Talk:Bridal Chorus

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Comment[edit]

The informatio). In most weddings in the UK the song played as the bride enters is thechurch, also notable for being Ken's ending tune.... Mr.bonus 15:02, 27 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The one being discussed here is the Wagner piece played at some weddings as the bride enters. Commonly reffered to as "Here Comes the Bride." Ironically, no Christian church I have ever attended (various Methodist, Presbyterian, Baptist, and Assembly of God churches) allowed it to be played, though, since it is distinctly secular. --W0lfie 19:09, 5 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I personally do not know why a lot of churches insist that this particular music is "secular". The whole opera (Lohengrin) is about Lohengrin (defender of the Holy Grail) purging Paganism and converting the people of Brabant to Christianity. There is nothing "secular" about it. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 93.223.195.85 (talk) 00:02, 19 November 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Not sure where you got that interpretation. The opera is set during the reign of Holy Roman Emperor Henry "the Fowler"; Brabant has been Christian for centuries at that point. Lohengrin does not "purge Paganism" in the opera; he fights in a trial-by-battle on behalf of an unjustly accused woman. The only pagan in the opera is Ortrud, and Lohengrin basically ignores her except when she is causing trouble. 73.137.170.88 (talk)

"the standard march"[edit]

I dislike the POV in the opening section. Nobody cited sources, and it is a bit misleading to call it a "standard." From [1], "who wants to get married to a song which was used at this wedding that didn't work out?" I have been to only one wedding where it was used, and that was a distinctly secular humanist ceremony. Compare that to 3 weddings that used Prince of Denmark's March, and one that used the Canon in D. Most organists I know simply hate both "Bridal Chorus" and the "Wedding March." I will try to round up some sources from organists I know, and then I might take a crack at a rewrite. See also the Wedding music article, which discusses this in some detail. --W0lfie 19:09, 5 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I agree with this objection. I am a professional musician and have played hundreds of weddings over the last 20 years. I do not think I have ever played the "Bridal Chorus" at a wedding; I have played Mendelssohn's "Wedding March" maybe twice. Many churches, not just Lutherans or Catholics, prohibit or discourage both pieces. In my experience, by far the most popular processional piece is Pachelbel's Canon in D, even for secular weddings. For about 90% of all weddings I have played, Canon in D is the requested processional for the bridesmaids and/or the bride. Goeben 14:40, 28 August 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I think this is a generational thing. Bridal Chorus is the TRADITIONAL processional, but has been displaced by Canon in D, which was not widely known until the 1970s. 73.137.170.88 (talk)

Agreed. Also in the 1970s and 80s, Bridal Chorus became the narrative shorthand for "getting married" in TV commercials and slapstick comedy of the Benny Hill variety, and for people growing up then the tune must have become cheapened and sullied by association. I can also confirm that Canon in D was not widely known. I heard it first over the post-credit sequence of a documentary and thought --- there's a composer of incidental music who is getting underpaid. --2A01:CB0C:CD:D800:CD57:225A:899:19C9 (talk) 08:07, 3 February 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Copy to Wikisource[edit]

A section is entitled {{copy to Wikisource}}. Can you determine whether this is still required, and which components you consider should be moved. Also, we would require for the source of the translation to be identified to ensure that there is no copyright violation on that component. Thx.-- billinghurst (talk) 03:39, 31 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Assessment comment[edit]

The comment(s) below were originally left at Talk:Bridal Chorus/Comments, and are posted here for posterity. Following several discussions in past years, these subpages are now deprecated. The comments may be irrelevant or outdated; if so, please feel free to remove this section.

Comment(s)

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==Rating by Richard Wagner Project==

Stub class. Difficult to rate as the text would be better in WikiSource and the background information with the opera. -- Kleinzach 05:06, 10 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Stub class ("a rough collection of information"), no printed sources cited, no acknowledgement for the translation, assertions in the article queried on the Talk Page ... does this really belong as part of the Wagner Project? --GuillaumeTell 15:02, 20 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Stub class. Per reasons above, although the Catholic link does seem official policy. I think that, as this is one of the two best known Wagner extracts, it does belong under the project and does merit its own article. Information on when it was composed, and first performed, that it is commonly known as "Here comes the bride" could be appropriately included here. Whilst "in popular culture" sections are rightly frowned upon, it probably would be worth mentioning examples of films where it is played in the context of the discussion that it is widely banned as theatre music.--Peter cohen 10:45, 23 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Last edited at 09:16, 27 September 2007 (UTC). Substituted at 10:17, 29 April 2016 (UTC)

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Daar komt de bruid[edit]

"Here comes the bride" sticks because it is prosodically close to the actual melody. The Dutch language imitates this effect with "Daar komt de bruid." It would be interesting to compile examples from other languages, if they exist. 2A01:CB0C:CD:D800:CD57:225A:899:19C9 (talk) 08:02, 3 February 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Religious attitudes[edit]

The "Religious attitudes" section runs completely counter to WP:DUE. Somebody's (unsigned) answer to a question on the LCMS website and a short document from the San Diego Catholic diocese (again unsigned, and not showing any imprimatur) cannot be taken as representing the attitude of the Lutheran and the Catholic Church at large. Either a proper, reliable secondary source should be produced showing the attitude of the two churches (if indeed they have an official attitude) or the section should be deleted. 2001:BB6:4713:4858:1C2E:28:BB7A:70B8 (talk) 11:57, 26 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Presenting attitudes of major religions to the use of "Bridal Chorus" in wedding ceremonies doesn't seem undue to me. The cited sources come from reputable sources, and many more can be found. -- Michael Bednarek (talk) 12:42, 26 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

WP:DUE says,"Neutrality requires that each article or other page in the mainspace fairly represent all significant viewpoints that have been published by reliable sources, in proportion to the prominence of each viewpoint in the published, reliable sources." It's not a question of whether "many more can be found" (which I doubt), but what proportion of the total literature on the Bridal Chorus emphasises this viewpoint. WP:RS says, "Articles should be based on reliable, independent, published sources with a reputation for fact-checking and accuracy. That cannot be said of these two web pages (both of which, by the way, are dead links only accessible through the Wayback machine). Are there books, journal articles, and/or web pages on scholarly sites presenting the views of known experts that "present attitudes of major religions to the use of 'Bridal Chorus' in wedding ceremonies"? If not, then the section gives undue weight to the views of a couple of anonymous people, and should be deleted. 2001:BB6:4713:4858:9886:5DFE:6138:BBA9 (talk) 12:48, 27 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

This article's 1st sentence certainly warrants mentioning the attitude towards its performance in church services. -- Michael Bednarek (talk) 14:03, 27 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

As for further sources: page 118 of Catholic Mass For Dummies by Rev. John Trigilio, Jr. (Wiley, 2011) is a low-hanging search result. Then there's an article from 15 April 1971 in The New York Times, "Vatican Word on Music May Rule Out 'Here Comes the Bride' " by Enid Nemy, which reports that it had been banned for some years and will continue so in St Patrick's Cathedral. -- Michael Bednarek (talk) 14:18, 27 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Addition to the religious attitudes section?[edit]

Due to controversies about Wagner and antisemitism, playing his music is divisive in Israel - I wonder if that expands to Jews elsewhere and to Bridal Chorus in particular. — Preceding unsigned comment added by KingAlanI (talk • contribs) 05:05, 28 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Oh yes, very much. (Source: Jewish) 24.61.57.240 (talk) 10:49, 18 March 2022 (UTC)[reply]