Talk:Baator

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Avernus Article[edit]

Below I've pasted the additional information that was in the Avernus (Dungeons & Dragons) article that I've merged into this one. As I'm unsure of what a 'hierarchy' represents and the fact that I think this is a lot of pointless information that in no way adds to the understanding of Baator or Avernus I've not included it into the main article. Wikipedia shouldn't be a repository of D&D information, these articles should explain the planes as a fictional concept within a game, not be a replication of every point ever published from source books. If anyone wants to develop this into some meaningful and useful points, feel free to add it to the article. -- Lewis 16:22, 11 March 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Hierarchy[edit]

In first edition Dungeons & Dragons, this was the hierarchy of Tiamat:

Amudscias - 29 companies of abishai (DR75)
Malphas - 40 companies of abishai (DR75)
Goap, pit fiend - 3 companies of erinyes

Outcasts[edit]

A number of outcast Archdevils roam the layer of Avernus. These include:

Nergal, "The Bringer of Pestilence and Fever" (DR75)
Bist, the "Hellcat" (DR75)
Caim, outcast (DR75)
Armaros, "The Resolver of Enchantments" (DR91)
Azazrel, "The Serpent" (DR91)
Cahor, "The Deciever" (DR91)
Dagon (DR91)
Kochibel (DR91)
Malarea (DR91)
Nisroch, "The Eagle" (DR91)
Rumjal (DR91)

(NOTE: The being Gargoth described in Dragon 91, is actually the demigod Gargauth from the Forgotten Realms. See Powers and Pantheons for more.)

Takhisis/Tiamat[edit]

I'm not totally positive about this, but aren't Takhisis and Tiamat the same deity? "Tiamat, the five-headed deity of evil dragons, stands watch over the way to the next layer. ... A number of godly realms exist on Avernus, including Draukari, realm of kobold deity Kurtulmak, goblin deity Bargrivyek's deceptively titled realm of The Peacable Lands, and Abthalom, the Nether Reaches, realm of dragon-queen goddess Takhisis." This part refers to them as seperate entities. -themaelstorm

Some 1e sources list them as being the same being, but 2e and 3e sources make a clear distinction between the two of them in-game (though out of game yes, Takhisis was inspired/ripped from Tiamat). Shemeska 04:56, 27 March 2007 (UTC)[reply]

3rd edition?[edit]

The first line of this article specifies this as being 3rd edition. The nine hells are very much existant in 2nd edition as well adn even had it's own 2nd editio book "The Guide To Hell". The line should be reworded. Cheesecake42 (talk) 18:38, 18 September 2008 (UTC)[reply]