Talk:Amory Lovins/Archive 1

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Archive 1

Lovins is stepping down as CEO

This article should probably reflect his new status. See Amory Lovins Stepping Down as Rocky Mountain Institute CEO. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 144.212.107.82 (talk) 16:42, 26 February 2007 (UTC).

Degrees

According to "Who's Who in America" Amory Lovins possesses a LOT of honorary degrees, but his only awarded degree is a masters of arts from Oxon at Oxford. He was never presented w a degree in physics.

I had a look at the RMI site and Amory is described there as "a consultant experimental physicist [who] has received an Oxford MA." Will go ahead and make the change in the first paragraph if that is OK. Johnfos 08:04, 22 February 2007 (UTC)

Change made. Johnfos 07:21, 24 February 2007 (UTC)

According to the article, Lovins received a Sc.D. from Bates College, which, according to a Wikipedia article, grants only undergraduate degrees. If this is an honorary degree, I believe the article should say that.

Beckmesser 14:00, 27 August 2007 (UTC)beckmesser

List of books: suggested merge

Suggest merge the list of his books with this main article--this is not all that long a list that it wouldn't fit fine here. DGG ( talk ) 13:15, 2 September 2009 (UTC)

Concern

I have numerous concerns about all the articles related to the Rocky Mountain Institute and its officers and their publications. All verge on the hagiographic and include huge amounts of quotes and superlatives. Bigdaddy1981 (talk) 23:41, 9 July 2008 (UTC)

I've moved the quotes to Wikiquote. Would you care to make some other improvements or just indicate where specific changes are needed... Johnfos (talk) 01:15, 10 July 2008 (UTC)

I will try to make time to do so. Bigdaddy1981 (talk) 22:07, 10 July 2008 (UTC)

In digging into Lovins' research I found a few critiques, then went to this article and found none listed. I think at least a mention of David Bradish's criticisms of his research would be good to include. He seems very thorough and reasonable in his criticisms: [1] This article by Robert Bryce addresses Lovins' failed claims, but does not contain many verifiable sources: [2] Hope that helps, sorry I don't have time to contribute more. 76.115.3.200 (talk) 02:56, 7 June 2009 (UTC)

If these are cited, Lovins' posted responses to them should also be cited. Could Bigdaddy1981 please specify the article titles he finds of concern?Coloradophysicist (talk) 20:52, 2 January 2010 (UTC)

POV tag

A POV tag has been added to the article, and I am opening up discussion here in the hope that we can get down to specific problems which can be worked on. Thanks. Johnfos (talk) 21:51, 4 January 2010 (UTC)

The primary problem is phrasing. There are a number of places where the article sounds more like a glowing biography than an encyclopedia article. The second sentence begins "His four decades of work spans and integrates..." this is a good example of problematic phrasing in this article. There are a number of other areas with similar problems such as the Rocky Mountain Institute section. --Leivick (talk) 23:50, 4 January 2010 (UTC)

Have made some quite substantial improvements, but feel free to make more yourself if necessary. Johnfos (talk) 00:22, 5 January 2010 (UTC)

I've just had a look at International Who's Who 2010 and Lovins has quite a long entry. In this WP article I think we are having difficulty capturing the many highlights of Lovins career without making the whole thing sound a bit over the top. Johnfos (talk) 17:38, 1 February 2010 (UTC)

Lovins a Physicist

I don't see that Lovins has ever worked as a physicist, or that he has anything but an honorary degree in the field, yet he is labelled as such. Does someone have a reference for this? FellGleaming (talk) 18:21, 12 April 2010 (UTC)

Lovins has been called an "American physicist" in the The International Who's Who 2010, a "consultant physicist" here and a "consultant experimental physicist" here. Johnfos (talk) 21:41, 12 April 2010 (UTC)

That's fine, thanks. However, regarding the removed cite tags, Lovins' bio is not a RS in this context (is self-published). Do you have another source for him consulting for "100 utilities" ? Given his background, it seems a bit unlikely. FellGleaming (talk) 22:16, 12 April 2010 (UTC)

Thanks. The Who's Who entry says Lovins has "briefed 19 heads of state and given expert testimony in 8 countries", and mentions the 29 books and 10 honorary doctorates, but doesn't mention "100 ultilities". Business Week refers to Lovins' "globe-trotting schedule consulting for utilities, auto makers, energy companies, and the U.S. military". The NYT has said: "Major companies like Shell, Coca-Cola and Texas Instruments do not always agree with Mr. Lovins, but they value his iconoclastic views enough to pay the Rocky Mountain Institute, the nonprofit consulting and research group he leads, up to $20,000 a day for his consulting services". He seems to be in high demand. Johnfos (talk) 00:13, 13 April 2010 (UTC)

If a check to Lovins will keep the RMI from twanging the company's public image by reporting them as environmentally irresponsible, it's well worth it. Anyway, I can well believe he's consulted for utilities, but the 100 figure was suspect. Lovins may have included a consortium count in that figure. FellGleaming (talk) 00:16, 13 April 2010 (UTC)

Sourcing

The article is now up to date per The International Who's Who 2011, which mentions that Lovins has provided expert testimony in eight countries, briefed 19 heads of state, published 29 books, has 10 hon. doctorates, etc. Johnfos (talk) 04:00, 20 February 2011 (UTC)

I don't consider The International Who's Who a reliable source, even if it is/were a legitimate "Who's Who". Even the best will print some information from the subject unless refuted. — Arthur Rubin (talk) 09:42, 20 February 2011 (UTC)

I gather you have had some personal experience with Who's Who and have participated in several related discussions at WP:RSN. Should WW be regarded as a WP:SPS? How would you regard Lovin's bio here? Are there any sources that you would particularly recommend for this article? Johnfos (talk) 18:43, 20 February 2011 (UTC)

I updated this to 31 books as recounted by Lovins himself at a public meeting in Berlin, 18 March 2016. RobbieIanMorrison (talk) 21:11, 18 March 2016 (UTC)

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Books

I just updated some of the books. Please let me know if there's a problem with the books update and why. Cam

No reason to include foreign-language editions of a book. Particularly no reason to add redlinks to the titles. — Arthur Rubin (talk) 17:12, 22 February 2011 (UTC)

I realize the list of books is useful, but the list of translations are already in the article about the book, and need not be in the article about the author. — Arthur Rubin (talk) 18:39, 22 February 2011 (UTC)

I updated this tally to 31 books as recounted by Lovins himself at a public meeting in Berlin, 18 March 2016. RobbieIanMorrison (talk) 21:11, 18 March 2016 (UTC)

The first sentence says This is a list of books which are authored or co-authored by Amory B. Lovins, or which include a foreword by him After having rad the list, I do not know which of the listed books are written (or co-authored) by him - and which books only have a foreword written by him. After 7 years and 50K edits in Wikipedia, this is the first article I have 'met' containing books with forewords. Please name them in a separate section - or remove them from this list. (sry, my English got rusty) --Neun-x (talk) 14:24, 28 December 2016 (UTC)

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'Guru' and big-oil interests business man?

https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2007/01/22/mr-green Environmentalism’s optimistic guru Amory Lovins by Elizabeth Kolbert. I don’t do problems” is how Lovins once put it to me. “I do solutions.”

Lovins makes his living as the C.E.O. of [XYZ energy advocacy company, and hey look it's located in guitarist, John Denver's old haunt, yo how 'rad' man]...it now employs more than fifty people

Employing fifty people to promote your brand of clearly nonsensical 'soft-energy', would fairly obviously mean, there is something of a major conflict of interest when say actual accredited scientists or agencies come along, as they routinely do and publish things that as a 'guru', would know, could upset the apple-cart of their business? Does it not? Something that is a little concerning.

Life as, the fossil fuel funded, 'soft-energy' guru

In 1969 oil tycoon and largest land owner in the US Robert Orville Anderson, contributed $200,000 in personal funds to launch the self-described 'radical environmental group', Friends of the Earth.

By 1971—Lovins had come under the influence of David Brower, the charismatic founder of Friends of the Earth, and he went to work for the organization in London.

In 1971, Lovins dropped out of college for the second time to become a full time employee of FOE. In October 1976, Foreign Affairs, a publication owned by the oil industry-linked Council on Foreign Relations, published Energy Strategy: The Road Not Taken?, which is described as a landmark essay that introduced Lovins to the world as an energy strategy guru.

In Top 11 Reasons to Oppose Nuclear Power, Once Amory Lovins manufactured some arguments against nuclear power in the early 1970s, this tactic became the anti-nuclear power argument

Though no mention to his source of income in the seventies, work for an organization set up by an oil tycoon and beginning of Lovins as the anti-nuclear spokesman, shall be made in this article?

Boundarylayer (talk) 09:33, 23 January 2019 (UTC)