Talk:Balangiga massacre

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Redirect target[edit]

This is a WP:BRD discussion.

I have reverted this WP:BOLD edit which changed the target of this redirect from Battle of Balangiga to Battle of Balangiga#Retaliation with an edit summary saying: refining to the retaliation section, where the massacre occurred. I presume that this was done in the conviction that the historic action deserving to be referred to as the Balangiga massacre was the action described in the March across Samar (the {{main article}} for that section). I believe that this needs discussion here to establish consensus. I don't want to offer this as a suggestion, but I will comment that perhaps an alternative would be to make the article named Balangiga massacre into an explanation that this designation can be taken to refer to either, and explaining the reasons why this is so. Wtmitchell (talk) (earlier Boracay Bill) 08:40, 26 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

As a Filipino, I'd always thought that the "Balangiga massacre" referred to the retaliation by the American soldiers. I didn't know that the American context referred to the Filipino surprise attack on American troops. I suggest that we take this to WP:RFD, so that we can have a wider consensus on this. pandakekok9 (talk) Junk the Philippine anti-terror law! 03:40, 29 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]
I have no objection to that. I'm sure there are citeable sources referring to the 1901 attack on the U.S. troops garrisoning Balangiga rown, covered by the article now named Battle of Balangiga (following this move) as Balangiga massacre. If there are citeable sources using that term to refer to what is covered by the March across Samar article, it seems to me that WP:DUE comes into play here, and that what I've suggested above would be in keeping with that part of the WP:NPOV policy.
I'm not a Filipino, not an academic, and not a credentialed historian. I've lived in the Philippines but I was not educated there; I have the impression that what you say that you've always thought is what is taught in secondary schools in the Philippines. I've read here and there about this, and have noted discrepancies in what I've read about Waller's "March". That WP article about it summarizes discrepancies at one point, with supporting cites, as follows:
The exact number of Filipino civilians killed by US troops will never be known, but an exhaustive research made by a British writer in the 1990s put the figure at about 2,500; Filipino historians believe it to be around 50,000.[1] The rate of Samar's population growth slowed as refugees fled from Samar to Leyte,[2] yet still the population of Samar increased by 21,456 during the war. A great loss of life is not supported.[3]
There is a similar passage in the Retaliation section of the article about the attack. Wtmitchell (talk) (earlier Boracay Bill) 12:25, 29 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

References

  1. ^ Dumindin, Arnaldo. "Philippine-American War, 1899-1902". Retrieved 2008-03-30.
  2. ^ US Senate Committee Hearings "Affairs in the Philippine Islands" Feb 3, 1902, Vol 3, page 2341
  3. ^ Bulletin of the American Historical Collection, April–June 2004, Volume XXXII, page 65
(addad) Links to mentions of some few of the many sources supporting the use of the term Balangiga massacre to refer to the incident now at the article named Battle of Balangiga can be seen here. I did not turn up any sources using that term to refer to the reprisal in a quick web search, but I presume that some -- perhaps print-only sources published in the Philippines -- must exist in order to have prompted the renaming of that article. Wtmitchell (talk) (earlier Boracay Bill) 12:23, 30 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Move discussion in progress[edit]

There is a move discussion in progress on Talk:Battle of Balangiga which affects this page. Please participate on that page and not in this talk page section. Thank you. —RMCD bot 18:01, 12 June 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Bold infobox edit[edit]

[Here], I have WP:BOLDly made a major edit to the infobox. The reason for the edit is founded in the observation that the First Philippine Republic, the former mother organization of Lukban's guerilla operation in Samar, had ceased to exist after the capture of Emilio Aguinaldo in March, his pledging allegiance to the U.S. in April, and calling for a "complete termination of hostilities" on April 19. At the time of this incident in September, then, Lukban headed a rogue guerilla force in Samar that was not a part of a larger organization. Perhaps this deserves more elaboration than the footnotes in the article currently give it.

Discussion? Wtmitchell (talk) (earlier Boracay Bill) 01:23, 18 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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