Talk:Bettie Page/Archive 1

Page contents not supported in other languages.
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Archive 1

Popularity

This article needs more work, but I've sat on it long enough.

Some kind of discussion is needed to explain why Bettie Page is popular, even a simple quote from someone knowledgeable about the history of the pin-up. There should also be a link or two to the fan pages about Bettie.

I was more interested in supplying the information what happened to Bettie since she left the limelight, since this is particularly hard to find with a Google search, unless you throw in keywords like ``arrest" or ``mental institution." In other words, you have to know the answer to find it.

And I want this to be NPOV; I have no interest in libelling Bettie Page, but there's more to her life than that she posed for pictures for a while, then went on with her life. -- llywrch 19:54 Mar 22, 2003 (UTC)

  1. The character Betty in the Rocketeer is based on Bettie; Disney redubbed the character Jenny when making the property into film. So mentioning artist Dave Stevens would be nice.
  2. Greg Theakston's Betty Pages are worth mention too.
  3. Buck Henry was a member of the Manhatten Camera Club - I believe he took 3D color photos of Bettie.
  4. Bettie was a cover girl as well.
  5. Robin Leach was one of the first to track her down but he respected her privacy.
- Sparky 08:13, 23 Apr 2004 (UTC)

Hugh Hefner was besotted by her. Barbi Benton was his love interest for awhile because she resembled Bettie in her prime.

The artist Olivia represented by Robert Bane Galleries has done several series of prints on The Tennessee Tease. There's a good link in the article.

I don't think the 3-D can be scanned with any hope of success. I tried and failed. Olivia did take a polaroid of Hef, my cousin and me -- and I do know the comic book personalities. But there are things that should be secrets. - Sparky 03:47, 16 Jun 2004 (UTC)

I've heard she graduated from a bible college

I've heard she graduated from a bible college.

Neither Peabody College or Vanderbilt University are Bible colleges. Page did become very religious after she ended her modelling career. -- llywrch 8 July 2005 20:09 (UTC)
She did attend various bible colleges after she quit modeling, now I cannot speak to if she graduated or not. [1][2]FLJuJitsu 15:01 15 Sept 07

More on health

Being a Southern California resident, I have heard word of Page's hospitalization due to injuries inflicted, in part by herself, reportedly symptomatic of mental defect in the forms of depression and paranoia. Her injuries have, for the time being, left her paralyzed.


GA Re-Review and in-line citations

Members of the Wikipedia:WikiProject Good articles are in the process of doing a re-review of current Good Article listings to ensure compliance with the standards of the Good Article Criteria. (Discussion of the changes and re-review can be found here). A significant change to the GA criteria is the mandatory use of some sort of in-line citation (In accordance to WP:CITE) to be used in order for an article to pass the verification and reference criteria. Currently this article does not include in-line citations. It is recommended that the article's editors take a look at the inclusion of in-line citations as well as how the article stacks up against the rest of the Good Article criteria. GA reviewers will give you at least a week's time from the date of this notice to work on the in-line citations before doing a full re-review and deciding if the article still merits being considered a Good Article or would need to be de-listed. If you have any questions, please don't hesitate to contact us on the Good Article project talk page or you may contact me personally. On behalf of the Good Articles Project, I want to thank you for all the time and effort that you have put into working on this article and improving the overall quality of the Wikipedia project. Agne 05:21, 26 September 2006 (UTC)

Miss New York 1951 Runner-up?

The low-budget film "Dark Angel: Bettie Page" claims Bettie was the runner-up in the 1951 Miss New York beauty pageant. Can anyone provide any information/confirmation of this? Jca2112 20:10, 1 October 2006 (UTC)

Slaughterhouse 5

"Montana Wildhack, a character from the novel Slaughterhouse Five by Kurt Vonnegut, may have been modeled after Bettie Page" - any evidence for this? BarryNorton 18:36, 31 December 2006 (UTC)

GA Review

As per the Good Article review filed on this article, it has been delisted in a 4 to 0 vote, for lack of being well-referenced, dramatic writing style, smallish lead, and a trivia section which isn't very good. Review archived here: Wikipedia:Good article review/Archive 14 Homestarmy 13:39, 8 February 2007 (UTC)

Cleanup and linked article creation

I'll lend a hand to this article and do some cleaning. I've also found copies of some of the movies in her filmography, so I'll be making pages for them as well. Help is appreciated. DasBub 04:23, 28 June 2007 (UTC)

Notability

This article skips straight from her graduating to the "revival" in interest of her. I have no idea why she is famous, beyond a vague notion of bondage based on the picture of her and other context clues. Is she a porn star? A feminist? A white slave? Someone familiar with her biography needs to fill in this MAJOR gap. [[User:|User:]] 07:29, 3 April 2006 (UTC)Dapper

I expanded the article to include more about her time out of the spot light and some of what she's been up to the last few years. I would like to return the article to GA status and feel that gathering a full biography is a good place to start. User:FLJuJitsu 14:00 21 Sept 07 —Preceding signed but undated comment was added at 18:00, 21 September 2007 (UTC)

More Cleanup

The "The Years out of the Spotlight" section was just atrocious - full of grammatical and spelling errors, going between present and past tenses, and chronologically out of order. I've cleaned this section up and fixed the errors. 72.185.43.62 07:15, 26 September 2007 (UTC)

Ambiguous sentence

Under the heading "The years out of the spotlight", near the end is a sentence that ends, "...photographer Bunny Yeager swindled the filmmakers out of releasing pictures of Page unless they paid her." The nearest film mentioned is The Notorious Bettie Page. Does this mean that Yeager refused to release pictures of Page for the film unless she was paid? If so, "swindled" seems like the wrong word. What about, "...and photographer Bunny Yeager refused to release pictures of Page for the film until she was paid." --KSnortum (talk) 06:35, 8 January 2008 (UTC)

Declining health

I've been hearing/reading gossip-y reports that, sadly, Bettie has been steadily declining in health since Dec 07. See here and here. I haven't found any substantial news report of this so it may or may not be true, but apparently she is struggling with pneumonia and a kidney infection. I certainly hope this is not true, but maybe someone with knowledge of this could incorporate this news into the article? 70.189.71.101 (talk) 03:13, 23 January 2008 (UTC)

Isn't the image copyrighted?

Thumb See notes on the image description page. Could be fair use, couldn't possibly be public domain, I wouldn't think. [[User:Dpbsmith|Dpbsmith (talk)]] 12:13, 21 Aug 2004 (UTC) I don't know where this image came from, but I would agree with you, it does not look public domain. Dlloyd 21:38, 21 Aug 2004 (UTC) Added DVD cover "Image:Bettie Page DVD cover.jpg" Dlloyd 22:49, 21 Aug 2004 (UTC)

I scanned it from my copy of Glamour magazine which is now long out of print. And cited fair use as it was no longer available for purchase. - Sparky 18:21, 10 January 2006 (UTC)

- the old link to the image went dead. I feel this is a good size as it is not even decent quality for a wallpaper and thus won't hurt the artist Dave Stevens who may resume selling it as a poster sometime again in the future. Glamour International went belly up by 1993. Is everything kosher now? - Sparky 17:28, 14 April 2006 (UTC)

Please let me know if we can return the cartoon to the article now. - Sparky
image is fair use at this size. - Sparky (talk) 14:15, 29 January 2008 (UTC)
But it's not Bettie Page! It's a cartoonist's drawing of Page. I don't mean to disparage Dan Stevens' work, but is this *really* the only image of Page that can be used fairly? Agreed, it is a nice drawing and while it does *resemble* Page, I don't see how it would benefit the article, as it would be *only* image. In fact, I'd go so far to say it's potentially detrimental. Just MHO. --buck (talk) 15:11, 30 January 2008 (UTC)

Related to Bronk & Suvari?

New user Junemarlan keeps adding

"Page was a great-aunt of comedian/writer Benjy Bronk and a cousin of the mother of actress Mena Suvari."

to the article, citing an issue of the defunct Jacksonville Journal from 1987. It's been removed several times, either as trivial[1] or as dubious.[2] I'm interested to know whether there's a consensus on inclusion and whether anyone has an alternative source for this info. -- Skarl 15:35, 12 December 2008 (UTC)

Seriously. What do you think? The gratuitous mention of any Howard Stern related character (outside specific Howard Stern related material) is highly dubious. Even if the article (which is conveniently non accessible) did mention some relationship, it is indeed trivial. How does the mention of an obscure writer on a show obsessed with just such incongruous mentions add to the article? Caligulathegod (talk) 16:06, 12 December 2008 (UTC)
Seriously? I didn't know what to think, which is why I opened up a discussion on this talk page.
The editor concerned has been warned of 3RR, with an additional explanation of the rule. If they choose to add the info in again today, I suggest they be reported. -- Skarl 16:27, 12 December 2008 (UTC)
I have just reported User:Junemarlan for a WP:3RR violation at Wikipedia:Administrators' noticeboard/Edit warring – ukexpat (talk) 18:46, 12 December 2008 (UTC)

Benjy is famous for messing around with Wikipedia! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 216.77.154.39 (talk) 16:17, 12 December 2008 (UTC)

Thank you for pointing that out. It's good to know that some editors are aware that Stern's show is not so high-profile outside the US. -- Skarl 16:27, 12 December 2008 (UTC)
Part of the shtick of the Howard Stern Show is prank calling television and radio shows, gratuitous mentions of same, etc. Can we have a limited lock on the page to prevent new users from editing? This person has started creating new accounts to vandalize more. Caligulathegod (talk) 16:33, 12 December 2008 (UTC)
If more socks/IPs turn up to do bad things to the article, a request at WP:RPP should do the trick. -- Skarl 17:11, 12 December 2008 (UTC)

Cause of death

Sources disagree regarding whether she died of a heart attack or pneumonia. This article states she had both, but is not clear if it was the MI, pneumonia, or both, that actually caused her death. Can there be some clarification, other than the MI deaths category? P Cezanne (talk) 20:08, 12 December 2008 (UTC)

There is probably no way of knowing, this soon after her death, exactly which of her medical conditions caused her death -- Foetusized (talk) 23:38, 12 December 2008 (UTC)

Length of career

Would it be worth noting in the article that she sadly spent longer in the "career" of being a mental health institution inmate than as a model? From the article she spent about six years as a model, but nine or ten years as an inmate. One wonders if she would have avoided if she had not been a model, or if the psychological burden of the government hostility pushed her over the edge. 89.242.157.247 (talk) 14:44, 22 December 2008 (UTC)

Short answer: No. Long answer: No, being hospitalised is a result of a medical condition and is not a career. – ukexpat (talk) 17:31, 22 December 2008 (UTC)

Acute schizophrenia

Someone contested that this notion exists. This textbook should make it clear that it is a commonly used terminology. (Davidson's principles & practice of medicine, 2006, ISBN 0443100578, page 243). Xasodfuih (talk) 05:49, 4 January 2009 (UTC)

Images

I suggest that the image of Bettie herself (video cover) be moved up in the article to near the top, and the cartoon based on her moved down to around where it is mentioned in the text of the article. Thoughts, objections? -- Infrogmation 01:23, 31 Dec 2004 (UTC)

As no one has objected, I have done so. -- Infrogmation 15:21, 28 Jan 2005 (UTC)

The photograph on this page was taken by Art Amsie ca. 1956, but the tag underneath refers to her Playboy centerfold appearance in January 1955. Obviously, this is not the photo that appeared in Playboy, in which she is nude except for a Santa hat. That photo can be found in Karen Essex and James L. Swanson, Bettie Page: The Life of a Pin-Up Legend, page 141. Jim Deutsch (talk) 18:46, 31 December 2009 (UTC)

Bettie's hometown, childhood abuse

A recent LA Times profile about Bettie Page says she was born in Jackson, Tennessee, more than 100 miles southwest of Nashville (about an hour northeast of Memphis). It also discusses her early family life, saying that she was the oldest girl among six children and Bettie disclosing that her father molested all three of his daughters.

http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-me-bettie11mar11,0,4194244.story?coll=la-home-headlines

The site that touts itself as the "official" Bettie Page site (http://BettiePage.com) lists her birthplace as "Nashville, TN" -- not Jackson (as the above user stated) nor Kingsport (as the article states). I think the article should reflect her "official" site's information. Agree or disagree? --TiffyBeth 09:58, 16 July 2006 (UTC)
Both the official site and Playboy.com state Nashville, so I'm inclined to run with them. RandomEcho 13:47, 5 March 2007 (UTC)
Everywhere I've read states her birthplace as Nashville, Tennessee. I've changed the article to reflect this and added a citation. Kaldari 18:26, 4 April 2007 (UTC)

Someone changed her birthplace to Kingsport in two of the three places it is mentioned, so I switched them back to Nashville - Foetusized (talk) 05:26, 28 December 2007 (UTC)

Re: abuse: several news articles (including NYT obit) state that her father molested her and her sisters, but nothing in the article about this. Has there been a discussion about it and I'm not seeing it? 165.189.169.190 (talk) 18:37, 12 December 2008 (UTC)

I'd always heard she was from Kingsport- dating back even to before the internet and wikipedia. Then again, I was born in Kingsport. Any way we can verify this? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 91.89.51.191 (talk) 12:45, 16 March 2010 (UTC)

Well, Googling for
"bettie page" kingsport
gives lots of hits, some supporting Kingsport and some not. As per the comments above, it's probably best to stick with Nashville, as listed in the official sites. Best, CliffC (talk) 18:21, 16 March 2010 (UTC)

"Pornography"

Current version statement "In late-1940s America, "camera clubs" were formed to circumvent laws restricting the production of nude photos. These clubs existed, ostensibly, to promote artistic photography; but in reality, many were merely fronts for the making of pornography..." is extremely misleading. Integral to current definition of "pornography" is portrayal of explicit sexual activity. 1) Most of these clubs never were involved in creating anything more than fairly mild erotica. Erotica as a creative form and a legal definition predates the 1950s. The definition of pornography during the 1950s was NOT as clear as the postal inspectors tried to insist, and court rulings of the time make that clear. 2) Bettie Page never was photographed in explicit sexual activity as far as is known, nor was being a pinup girl unacceptable for serious actresses of the 1940s and 1950s. She was not a porn star, even by the standards of the times. Suggesting she was is very misleading and revisionist. UC232 (talk) 03:09, 22 February 2011 (UTC)

Conversion to Xianity

Correct me if I am wrong but wasn't she born Xtian? so wouldn´t it be more apropriate to say she became more "religious" or "born again"? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.72.241.193 (talk) 21:25, 8 September 2008 (UTC)

Agreed, saying she "converted" to christianity suggests that only certain fundamentalist sects are actually christian. She was raised and practiced christianity before she became born again. UC232 (talk) 03:09, 22 February 2011 (UTC)

The article contradicts itself regarding her missionary work. In the third paragraph, it claims she "served as a Baptist missionary in Angola." Later (under the heading of "Years out of the Spotlight," it states that "she attempted to become a Christian missionary in Africa, but was rejected for having had a divorce." I believe that the latter is correct. There are no references in any of her biographies to her ever visiting Africa; nor I can find that claim anywhere on [3], which is the citation given. Jim Deutsch (talk) 18:59, 31 December 2009 (UTC)

Angola is not mentioned in the cited source (all mention of her conversion to Christianity has been removed from the official bio), and this contradicts other sources. I'm making the change to the lede, and cite a different source -- Foetusized (talk) 14:58, 8 February 2010 (UTC)

Inaccuracy: Kefauver Senate hearings

The US Senate committee actually known as the Kefauver Committee was another one investigating organized crime, and was officially known as the Senate Special Committee to Investigate Crime in Interstate Commerce. The hearings which targeted pornography, erotica and the corruption of minors were not part of Kefauver's main career foci, i.e. organized crime, monopolies etc. Oops editing to sign UC232 (talk) 03:30, 22 February 2011 (UTC)

Corrected for verified actual name of "Kefauver Hearings". UC232 (talk) 05:33, 8 August 2011 (UTC)

Naked Picture

Is there any real reason to show a picture of her topless? You can find that on a Google search. There's no real reason to have her naked body in this article 99.190.231.3 (talk) 19:57, 14 September 2011 (UTC)BeaBryant

Because it is an iconic image of her appearance as a Playboy centerfold. Because it provides some balance in presenting the modeling that she did, to go with the bondage photo above it. Because Wikipedia is not censored. -- Foetusized (talk) 12:58, 15 September 2011 (UTC)
It's also rather tame by modern standards. And to be blunt, it's what she was known for. ←Baseball Bugs What's up, Doc? carrots→ 13:04, 15 September 2011 (UTC)

BeaBryant, I refer you to http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:What_Wikipedia_is_not#Wikipedia_is_not_censored 64.201.203.3 (talk) 17:54, 26 October 2011 (UTC)

Referring to NOTCENSORED is not an answer. The question was "Is there any real reason for the nude photo?" To answer with NOTCENSORED amounts to saying "The reason we posted the photo is because we can." In actual fact, there has not been a good reason listed here. Out of curiosity, I checked the pages for several other Playboy Playmates and found no nude photos. Showing her in the nude doesn't exactly clarify anything about her, especially since there are heaps of photos of her from playboy that are not nudes. Frankly, it looks like the reason this particular photo was chosen (and is being defended) is to push the limits of what people can get away with under NOTCENSORED. Eventually, the Jenna Jameson page (which, like other playboy models and porn stars, has no nude photos) will have a close up of her being penetrated, just "because we can." Rugbyhelp (talk) 13:38, 7 November 2011 (UTC)

File:Betty Page in Bizarre Magazine.jpg Nominated for Deletion

An image used in this article, File:Betty Page in Bizarre Magazine.jpg, has been nominated for deletion at Wikimedia Commons in the following category: Deletion requests January 2012
What should I do?

Don't panic; a discussion will now take place over on Commons about whether to remove the file. This gives you an opportunity to contest the deletion, although please review Commons guidelines before doing so.

  • If the image is non-free then you may need to upload it to Wikipedia (Commons does not allow fair use)
  • If the image isn't freely licensed and there is no fair use rationale then it cannot be uploaded or used.

This notification is provided by a Bot --CommonsNotificationBot (talk) 02:35, 15 January 2012 (UTC)

So who took the nude photos?

If Klaw never photographed Bettie nude, where do all the nude photos of Bettie from that period come from? Other photographers who just happened to photograph her in the same attire she wore for Klaw, and posed in the same locations? Are they all fakes? My impression was that she also posed nude for Klaw but was never photographed nude with a man -- and never in any type of sexual activity. Perhaps those of you who are experts in this area can fill in the blanks. Thanks. {71.22.47.232 (talk) 11:02, 22 January 2012 (UTC)}

File:Bettie Page in Bizarre Magazine.jpg Nominated for Deletion

An image used in this article, File:Bettie Page in Bizarre Magazine.jpg, has been nominated for deletion at Wikimedia Commons in the following category: Deletion requests January 2012
What should I do?

Don't panic; a discussion will now take place over on Commons about whether to remove the file. This gives you an opportunity to contest the deletion, although please review Commons guidelines before doing so.

  • If the image is non-free then you may need to upload it to Wikipedia (Commons does not allow fair use)
  • If the image isn't freely licensed and there is no fair use rationale then it cannot be uploaded or used.

To take part in any discussion, or to review a more detailed deletion rationale please visit the relevant image page (File:Bettie Page in Bizarre Magazine.jpg)

This is Bot placed notification, another user has nominated/tagged the image --CommonsNotificationBot (talk) 10:52, 19 March 2012 (UTC)

Measurements

The official Bettie Page website gives her measurements as 36-23-35 (http://www.bettiepage.com/facts/index.html) which seems more correct than what the Wiki article currently has. 32" is probably an under-bust measurement. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 98.77.241.114 (talk) 19:53, 23 June 2012 (UTC)

Bettie or Betty

which is it? Family Guy Guy 12:21, 29 June 2006 (UTC)

It's Bettie. She was born Betty, but changed to Bettie. Don't know why.... - Lauren —Preceding unsigned comment added by 208.252.25.30 (talk) 19:35, 11 December 2008 (UTC)

According to Robert Foster, The Real Bettie Page, page 9, it was "Betty Mae Page, according to her birth certificate, but when she became old enough to write, the spelling changed to Bettie." Jim Deutsch (talk) 18:37, 31 December 2009 (UTC)

She probably did it to make herself stand out from all the BETTY's back in the day 162.213.159.204 (talk) 19:07, 20 March 2014 (UTC)31jetjet

Bettie is very private but - this is a transcription of a radio show ...

(I suggest mining the below to enrich the article) - Sparky

Transcription from Nashville Citysearch’s Bettie Page Live Chat

Nashville Citysearch’s Bettie Page Live Chat, held September 23, 1998 at 8:00 PM

Karen Essex (moderator): Welcome! My name is Karen Essex. I’m sitting here with Bettie – she’s excited to get started. I wrote Bettie Page, The Life of a Pin-Up Legend. Bettie, why don’t you say hello to the fans?

Bettie Page: Hello.

Karen Essex: Is there anything you wish you had done in your life, that you didn’t accomplish?

Bettie Page: I wish I had gone back down to Los Angeles after the screen test I had taken with 20th Century Fox flopped. I wish I had been a movie star. I had this opportunity with Jack Warner and I regret I didnt’ go back to LA. I had to go back to Nashville with my husband when he came back from the war.

I also regret that I was unable to have children. I wanted to have two boys and a girl. The doctor said I had a hormone imbalance so I was unable to have children. I did marry a man with a couple of boys and a girl, but the children’s mother ruined the marriage over jealousy.

Stacy asks: Bettie – how did you get into bondage photos?

Bettie Page: The only person I did bondage for was Irving Klaw and his sister Paula. Usually they would shoot four or five models every Saturday. He wouldn’t pay for the regular pictures unless we did some bondage. So I did bondage shots to get paid for the other photos.

Bill Maxwell asks: What kind of movie would you like to be in?

Bettie Page: I would like to be in Errol Flynn’s swashbucklers. He and Burt Lancaster, when they were young.

john foley asks: Are you still active?

Bettie Page: I have a goal to live to be 100+ and be in as good health as possible. If I have to bed-ridden I don’t want go on. I have bought every book on longevity and studied them and trying to do it. Just the thought of being 100 and being able to move around would be wonderful.

kevin w asks: What was the event that made you decide to leave the spotlight to live in exile.

Bettie Page: All this hogwash about me disappearing and not contacting other people. I didn’t isolate myself, I just thought there were too many pictures of me out there. I decided I wanted to teach which was what I was trained to do in the first place.

Sexy Sadie asks: what was the best advice you were ever given?

Bettie Page: To have more pictures taken outdoors. In the water and on the beaches. They said I was happier then and I was. And I was. I like being outdoors. I like to go cavorting in the nude in the forests. It is just another world. To take sunbaths in the nude.

Karen Essex: Do you think that the photos taken of you outside- cavorting, romping .. are the best ones?

Bettie Page: I think so, especially Bunny Yeager’s pictures. I wasn’t too fond of her style shooting. She wouldn’t let you pose.

Karen Essex: Have you ever consider being a blond?

Bettie Page: Yes, my younger sister was a blond until she was about 15 and then she lightened her hair. All her life she had blond hair and it looked good on her in the late 1950s I decided to try it and it was a disaster with my sallow skin it looked awful. I looked like a freak. I cut it off and wore a wig. Never again.

Ivanovich asks: Bettie, out of all the books written about you, which is your favorite? And which is the most accurate?

Bettie Page: Your book Karen (laughs). Life of a Pinup Legend. Karen Essex did most of the writing and interviewing and stuck to what i said. She didn’t embellish. She quoted what I said and that is what I like in the book.

Romana Machado asks: Has the jealousy of other women been a recurring difficulty in your life?

Bettie Page: Yes I guess it has. I guess among models there is a lot of jealousy. I was Queen of the Food Industry in 1951 and the girl who came in second called me names.

Karen Essex: There are gentlemen Bettie’s age in Nashville whose wives get very angry if they mention Bettie’s name.

Henry Rosenthal asks: Can you tell me anything you’ve learned about love?

Bettie Page: I just know it is a delightful feeling to be in love and everyone should be in love once. Especially when couples are together 40 or 50 years like my brother Jack and his wife Gladys. They still call each other dear and honey. I wish I had had that.

ACE asks: Ms. Page do you keep your hair black still? if not when was the year you stopped?

Bettie Page: No, I stopped coloring my hair in October 1978. I was no longer working as a secretary, I was no longer working out in public. I didn’t color my hair, it is grey now. In fact I’m worried I’m losing it. Big gobs come out. Used to be it took me two hours to dry my big gob of hair.

Don Goddard asks: Who are your heroes and inspirations?

Bettie Page: My favorite actress of all times is Bette Davis in Dark Victory. I have seen it 6 or 7 times and I still cry. My second favorite is Singing in the Rain with Gene Kelly, it is very happy. My third favorite is Errol Flynn in Captain Blood. I also admire Billy Graham. If ever there is a man of God it is Billy Graham. I counseled at the Crusades. I would counsel 19 girls during the crusades. He is a real man of God and still is. I admire the man very much.

EricT asks: Would you recommend posing nude to a young want to be actress?

Bettie Page: If you don’t flaunt yourself around in front of people. I don’t think God disapproves of nudity. After all Adam and Eve were in the garden without clothes. But I don’t think you should flaunt yourself. I never thought I was degrading myself when I was posing nude.

Mike Peterson asks: Do you think as a society we are too permissive about sex, too uptight about it, or just about right?

Bettie Page: Yes I do, I think it is a shame that so many girls and even older women that will go to bed with every Tom Dick and Harry that they meet. I think you should be in love with someone. Sex is a part of love. You shouldn’t go around doing it unless you are in love with them.

Sideshow Bennie asks: Were you ever a hootchie dancer? Did you ever work the carnival circuit? There was a carnival dancer in the 60′s named Bettie Page – you, perhaps?

Bettie Page: No, I was never a hootchie dancer in a carnaval. I don’t even know what a hootchie dancer is. I think they mean a wiggle dancer. I like to go to carnivals though.

Sexy Sadie asks: What is the fondest memory of your time in the public life?

Bettie Page: I guess just posing on the beach and in the water for Bunny and other photographers. I was very happy doing that and carefree and playing in the water and the beach.

demonica asks: Is it true that Ms. Yeager makes you pay for prints of your own pictures?

Bettie Page: Bunny Yeager is the stingiest woman God ever placed on the face of the earth. When I started posing for her she had been a pin up model herself. I posed for her 2 or 3 hours at a stretch. I posed for her for nothing. She said she would pay me when the photos sold but I never saw a penny. She has sold books, bought a house and she wouldn’t even give me one free picture for my book. She said “Bettie Page has to pay for them like everyone else!”

Shooter McCay asks: What really happened with Estes Kefauver?

Bettie Page: Irving Klaw was accused of pornography and never even did a nude shot of a woman. Sometimes we had to wear two pairs of panties so no shadow would show and nipples had to be covered completely. There was a story about a young boy killing himself because of my photos. They were going to make me testify against him. They made me go down to the courtroom from 9am until 1am the next night with one sandwich and no one told me the courtroom was cleared and everyone went home. No one told me. They were a bunch of dirty louses. I told them I would never testify to this. It ruined Irving’s life all because of what they did to him.

Karen Essex: The government hounded Irving Klaw and they never had a case against him.

Bill Maxwell asks: Will we ever see a picture of you now. Even if you make it to 100?

Bettie Page: No, I don’t think my fans want to see me old and fat. I’ve got to get another 20-25 lbs. off somehow–remember me as I looked when I was younger. I get sad when I see my favorite movie stars when they’re old. Who wants to see Jack Lemmon and Walter Matthau now as the Odd Couple? Jack Lemmon is a fan of mine.

StacieHerndon asks: Bettie, do you wear glasses, and if so, what do they look like?

Bettie Page: No, I’ve been nearsighted all my life. In school, I wondered why I wanted to sit near the blackboard, but my eyes never got any worse. When I was driving, I had to have glasses for night driving. With all my supplements and vegetables, I think my vision has improved. I recommend taking lots of supplements and eating lots of vegetables.

Craig Churchhill asks: What was working with Paula Klaw like? What was her role and how valuable was her presence?

Bettie Page: Paula was one of the nicest women I’ve ever known in my life-bar none. Only Paula was allowed to tie us up. She was very gentle, caring and considerate. She never tied any ropes too tight. She was very sweet. She and Irving would take me to lunch – I liked them very much.

Chillic asks: Did you ever keep any of your outfits?

Bettie Page: I’m very sorry that when I turned my life over to the Lord Jesus in January 1959, I threw out all my netstockings, bikinis – some from Frederik’s of Hollywood. I had designed some myself. I did think that God did disapprove of things I had done as a model. But I don’t think that so much now – I’m sorry I threw them out.

Speaking of bikinis, I have people making dollars off of me… one of the last jobs I did in NYC was for a couple down in Greenwich Village. The wife wanted me to pose in all my bikinis – i thought it was strange. A while later, someone sent me an ad – they were selling Bettie Page bikinis – dirty trick – they had copied my bikinis.

Dave Holle asks: Do you ever wonder what the Kefauver Commission would have done with the Starr Report?

Bettie Page: He was trying to be President, you know, and he didn’t care who he hurt along the way… I’m glad he didn’t get through the door…

Shooter McCay asks: What do you think of the Clinton thing…

Bettie Page: I don’t keep up with it too much. the news depresses me – murders, rapists – I’m trying to be positive. I’d would rather not comment.

Kai asks: What do you do now since you are retired? Any hobbies?

Bettie Page: Oh yes. I like to sew. I like to watch good old movies on cable TV. I like to read. I’ve got every book you can think of on longevity, health. I like to go sightseeing. I like to take trips. I like to go to the Western Museum of California – near Griffith Park Everybody should go there – they have all the movie star costumes – you wouldn’t believe what they’ve got there

xiola asks: Bettie, do you have any men in your life now?

Bettie Page: I have HAD it with men. H-A-D. Besides my brother Jack and Dave Stevens, the artist. Everyone thinks Dave Stevens is my son, but he sent me a mother’s day card last year. I thought that was cute.

StacieHerndon asks: Bettie, if you could do it all over again, would you choose the same life?

Bettie Page: I would not marry the man that I married. Harry Lear, my third husband, is an exception. We were very much in love. But right after I married him and came back from our honeymoon in Nassau, the children turned against me. The ex-wife turned them against me. I regret that. But not that I blamed Harry. He was a Mr. Milquetoast. He didn’t want to make waves.

Bettie Page: She would call me up and cuss me out and tell me to go to Hell — Harry didn’t do anything about it.

Karen Essex: When did you stop dating?

Bettie Page: I had enough of it after five years and letting it ruin my life about dating and when did I stop… one of the nicest things that happened in recent year, I lived in Santa Monica in the late ’80s and there was a band in Lincoln Park – the lead singer was singing “Lady.” He came up and got down on one knee and sang that song to me while holding my hand. That was one of the sweetest things that happened to me. He didnt know my age. Now I used to go to dances in Santa Monica. I used to dance all my life and was considered pretty good. I still dance around the house all the time — as a part of aerobics. I dreamed up my own set of aerobics.

Firewolf asks: Ms. Bettie – a few months ago I saw a story about how someone had a letter from you about your time in Flordia and that you were arrested. He’s writing a book about it…any truth to this or is it more lies?

Bettie Page: Let me tell you about the man. In 1992, I think it was, I got a fan letter from Richard Foster. He claimed he was a student at the University of Virginia. He had been a fan since 16 and had a lot of questions. I was in the mood to respond and answered his questions. In addition to publishing the questions, he dug up things on me I didn’t want public this creep Richard Foster put out this book called the “Real Bettie Page.” He’s got all kinds of lies in that book that are not true, that are nobody’s business…that I tried to kill myself in a police car with a coat hanger you-know-where – how crazy! He said I was in a mental institution for many months in Miami…He claims that if he hadn’t dug up that information on me about my shady past, that somebody would have dug it up, and put me in a worse light that he did – well, I don’t know how they could!

Bettie Page: He’s even got a movie producer ready to do a movie on his book of lies – i wont get a penny of money and makes me mad that people will believe it.

Stacy asks: What do you think of breast implants – and would you have gotten them if you could?

Bettie Page: No, I would not have gotten implants. I don’t think God meant for anything artificial to be put in the body. I would rather have no breasts than something artificial like that.

bruno asks: did you travel outside of USA Bettie?

Bettie Page: I like to travel. I regret that I never got to Paris. In October 1978, I had saved money and wanted to go to Hawaii – to see the islands. People told me that Paris would have been my style of living.

I did live in Haiti – for 4 months. I was ready to go to work as the secretary to the ambassador to the US, but they were angry because the US president wouldn’t give them a loan – they started rioting and talked of killing all Americans. I left. But I like the Haitian people. I lost all of my prejudice against black people – growing up in the South, you know. When I was 13, I would collect photos of baseball stars – I had a crush on one of the Nashville Vols, in particular. These two black girls grabbed by baseball cards and shoved me to the ground.So I didn’t feel good about them, but Haiti changed me. I fell in love with a Haitian man there, but found that his wife was about to have a baby on the other end of the island!

Martha asks: Do you see people on the streets copying your style or wearing your shirts?

Bettie Page: I know that models have on the runways. They claim that I’m an instigator of a lot of the styles. I never kept up with the fashions. I believed in wearing what I thought looked good on me. Do you know that I have a good friend, I’ve never met her — April Stevens — she won a Bettie Page look-a-like contest. She always sends me pictures and videos, but she doesn’t look a bit like me. the black hair and bangs is the only thing. If she reads this, she’ll feel bad. I just though of that. oops.

stacy asks: What do you think of Madonna? Why do you think sex sells?

Bettie Page: I think Madonna is highly overrated if you want my opinion. She has a very nice figure and is a good singer but has something to be desired with her looks in the face. Sex sells…it’s been selling for years and years, again, it’s highly overrated. There are other things in life besides sex. You lose your desire for it once you reach a certain age. though I still love to look at pictures of beautiful bodies -men and women.

Hannah asks: Have you seen all the questions on this message board? Do they make you feel good — that so many people still care for you?

Bettie Page: It makes me feel wonderful that people still care for me… that I have so many fans among young people, who write to me and tell me I have been an inspiration. You would think they never think about 50′s pinup models. I have had 11 songs written about me – the best is by a song by BR-549 from my hometown, Nashville – called “Bettie, Bettie.” I wonder what he means by, “if I had known you-I would have been a better man,” in the lyrics?

Bettie Page: I once was in love with a man named Carlos from Peru. He showed me a picture of a blond woman and a little boy. He told me it was his sister. One night I had a cold — we were making love — his sister was his wife. this night, she knocked on the door and accused me of being a homewrecker. I told her I did not know he was married, but as I was going down the stairs, she was calling me these names and felt like a snake…I didn’t have anything to do with him after that.

Karen Essex: What were your favorite places to go in Nashville?

Willow Plunge, it was in Franklin outside of Nashville. It was a big swimming pool with willows all around it. You would ride the inner urban, a small train, that clanked along to go to Willow Plunge. I have happy memories of that – I took my boyfriends there.

blake asks: Bettie, have you been recognized on the streets in recent years?

Bettie Page: Since I got so fat in the last 4 to 5 years, not so much. Every now and then, before I cut my hair eight months ago, people would recognize me.

Karen Essex: Bettie is not really overweight! She just thinks she is, and she looks wonderful!

Bettie Page: If I want to live as I long as I do (100 years), I’ve got to lose it.

bruno asks: Did you see “Titanic”?

Bettie Page: I thought it was fascinating. Those scenes were so real. The closing scenes with that couple so much in love . . .that is love. If ever there was an example of true love, that is it.

Dean asks: What were you like as a kid?

Bettie Page: I was very studious – I studied all the time, while others were out playing. I got the reputation, if nobody knew the answer, Bettie Page did. I was trying to be valedictorian in high school, because the valedictorian would win a four year scholarship to Vanderbilt University. I was beat out by one quarter of a point – all I got was a $100 scholarship to George Peabody school in Nashville. I did go to George Peabody and worked for Dr. Leland Crab – he is a well-known civil war historian in the South. When others were out dating and galavanting – I had to work for Dr. Crab to pay my way through Peabody. I was going to be a teacher and wanted to – but when I had to do 6 months of practice teaching, the boys in the class were about as old as I was. With all the catcalls, I didn’t want to teach. Although I did teach after leaving New York City in the 50′s in Miami and Key West – 5-6 grade. I remember one boy who had been demoted and always disrupted the class – I said I never wanted to teach again after having to deal with him.

Robert Kotrola asks: How do you feel about being a cult icon?

Bettie Page: I don’t know what they mean by an icon. I never thought of myself as being that. It seems strange to me. I was just modeling, thinking of as many different poses as possible. I made more money modeling than being a secretary. I had a lot of free time. You could go back to work after an absence of a few months. I couldn’t do that as a secretary.

jammy asks: What kind of music do you listen to?

Bettie Page: I recommend KLAC 570 on the AM dial — 24 hours a day they play the good old music of ’40s ’50s and ’60s — Guy Lombardo, Tommy Dorsy, Harry James. The songs made sense back then. The rock songs now don’t make sense. I have a lot of cassettes. I have a friend who sends me the good old musicals with Gene Kelly, Doris Day. I play them all the time.

stereo3d asks: Were there any poses you refused to do?

Bettie Page: I refused to do strip sets. There are a couple pictures of me out from this one night. But I never did an open pose that the models do now. But one night I went to a party and there a lot of models, I have never been drunk in my life, but I liked sweet May wine and I must have gotten drunk. I remember posing. I don’t even remember. And one guy sold the photos at those sleazy shots. I had him arrested when I found out. He said he sold them because he owed his bookie.

There are a few pictures out that I have done that they weren’t supposed to sell, they still didn’t have releases.

stereo3d asks: Do you think Lucy Lawless of TV’s Xena patterns her look after you?

Bettie Page: She is one of my favorites. To be as big as she is, when she can do flips, she is something. No other woman can do what she does. I have heard she patterned her look after me. But she doesn’t have long hair like I have. I like that show.

Karen Essex: That’s all the time we have. Thanks to everyone for participating tonight. We had a great time.

Bettie Page: Thanks to Ace, Blondie, Bruno, Dean, Demonica, Sexy Sadie, Firewolf, Michael J, Shooter, Brooke, Sideshow Benny, Jaimecito, Jammy, Elaine, Kevin, Martha, Paul Hanson, Renny, Stereo 3d, and everyone else for coming.

Bettie Page: I hope you fans don’t look down your nose at me because of the breakdown, the busybody landladies. I didn’t want that known because it should have been private. I’m sorry Foster made it known in the book. It is something that could have happened to anyone. I know they don’t think the same today as they did years ago when they locked you in a dungeon. It is something that could happen to anyone when you have enough problems. I hope it never happens to you. I thank your for your love and concern. It makes me feel good knowing you’re out there. Kisses to all of you too and hugs too.

In popular culture addition

RuPaul's Drag Race Season 7 Winner Violet Chachki debut single was inspired by Bettie Page, as she said on this interview. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 190.245.204.103 (talk) 22:12, 2 June 2015 (UTC)

External links modified

Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just added archive links to 2 external links on Bettie Page. Please take a moment to review my edit. If necessary, add {{cbignore}} after the link to keep me from modifying it. Alternatively, you can add {{nobots|deny=InternetArchiveBot}} to keep me off the page altogether. I made the following changes:

When you have finished reviewing my changes, please set the checked parameter below to true to let others know.

This message was posted before February 2018. After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{source check}} (last update: 18 January 2022).

  • If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with this tool.
  • If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with this tool.

Cheers. —cyberbot IITalk to my owner:Online 06:09, 17 October 2015 (UTC)

miscellaneous background information

This article seems to lack some necessary context. There was a segment of History Dectectives (I saw on PBS in 2016, but I believe it's several years older) which claims (and is most likely true, iirc) that photographs of men and women in sexual or nude poses was ILLEGAL in the early 1950's. Which means it was more expensive and risky to obtain. So, its hardly surprizing that most of her work involved only women and that no commercial sexually explicit photos have been verified. I don't know how you'd verify the content of all of the private work she did on commission, so I'm not sure the claim that she never participated in anything explicitly sexual can be verified. Looking back, it's a bit hard to believe that she never went over the line, but is certainly possible. I also note that her "measurements" are included in the "fact box" on the right, and yet no date is given for them. It's unlikely that her measurements stayed constant for ten years - and are they really necessary? Which authoratative source verified them? Her family is mentioned as discontinuing life-support, but no family is listed in the fact box. Did she have children? Finally History Dectectives says she was unable to find work in 1947-9 L.A. so moved to N.Y.C. to find work.FWIWAbitslow (talk) 06:42, 24 April 2016 (UTC)

Her measurements are really necessary because there are nay-sayers who doubt the idealized hourglass proportions of 3-2-3 are found in nature; preserving documenting Page's 36-23-35 measurements is really necessary to convince the doubters. Seriously, I recall her measurements were part of her publicity in the 1950s which justifies inclusion in the info box. -- Naaman Brown (talk) 11:33, 19 September 2016 (UTC)

  1. ^ http://www.jesus21.com/content/page/index.php?s=bettie_page
  2. ^ http://www.cultsirens.com/page/page.htm
Retrieved from "https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Talk:Bettie_Page/Archive_1&oldid=814635188"