts? Wikiexplorationandhelping (talk) 19:22, 14 April 2023 (UTC)

• Comment – While "aluminum" is definitely more common, the reason why it's located at "aluminium" is because of the IUPAC. Like, there's three elements with two region-centric names/spellings: "Alumin(i)um", "Sul[f/ph]ur", and "C(a)esium". The IUPAC established the standard that the British spelling should be used for "Aluminium" (and "Caesium") while the American spelling should be used for "Sulfur". Also, see MOS:SPELLING. Paintspot Infez (talk) 21:13, 14 April 2023 (UTC)
• Don't move This is a english-american spelling difference. Whichever whichever dialect has more prominence is always going to win the "more common" criterion. If that was sufficient argument for a move on its own the entire wiki would use American spelling sooner or later. I don't believe that's what policy prescribes. --Licks-rocks (talk) 21:19, 14 April 2023 (UTC)
• Oppose per MOS:ENGVAR / MOS:RETAIN / Licks-rocks / Talk:Aluminium/Spelling. —⁠ ⁠BarrelProof (talk) 22:14, 14 April 2023 (UTC)
• Oppose A compromise has been already hashed out at IUPAC and elsewhere long before Wikipedia existed. Attempting to defy it to restart the debate from scratch is not worth anyone's time. — Ceso femmuin mbolgaig mbung, mellohi! (投稿) 03:21, 15 April 2023 (UTC)
• Strong oppose per others. It's not an American element. See WP:ALUM for the clearly-specified WP standard based on IUPAC authority. DMacks (talk) 03:37, 15 April 2023 (UTC)
• Oppose per WP:ALUM (=MOS): IUPAC-defined spelling in chemical usage. -DePiep (talk) 05:25, 15 April 2023 (UTC)
• Oppose per WP:ALUM. ¹⁴¹Pr {contribs} 07:08, 15 April 2023 (UTC)
• Oppose per WP:ALUM per all the previous history. In ictu oculi (talk) 08:08, 15 April 2023 (UTC)
• Oppose - I think both me and future contributors to this RM will agree with the above points given here, especially I also agree with the WP:ALUM text given. Iggy (Swan) (Contribs) 12:19, 15 April 2023 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Semi-protected edit request on 28 April 2023

The "US/CA" is incorrect. When I was in school, our Periodic table of elements which I have in my room right now (Yes, I still hoard my highschool binder after grad 2018) has Aluminium spelt in the non-American (imperial/non-metric) spelling. People of the United States say/spell/measure things oddly (basically as a colonial/patriotic middle finger to a dead king), as a born & raised metric-using 182cm tall, 53kg Canadian I must submit our Country's refusal of Canada being falsely accused of using such an atrocious spelling such as "Aluminum" even though we hang out with enough Americans for most of us Canadian to utilise the American pronunciation without correcting eachother. You can assume the person who initially put CA in there was an American whiteknighting our grammar, eh? XGN CISCO (talk) 21:15, 28 April 2023 (UTC)

I agree that it isn't universally spelled aluminum in Canada, but I would suggest that it is in common usage. Canada often is split between British and American English, and I don't believe this is any different. The article doesn't imply (at least to me personally) that the ONLY spelling in Canada is aluminum, just that it is in common usage there. If there's somewhere that does suggest it's universal, I'd be happy to change that, though. Tollens (talk) 22:59, 28 April 2023 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 1 May 2023

Background/Evidence Hi! In the Etymology section, under Spelling, source #123 is cited for the line "In 1925, the American Chemical Society adopted this spelling"[In reference to Aluminum vs Aluminium]. Source #123, unfortunately, is not primary, nor does it cite a primary source. Source #129 makes a similar claim about the ACS 1925 thing, but is also A) Secondary, and B) Sourceless.

After doing my own digging, I have found the *actual* earliest use of 'Aluminum' by the ACS: in it's 7th issue, published in June 1879. After this, the ACS frequently accepts both -ium and -um, with, as far as I could find, no official publication on which it deems the 'official' spelling. In fact, the 1925 date seems like it might be made up anyway. The final use of Aluminium that I could find in the ACS journal database was in July of 1917.

So, even if some sort of decree was made in 1925 making -um the official alumin-suffix of the ACS, it was symbolic at the point anyway.

Requested Edit: Change this portion:

> By 1890, both spellings had been common in the United States, the -ium spelling being slightly more common; by 1895, the situation had reversed; by 1900, aluminum had become twice as common as aluminium; in the next decade, the -um spelling dominated American usage. In 1925, the American Chemical Society adopted this spelling.[123]

To

> By 1890, both spellings had been common in the United States, the -ium spelling being slightly more common; by 1895, the situation had reversed; by 1900, aluminum had become twice as common as aluminium. The final use of aluminium by the American Chemical Society was in 1917 Fordfraipont (talk) 18:58, 1 May 2023 (UTC)

 Not done for now: Contrary to your expectation, we prefer secondary sources and avoid original interpretation of primary sources on Wikipedia, even quite trivial interpretation! If you can find a secondary or tertiary source that supports the 1917 date, please link it and reopen this request. small jars tc 16:33, 4 May 2023 (UTC)

References

Semi-protected edit request on 19 October 2023

Change
> aluminum: /əˈlumənəm/

to:
> aluminum: /əˈluːmənəm/

Reason: Help:IPA/English specifically states that /u/ occurs only in unstressed positions. 2A00:1FA0:88F:AC2D:0:49:9156:3001 (talk) 21:17, 19 October 2023 (UTC)

 Done Philroc (talk) 08:27, 23 October 2023 (UTC)