Talk:Dahabshiil

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Recent edit[edit]

Expanded the article in which there were some large gaps, particularly regarding Dahabshiil's operations and investments. Sections now cover a fuller company history, core business, operations, investments, compliance, awards and media coverage. This edit is fully referenced from a wide range of sources. Biggleswiki (talk) 10:03, 6 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Your edit unfortunately repeats a lot of the same mistakes as the previous one. You include a lot of irrelevant information not directly related to the company. For example: "Towards the end of the decade, civil war swept Somalia as the increasingly violent regime of Siad Barre launched attacks on the Majeerteen, Issaq and Hawiye clans, eventually forcing half a million Somalis to flee the country. In 1988, fighting between government forces and the Somali National Movement reached Burao.[9]" You also use several unreliable sources, such as Somalilandpress, a self-published blog (and one that's accused of some very serious things vis-a-vis Dahabshiil -- see below), which is not allowed per WP:SPS. You also place way too much undue weight (see WP:UNDUE) on how great Dahabshiil is, to the point where the article reads like a company prospectus rather than a neutral article (see Wikipedia's WP:NPOV neutrality policy). Case in point: "Dahabshiil has remained committed to this policy as part if its social responsibility pledges, in spite of the transaction costs often being higher than the nominal fees it charges its customers". As I'm sure you are already aware given the level of detail you have added to the article, Dahabshiil has been under a great deal of duress of late and is facing some serious charges, including allegations of having hired online hands to cleanup its image. Examples:

In 2010, a feud broke out between Dahabshiil and Saado Cali, one of Somalia's most revered singers, who is especially noted for her protest songs. The dispute was over an album Cali had released the year before, encouraging national unity and accusing the separatist northwestern Somaliland administration of military aggression in the disputed Sool, Sanaag and Cayn (SSC) regions, from where she hails. Dahabshiil, some of whose officials are reported to hold important positions in the Somaliland government, is alleged to have subsequently funded certain websites to campaign against Cali. In response, the singer released a song entitled Ha dhigan Dhiigshiil ("Don’t send your money through Dahabshiil",[1] with "Dhiigshiil" meaning "Bloodsmith"[2]), wherein Cali accuses Dahabshiil of acting as a financier for Al-Shabaab, an Al-Qaeda-linked Islamist militant group that is waging war for control of Somalia.[2]

Writing for the Waagacusub news website, the Somali investigative journalist Dahir Abdulle Alasow subsequently published an article reporting on the row, wherein he alleged that Dahabshiil officials had also attempted to have Cali assassinated.[2] In response, Dahabshiil sued Alasow, accusing him of defamation and of grossly understating the company's earnings.[3][4] Alasow had earlier been granted asylum in Holland after Al-Shabaab militants had made several attempts at his life for breaking stories on the group's activities.[4] In 2011, a court in Breda, Netherlands dismissed the charges filed against the journalist as baseless,[2] and permitted him to continue practicing his profession in the country.[4] Alasow was also presented in March with the Best Somali Investigative Journalist of the Year 2010 Award by the Federation of Somali Journalists (FESOJ), Somali Journalist’s Rights Agency (SOJRA), Somali Journalists in Netherlands (SOMJON), and the Somali Foreign Correspondents (SOFCA).[4]

In April 2011, The Telegraph published a Wikileaks file of a United States Department of Defense document suggesting close ties between Dahabshiil and wanted terrorists.[5] Company officials are alleged to have provided direct financial support to numerous terrorist groups, including Al-Qaida and Al-Wafa, with "the Dahabshiil organization and its support of extremist operations" deemed an area of potential exploitation.[6]

Given the above and especially WP:NPOV, what this article therefore needs is not any more undue weight placed on Dahabshiil's accomplishments -- that has already been added. What hasn't are the major charges above. And this is what needs to be discussed, preferably in a separate "Controversy" section. Middayexpress (talk) 11:01, 6 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]

I am trying to expand this article with plain, referenced facts about Dahabshiil (I can easily change any references that you're uneasy with). Your sole agenda seems to be to add a "Controversy" section filled with as yet unproved allegations. Biggleswiki (talk) 12:07, 6 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Please remember to assume good faith. I haven't speculated anything about your intentions (though I very easily could), so no need to engage in mud-slinging. I've only commented on your actual edits; specifically, your poor choice of sources in some areas, and especially, the undue weight you've placed on how great a company Dahabshiil is. According to none other than the US government (among others), however, it is knee-deep in terrorist activities. This is a) notable, b) not undue weight (in fact, no opposing views have yet been cited), and c) it is coming from a very reliable source, not mere 'speculation'. With that said, I welcome any draft proposals you have to offer for appraisal per WP:BRD. Please post them here on this talk page; let's have a look. Middayexpress (talk) 12:21, 6 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]
I agree with User:Middayexpress here. This article is not meant to advertise Dahabshiil. User:Biggleswiki, I don't know what your relationship to the organization is, but clearly you are not being neutral on this issue. The purpose of Wikipedia is to provide a complete picture on issues by "representing fairly, proportionately, and as far as possible without bias, all significant views that have been published by reliable sources" as per WP:NPOV. With that in mind, a controversy section is necessary. (Bot3skfjs (talk) 14:55, 23 May 2011 (UTC))[reply]

Intro & Company History[edit]

Hi - I've reworked my intro and history section to reduce them somewhat, cutting out the paragraph on the civil war for example (which I agree was unnecessary) and sticking only to what I consider to be the most relevant content. Please let me know your thoughts. Thanks.

Dahabshiil (Somali: Dahabshiil, Arabic: دهب شيل‎) is Africa’s largest money transfer company, with offices in Hargeisa, Dubai and London.[7] The company operates in 144 countries and employs around 2,000 people.[8]

Company History

Dahabshiil was founded in 1970 by Mohamed Said Duale, a Somali entrepreneur based in Burao, the capital city of Togdheer province in the region now known as Somaliland.[9]

Initially a general trading enterprise, the firm specialised in remittance broking during the 1970s as almost half the economically active male population in the north of Somalia migrated to the Gulf States, and demand grew for services to transfer money from those migrant workers back to their families.[10][11]

Because of foreign exchange controls imposed by the Somali government at the time, most of the funds were transferred via trade-based system known as Franco Valuta (FV) which involved the import of goods, proceeds from the sale of which were sent to migrants’ families.[12] These transactions formed the bulk of Dahabshiil’s business throughout the 1980s.[13]

Towards the end of the 1980s, fighting in the Somali Civil War was reaching its peak. In 1988 the Duale family were among the hundreds of thousands who fled to neighbouring Ethiopia. The business in Somalia collapsed, but Duale was able to draw on an extensive network of contacts in the Gulf to re-establish the venture, setting up a small office in Ethiopia to serve displaced Somali communities there and in Djibouti.[14]

In 1989 Dahabshiil opened its first office outside Africa, in East London, where a number of Somalis had arrived during the war. The UK arm was managed by Mohammed Duale’s son, Abdirashid Duale, who began to expand the business as the Somali population in the UK continued to grow.[15]

Biggleswiki (talk) 10:32, 9 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Hello again. Your edit above does not seem too problematic. However, a few things need to be adjusted before I am prepared to endorse it. To start, Dahabshiil at this point is not just Africa's largest money transfer company, but one of the largest international money transfer companies (after, of course, industry giants such as Western Union and MoneyGram). The original lede sentence indicating that "Dahabshiil ([Dahabshiil] Error: {{Lang-xx}}: text has italic markup (help), Arabic: دهب شيل) is an international funds transfer company" therefore should be retained. On the other hand, your addition that "the company operates in 144 countries and employs around 2,000 people.[16]" is a good summary of an important aspect of the company (its operational size), so it too should be added. Altogether, the intro paragraph would therefore look something like the following:

Dahabshiil ([Dahabshiil] Error: {{Lang-xx}}: text has italic markup (help), Arabic: دهب شيل) is an international funds transfer company. Formed in the early 1970s, it has its headquarters in London, United Kingdom.[17] The firm employs more than 2000 people across 144 countries, with 400 global branches. It provides a broad range of financial services to international organisations, as well as to both large and small businesses and private individuals.[17][18][19] The company is also involved in numerous community building projects.[17]

Further, the firm was founded in 1970; and at the time, Burao/Burco was a part of the Togdheer region of Somalia, not the Somaliland macro-region of Somalia (which was established much later in 1991). The phrase therefore needs to be changed to read "a Somali entrepreneur based in Burao, the capital city of Togdheer province in the modern-day Somaliland region."
The later phrase reading "Towards the end of the 1980s, fighting in the Somali Civil War was reaching its peak. In 1988 the Duale family were among the hundreds of thousands who fled to neighbouring Ethiopia" should probably also be changed to "With the Somali Civil War fast approaching, the Duale family were among the hundreds of thousands who retreated to the Somali-inhabited Ogaden region in neighbouring Ethiopia" since (a) all-out war didn't actually really break out until late 1990/early 1991, and (b) most nationals fled to the Ogaden, which is of course Somali-inhabited.
Lastly, I'm not sure about the veracity of the statement that Dahabshiil's London office was its first one outside of Africa. The cited ref [3] also doesn't seem to indicate that; it just states that Dahabshiil set up a branch there: "coinciding with an influx of Somali immigrants to the UK, Dahabshiil set up an office in East London". I believe the company's first overseas branches were in the Arabian peninsula, while it was still a minnow and known as "Dhiigshiil". The sentence should therefore be changed to "In 1989, Dahabshiil opened its first office in London, where a number of Somalis had arrived during the war."
The sentence reading that "The UK arm was managed by Mohammed Duale’s son, Abdirashid Duale, who began to expand the business as the Somali population in the UK continued to grow", should also be changed to "The UK arm was managed by Mohammed Duale’s son, Abdirashid Duale, who began to expand the business as the Somali population in the UK grew" since the Somali population in the UK at the time wasn't significant to begin with.
Aside from the above, the edit looks fine. If you can fix the issues just described, then I have no objection to your adding the proposed edits. Best regards, Middayexpress (talk) 18:59, 9 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Hello. Those are good points - I will make the changes and add. Thanks. Biggleswiki (talk) 09:26, 10 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]

No prob. Middayexpress (talk) 18:18, 10 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Hi, below is a proposed section to replace the current paragraph titled 'Somali money transfer industry', much of the content of which I have retained. It is reliably referenced. Please let me know what you think. Many thanks.

Somali Remittance Industry

While there is no precise figure for the size of the current global Somali Diaspora, it is estimated that around one million out of a total population of nine million now live outside Somalia.[20] Estimates also vary of the total value of annual remittances from this migrant population back to the home country, however a recent study by the United Nations Development Programme suggests a figure of around $1.6 billion, sent largely by emigrants in the US, Europe and the Gulf.[21][22] Industry experts estimate that Dahabshiil handles around two thirds of all remittances into Somalia.[23]

Like most Somali funds transfer companies, Dahabshiil is credentialed by the Somali Money Transfer Association (SOMTA), members of which are unique to the industry in that they charge significantly lower commission fees than their western counterparts - typically around 5% for sums of up to $1,000 and between 3% and 4% for sums greater than $1,000 as compared to Western Union’s 7.1% and MoneyGram’s 7.2% for sending the same amount to Ethiopia. Charges for the remittance of charity funding vary between 0% to 2%.[24]

Accounting for almost a quarter of Somali household income, and with around 40% of households receiving regular assistance, remitted funds have helped to sustain communities in some of the remotest locations in the Somali-speaking regions, and have proved significant in promoting private sector activity in telecoms, transport and housing, as well as in basic infrastructure, health and education.[25][26][27]

It has also been argued that the inflow of foreign capital has helped to prevent the collapse of the Somali shilling - large-scale, unregulated issuance of which has led to its steady depreciation coupled with inflationary pressures.[28] [29]

Biggleswiki (talk) 17:43, 11 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Hello. The edit for the most part looks fine, though it's phrased awkwardly in parts.
Firstly, I would recommend retaining the title "Somali money transfer industry" since the acronym most often used for such Somali companies (MTO -- short for Money Transfer Operators) refers to "money transfer" as opposed to "remittance".
The reference to the number of Somalis living outside of Somalia is also somewhat misleading, as it includes the traditionally Somali-inhabited territories in Greater Somalia that are not a part of Somalia. It would therefore be best to leave this part out, and retain the current intro sentence: "Funds transfer services have become a large industry in Somalia, with the country now offering some of the most advanced and competitively priced telecommunications and internet services in the world.[18]"
Moreover, the line reading "Accounting for almost a quarter of Somali household income, and with around 40% of households receiving regular assistance, remitted funds have helped to sustain communities in some of the remotest locations in the Somali-speaking regions, and have proved significant in promoting private sector activity in telecoms, transport and housing, as well as in basic infrastructure, health and education" is a run-on sentence, and should be broken up. The phrase "remitted funds have helped to sustain communities in some of the remotest locations" should also be changed to "funds remitted by the Somali diaspora have helped to sustain communities in some of the remotest locations". Altogether, the revised sentence would look something like this:
"Accounting for almost a quarter of Somali household income, funds remitted by the Somali diaspora have helped to sustain communities in some of the remotest locations in the Somali-speaking regions. With around 40% of households receiving such assistance from relatives working abroad, remittances have proved significant in promoting private sector activity in telecoms, transport and housing, as well as in basic infrastructure, health and education."
Also, there are other valuable parts of the existing version that were removed. Specifically, the reference to Dahabshiil's fellow MTOs/its domestic competitors and the fact that the Somali Money Transfer Association (SOMTA) that they are members of (a) is an umbrella organization which regulates the community's money transfer sector, and (b) had a predecessor that they were also members of; namely, the Somali Financial Services Association (SFSA). Altogether, the paragraph would look something like the following:
"Most of the Somali money transfer operators (MTO) are credentialed members of the Somali Money Transfer Association (SOMTA), an umbrella organization that regulates the community's money transfer sector, or its predecessor, the Somali Financial Services Association (SFSA). Besides Dahabshiil, the Somali MTOs include Qaran Express, Mustaqbal, Amal Express, Kaah Express, Hodan Global, Olympic, Amana Express, Iftin Express and Tawakal Express. A unique feature of the Somali funds transfer companies is that they all charge the same low commission of 5% for sending amounts of up to approximately $1000, a fee range that encompasses the vast majority of household Somali remittances. For amounts greater than $1000, these companies charge commission fees of between 3%-4%, significantly lower than Western Union's 7.1% fee and MoneyGram's 7.2% fee for sending the same amount to Ethiopia. Charges for the remittance of charity funding vary between 0% to 2%."
Those are the changes I recommend and would endorse. Best regards, Middayexpress (talk) 18:35, 11 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Hi, thanks for your input - I shall make those alterations.Biggleswiki (talk) 07:18, 12 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Hi - please see below a proposed edit to the first subsection of the company overview - 'Branches and services'. Thanks.

Branches and transfer network

Dahabshiil is the largest of the Somali money transfer operators (MTOs), having captured most of the market vacated by Al-Barakaat. The firm has its headquarters in London and employs more than 2,000 people across 144 countries, with 130 branches in Somalia, a further 130 branches in the United Kingdom, and 400 branches globally, including one in Dubai.[30][31] Its worldwide network comprises more than 24,000 agent and branch locations, and the company has invested in state-of-the-art technologies to offer both SMS notification and 24-hour online transfers.[32][33]

Products and services

Remittance transfer remains Dahabshiil’s core business, but the company has diversified to offer financial services to international organisations, businesses and private individuals.[34] Most of the major international development organisations operating in Somalia use Dahabshiil to transfer funds, including the UN, World Health Organisation, World Bank, Oxfam, Save the Children and Care International.[35]

In 2008, Dahabshiil acquired a majority stake in SomTel, a Somaliland-based telecommunications firm specialising in high speed broadband, mobile internet, and mobile phone services.[36][37] The acquisition provided Dahabshiil with the necessary platform for a subsequent expansion into mobile banking, a growth industry in the African banking sector. [38][39]

In early 2009, Dahabshiil opened an Islamic bank, Dahabshiil Bank International, in Djibouti.[40] An international bank, DBI provides services to business and private clients demanding Shariah-compliant financing. [41] Operations centre on asset finance, partnership finance and lease finance.[42]

Also in 2009, Dahabshiil tied up with leading Somali retailers, hotels, restaurants, and petrol stations to launch ‘Dahabshiil eCash’, Somalia’s first debit card service.[43][44]

Biggleswiki (talk) 13:11, 12 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Hi. The above looks fine, except for some overlinking again on certain recurring terms such as "remittance" and "Somalia". Also, the phrase that reads "The acquisition provided Dahabshiil with the necessary platform for a subsequent expansion into mobile banking, a growth industry in the African banking sector" appears to be inaccurate because the refs mention mobile banking specifically being a growth industry in the Horn region, not Africa at large; it should therefore be changed to read "The acquisition provided Dahabshiil with the necessary platform for a subsequent expansion into mobile banking, a growth industry in the regional banking sector". Lastly, the phrase beginning "Also in 2009, Dahabshiil tied up with leading Somali retailers..." is phrased awkwardly and should probably be changed to "That same year, Dahabshiil teamed up with leading Somali retailers...". Those are the changes I recommend and would endorse. Best regards, Middayexpress (talk) 17:59, 12 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Note that I have removed one ref you added, as it appears to be a student paper that uses, among other sources, Wikipedia articles for its information (c.f. WP:USERGENERATED). I have also added some pics of other franchise outlets both within Somalia and abroad (hope that's ok). Middayexpress (talk) 17:59, 12 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Hi, thanks for this - it was the phrase at the end of Monty Munford's article that says 'the rest of Africa will inevitably follow' that in fact led me to change what I had there initially. He's probably right, but it's still speculation and the current market is indeed concentrated in the Horn. Thanks for the pics, and for your minor edits (I was about to recommend excatly the same change).Biggleswiki (talk) 08:42, 13 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]

No prob. The rest of Africa probably will follow suit. However, within the continent, hawala has traditionally only really been a cultural thing in the Horn and some parts of North Africa. Outside of Africa, it's mainly practiced by Gulf Arab and South Asian communities. Best regards, Middayexpress (talk) 17:53, 13 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]
  1. ^ Prick Up Your Ears
  2. ^ a b c d A Somali super star singer sings against Dahabshiil Money transfer
  3. ^ Somalilandpress.com violates journalism law
  4. ^ a b c d Somali Foreign Correspondentsw Association
  5. ^ The relations of Dahabshiil and AlQaeda-Guantanamo Bay Wikileaks files
  6. ^ Bay detainee file on Muhammad Sulayman Barre.pdf SUBJECT: Recommendation for Continued Detention Under DoD Control (CD) for Guantanamo Detainee, ISN US9SO-000567DP (S)
  7. ^ BBC
  8. ^ Times Online
  9. ^ New York Times
  10. ^ How We Made It In Africa
  11. ^ Overseas Development Institute
  12. ^ COMPAS Publications
  13. ^ Global Security
  14. ^ Hiiraan
  15. ^ Harowo
  16. ^ Times Online
  17. ^ a b c "Decades of community service recognised with award". Tower Hamlets Recorder. 13 April 2007. Retrieved 3 June 2010.
  18. ^ a b Trustfull, Paul. "Freeing Finance: If money makes the world go round, Dahabshiil CEO Abdirashid Duale makes sure it goes to the right people". Forbes. Retrieved 3 June 2010.
  19. ^ Cite error: The named reference UKSRS was invoked but never defined (see the help page).
  20. ^ Conciliation Resources
  21. ^ [www.so.undp.org/index.php/Download-document/195-som.html United Nations Development Programme]
  22. ^ United Nations Industrial Development Organization
  23. ^ Mobile Money Africa
  24. ^ UK Somali Remittances Survey
  25. ^ [www.so.undp.org/index.php/Download-document/195-som.html United Nations Development Programme]
  26. ^ World Bank Social Development Papers
  27. ^ The Norwegian Council for Africa
  28. ^ The Economist
  29. ^ Wharton Financial Institutions Center, University of Pennsylvania
  30. ^ http://www.diaspora-centre.org/DOCS/UK_Somali_Remittan.pdf UK Somali Remittance Survey]
  31. ^ Yahoo! Finance
  32. ^ International Association of Money Transfer Networks
  33. ^ All Africa
  34. ^ All Africa
  35. ^ The African Business Journal
  36. ^ International Association of Money Transfer Networks
  37. ^ Yahoo! Finance
  38. ^ TechChange
  39. ^ TechCrunch
  40. ^ Financial Technology Africa
  41. ^ Somali Directory
  42. ^ Somaliland.Org
  43. ^ [1]
  44. ^ [2]

Allegations[edit]

A paragraph has been added to the article suggesting that Dahabshiil is involved in terrorist financing. The indicated association is based on the company's past involvement with Mohammed Sulaymon Barre (an erstwhile Dahabshiil franchise owner with close ties to the firm's founder) and Abdullahi Sudi Arale, both of whom are former Guantanamo Bay detainees. In April 2011, The Telegraph published a Wikileaks file of a United States Department of Defense document suggesting close ties between Dahabshiil and wanted terrorists. However, it was later brought to my attention [4] that this document (which dates from 2007) does not reflect the current reality of the situation, as both Barre and Arale were apparently never charged and have since been released from custody; also, per the Huffington Post [5], the terrorist financing allegations leveled against Dahabshiil were dropped from the U.S. government's summary of evidence. This clearly leaves us with but two choices with respect to the passage in question: either remove it outright (as it no longer applies), or drastically re-structure it to reflect the foregoing. Middayexpress (talk) 19:00, 24 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]

The passage does not state that Dahabshiil is involved in terrorist financing, it states that the U.S. government levied these allegations against Dahabshiil ( key word here being allegations). The passage has been reworded to reflect that this is what the U.S. government thought in the past. As for Mr.Barre and Mr.Arale, no evidence has been brought forth showing that they were not connected to Dahabshiil nor has any evidence been brought forth that the branch Mr.Barre was illegally operating in Karachi was not used by terrorists or terrorist sympathizers to send funds to individuals in Kenya. Nor has any evidence has been brought forth showing that these funds were not later used to finance the terrorist attacks in Mombasa, Kenya.


You are correct in asserting that Barre and Arale were released from Gitmo, but that does not mean that everything mentioned in the files is untrue. Until now you have been unable to provide proof that terrorists have not and are not using Dahabshiil to send funds to other terrorists in different parts of the world. There are also current allegations that terrorist organizations such as Al Shabaab are using the company to receive funds from Somalis in the Diaspora.
see: http://www.investigativeproject.org/documents/case_docs/1355.pdf & http://southcapitolstreet.com/2010/08/16/new-indictments-unsealed-in-al-shabaab-investigation/


Dahabshiil recently lost a case against a prominent Somali journalist who they tried to silence because he brought this ( the fact that terrorists are using Dahabshiil to send/receive funds) to the attention of the public.So these allegations are not a thing of the past. see: http://jure.nl/bp3480.pdf & http://www.asoj.org/view.php?id=270
Btw, the passage mentions that Barre and Arale are no longer detainees in Gitmo by referring to both of them as 'former Guantanamo Bay Detention Camp detainees'.
(Bot3skfjs (talk) 02:07, 25 May 2011 (UTC))[reply]

Bot3skfjs keeps asking for evidence to disprove what he's written when his own evidence is demonstrably unsound. All he has done is to present out-dated allegations as facts, which he has then asked us to invalidate. To say, '..that does not mean that everything mentioned in the files is untrue..' is simply not good enough. Everything he comes up with is another allegation and he's resisted making this clear all along. He needs a judgement of guilt, but he doesn't have a confession, a trial, or even a charge involving any of the men mentioned in the leaked US files. His passage is inconsistent with:

Biggleswiki (talk) 12:06, 25 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]

You are confusing two completely different issues here. This is not about the guilt of Barre or Arale, this is about Dahabshiil and terrorists using Dahabshiil to send funds around the world. If you had read the files you would see that Barre has admitted to operating a Dahabshiil branch illegally from his residence in Karachi. He can not definitively say whether or not people were using the branch to send funds to terrorists in Africa, but the U.S. government believes this to be the case and just because Barre and Arale were released from Gitmo does not mean this not true. I have just presented you with further evidence that Dahabshiil, along with a few other Somali remittance companies, is currently being used by Al-Shabaab supporters in the Diaspora to send funds to Al-Shabaab [6] [7]. Again, the Dahabshiil page is not supposed to be an advert for the company. Having said that, I will change the title of the section to "Controversies".
Good day, (Bot3skfjs (talk) 15:08, 25 May 2011 (UTC))[reply]

You are missing the point. And that is that:

1) Barre and Arale were indeed cleared of all terrorism allegations by the Obama administration's inter-agency Task Force, and they were released:

"Compared to Mohammed Sulaymon Barre, Ismael Mahmoud Muhammad was fortunate that his wrongful imprisonment lasted for only two and a half years, but as the eighth anniversary of the opening of Guantánamo approaches, the release of these two men -- neither of whom was cleared until the Obama administration's inter-agency Task Force began its deliberations this year -- demonstrates, yet again, that, when it comes to undoing the shameful legacy of Guantánamo, much work still remains to be done." [8]

Government interrogators had also intimated that Barre was detained "by mistake":

"as Barre himself noted at his tribunal in 2005, was that "A lot of interrogators said to me that ... a lot of mistakes were made and they must be corrected. They told me many times that I am here by mistake."" [9]

2) Al-Barakaat was cleared of all terrorism-related charges by the UN:

"A year later, as the BBC reported in August 2006, al-Barakat had been removed from the U.S. watchlist of terrorist organizations. The report explained that al-Barakat had been included on the watchlist because U.S. intelligence analysts thought it had been used to finance the 9/11 hijackers, but the 9/11 Commission had investigated the claim and had found it baseless" [10]

3) The allegations regarding Dahabshiil's ties with Al-Barakaat were likewise dropped five years ago:

"In February 2009, in a report for the Washington Post, Peter Finn noted that, in the allegations against Barre at Guantánamo, Dahabshiil's alleged ties to al-Barakat had been dropped by 2006" [11]

4) The terrorist financing allegations leveled against Dahabshiil were also dropped from the U.S. government's summary of evidence:

"the allegations involving Dahabshiil were later dropped from the government's summary of evidence" [12]

The new Al-Shabaab-related allegations are rather complicated; much of it reads as circumstantial. The indictment against the two women just indicates that money (which may or may not have been used for illicit purposes; they claim it wasn't) was sent "through the hawala money remittance system" using various companies including Dahabshiil [13], though no comment is made as to whether the hawala dealers themselves were actively complicit in this, and Dahabshiil in particular. At any rate, for clarification on this matter, I've contacted a user who is familiar with both Dahabshiil and Al-Shabaab and who has contributed to this article as well in the past. Best regards, Middayexpress (talk) 20:44, 25 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]


No, you seem to be the one who is missing the point. This is not about Barre and/or Arale but Dahabshiil so please stay on topic. I mentioned Barre, Arale, Gitmo and Barakat in the context of the Dahabshiil branch in Pakistan that Barre was operating which was used by terrorists to send funds to other terrorists ( which was later used to finance the 2002 Mombasa attacks). You keep side-stepping this issue.. in fact, you have yet to address it. Do you have any evidence to prove that terrorists have not used Dahabshiil to send funds to other terrorists? If so, please show your proof.


The indictment against the two women shows that terrorist and/or terrorist sympathizers are still using the company to send funds to terrorists and/or terrorist organizations ( despite the measures they have taken). It also gives credence to some of the allegations made against the company by Dahir Alasow, Saado Ali and others.


I would urge you to re-read the passage because no where did I state that Dahabshiil was complicit in this. If Western Union was being used by terrorists to send/receive funds, there's no question that it would be all over the news and would most definitely be on the Western Union Wikipedia page, but for some reason Dahabshiil is being held to a different standard here. Why is that?
(Bot3skfjs (talk) 21:31, 25 May 2011 (UTC))[reply]
I'm not sure if you're aware or not, but terrorists, scammers, and many other assorted criminals routinely use Western Union to transmit cash because it is difficult to trace (e.g. [14]). That doesn't mean Western Union (like Barre -- who was cleared of all charges) is complicit in this. On the contrary, the firm does everything it can to prevent this from happening. And this too is explained on the Western Union article. Middayexpress (talk) 22:12, 25 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]
You can not compare scam artists to terrorists. Have terrorists ever used Western Union to send funds to finance a terrorist attack? I don't think so and that right there is the difference.
I don't know where I stated Barre knowingly allowed these terrorists to use the branch? All I mentioned in the passage is that the branch was operated on behalf of Dahabshiil by Mr. Barre. Perhaps it's in the wording and if you want to re-word that sentence, feel free to do so. (Bot3skfjs (talk) 23:00, 25 May 2011 (UTC))[reply]
It's unfortunately not just a wording issue, but a lot more than that at this point (as outlined above). Further, the Western Union article has a pertinent section on terrorism as well [15] (right below the scam abuse section) and the firm's efforts to prevent misuse of its services along those lines, despite company safeguards. Middayexpress (talk) 23:24, 25 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]
So clearly I am not the one who is not interested in reaching a consensus here. I have given you the opportunity to reword the passage and not only have rejected my offer but you have accused me of using "original research" instead of verifiable sources ( on your user talk page). Perhaps it's time to get an Administrator involved to resolve this issue.
Btw, you still haven't shown any proof that Dahabshiil wasn't used to send/receive funds to finance the 2002 Mombasa attacks or that Western Union has been used by terrorists to finance terrorist attacks. (Bot3skfjs (talk) 00:12, 26 May 2011 (UTC))[reply]
You keep saying this is not about Barre and Arale but who else is it about? Middayexpress's first point above comes from one of your own sources. This having been pointed out you have begun an attempt to detach the whole story about Karachi and the transfer of funds to finance Mombasa from the plain fact that the Dahabshiil agent who was accused of a central role in these activities was released, apparently with admissions by his captors that there had been 'many mistakes'. If you want to make it about Dahabshiil, then stick to facts about Dahabshiil - when has this company ever been the subject of formal investigation by the US government or any other authority into financing terrorism? The only conclusion that can be drawn from the evidence is that Dahabshiil has been the target of allegations that were not pursued - see Middayexpress's fourth point. The 'current' Al-Shabab allegations date from 2009 and make a passing mention of almost the entire Somali hawala system - show me evidence that these have developed into a formal inquiry into Dahabshiil's activities. Biggleswiki (talk) 09:02, 26 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]
I did indeed allude to original research (as well as WP:BLP). And what I was referring to was synthesis (an OR sub-policy) in the Al-Shabaab-related edits that you added. Specifically, the phrases: "two Somali women used Dahabshiil, as well as five other Somali remittance companies, [28] [29] to send thousands of dollars to the terrorist organization Al-Shabaab. The women, who were charged with providing material support to a terrorist organization, have pleaded not guilty and have maintained that the funds were sent to people in Somalia". As explained above by both Biggleswiki and I, the cited indictment [16] against the two women just indicates that money was sent "through the hawala money remittance system" using various companies including Dahabshiil. Nowhere is it indicated that the hawala dealers themselves, and Dahabshiil in particular, were actively complicit in any impropriety, nor have any charges been leveled against the company. In fact, the second sentence's ref doesn't even mention the firm [17]. The situation is quite similar to that news article that I already linked to above explaining that the terrorists who orchestrated the recent Mumbai attacks used Western Union to pay for a Voice-over-Internet Protocol (VOIP) account, through which orders were directly given to carry out the attacks [18]. That article likewise does not suggest that Western Union was complicit in the activity, nor has this been indicated in the Western Union page. The main difference here is that the suspects in that case weren't cleared of any allegations. Lastly, it has already been demonstrated above through actual quotes that Barre and Arale were cleared of all allegations, with government officials confessing that Barre's detainment had been a "mistake". Per WP:BURDEN, the onus is thus on you (not us) to prove that Dahabshiil is under any formal investigation in relation to alleged terrorist funding. Middayexpress (talk) 17:58, 26 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]
We must be reading two completely different passages because nowhere did I state that Dahabshiil knowingly let terrorists use their service. As stated in my sources, terrorists and people affiliated with terrorists have used Dahabshiil to send/receive funds and my sources support everything I have written in the controversy section. If your issue is with the wording, reword the passage but if your issue is with the information that is presented in the passage ( all with verifiable sources) then that's a different story. I would appreciate it if you stopped hurling accusations of using "original research" at me when I have done no such thing. I'm pretty sure you're breaking some rule by continuously doing so.
At this point it's obvious that this discussion is getting nowhere so maybe it's time to get an Administrator involved. (Bot3skfjs (talk) 03:30, 28 May 2011 (UTC))[reply]
There's a difference between a money transfer company's services being abused by people who use them for illicit purposes despite company safeguards, and said money transfer company actually being complicit in terrorist activity. This has been repeatedly demonstrated above, with allusions to the convicted Mumbai terrorists who availed themselves of Western Union's services despite the company's extant anti-terrorism safeguards. Your indicating that "terrorists and people affiliated with terrorists have used Dahabshiil to send/receive funds" therefore does not mean much, even if we ignore the fact that Barre, Arale and Al-Barakaat were all cleared of terror financing allegations and Dahabshiil itself has never been under any formal investigation in relation to alleged terrorist funding. You also do not appear to understand how Wikipedia's WP:NOR/No Original Research policy works: Sources must directly and explicitly support what is indicated in the article: "even with well-sourced material, if you use it out of context, or to advance a position not directly and explicitly supported by the source, you are engaging in original research". You can't join together various sources -- some of which don't even mention Dahabshiil, as I've pointed out -- to put forth an argument that the references themselves do not make. That is called synthesis and is not allowed on this website. Lastly, consensus has already more or less formed. Both Biggleswiki and I agree that the material is inappropriate for the reasons extensively documented above, as does the user that I said I would be contacting for a third opinion. Here's what he wrote: "I think you stated it clearly with regard to WP:BURDEN. I agree with you the sources don't exist to support what he is saying. But I also don't see that conversation is going anywhere". That said, I'll give Biggleswiki the opportunity to respond before deciding on the next course of action. Middayexpress (talk) 19:36, 28 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Getting an Administrator involved is the only resolution to this issue. I have tried over and over again to accommodate you, but you refuse to come to a compromise of any sort. You keep accusing me of using original research and every time I reply to something you've said, you reiterate the same thing you've been saying since the very beginning without addressing anything that I've said. It has also become obvious that you have some grudge towards me so I will not be wasting any more of my time trying to reason with you. I believe my contribution is of value and I have used verifiable sources to back up everything I have stated in the passage and I will not be bullied into having the passage deleted. (Bot3skfjs (talk) 22:27, 28 May 2011 (UTC))[reply]

Update[edit]

User:Bot3skfjs has been indefinitely blocked for abusing multiple accounts/socking. Middayexpress (talk) 18:14, 29 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Edits[edit]

Zahra Ahmed (talk) 06:48, 30 May 2011 (UTC) I have removed certain sections from the article which don’t have anything to do with Dahabshiil, including large junks about other Hawal’s (I will added it to the relevant Wiki page instead) but it seems pointless expansion of this page to write about other Hawal’s.[reply]

I have changed the references in some parts (Somali chat forums cannot really be classed as reference)- this is not yet complete and I might have missed some.

Lastly I have removed the section "Controversy" as it based on hearsay and largely referenced to sunatimes, galmudug and waagacusub who clearly have a personal battle with Dahabshiil, owned and operated by Dahir Alasow. This is page is not suppose to be an extension of their claims and accusations, just like it is not suppose to be an advert for dahabshiil. As far as I am aware there is no evidence or even grounds to indicate absurd assertions on this section including Dahabshiil hiring a hit man or putting up a reward for a Somali entertains death.

On the whole the section contained factual errors and largely based on hearsay, supported by Alaswo own propaganda[ which could be included on his page and Saado’s page]. But serve no purpose on this page. Most importantly Dahabshiil has never been investigated for terrorism and all links with Al-Barkat were dropped. The agent in Pakistan was cleared of all charges and released, so to indicate that Dahabshiil is heavily involved in terrorism is baseless.

I also noticed that the references do not back up the claims made (aside from Alasow's own page) you cannot attribute a point to a source when the same point was not made in the source.

Hello. You of course raise valid points with regard to the dubious charges of impropriety. Aside from that, however, your edit is in many places almost identical to material that was already redacted in the past; particularly with regard to the civil war and the Somali Shilling, neither of which are the subject of this article (refer to this earlier discussion). As such, it repeats many of the same mistakes and arguments made in that section, and which, through a long discussion process that resulted in a consensus version, were thoroughly revised. The new "Media Coverage" section, moreover, seems superfluous and promotional, which Wikipedia does not allow (please see WP:NOTADVERTISING). The consensus version has therefore been restored, as has the company franchise photo that was also removed. Any major changes will first have to be discussed, appraised and agreed to per the WP:BRD cycle. Also, please note that this page is being closely monitored by admins as a consequence of the recent disruptive activity on it. Best regards, Middayexpress (talk) 18:25, 30 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Hello all - I agree with Middayexpress that the consensus version is a balanced and up-to-date account of this company's activities which was arrived at via a lengthy discussion. It is as well-sourced and rigorous as it can be I think. I am glad to see that Bot3skfjs has been blocked as he refused to acknowledge that his sources didn't support the claims he was making and became increasingly belligerent the more this was pointed out to him. Biggleswiki (talk) 11:31, 31 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Zahra Ahmed (talk) 12:05, 31 May 2011 (UTC) I agree and I am happy with this version, close enough to what it use to say before it all went a bit crazy recently. Kind regards. Dahabshiil Company threats to the Somali media (Sunatimes.com) To the all independent media and international human rights group that adheres to freedom of speech, we would like to display here some documents which illuminate the constant suppression and threats from the Somali remittance company called“Dahabshiil”to the Somali independent media namely this website “sunatimes” Dahabshiil allocates huge sum of funding to padlock this website and actioned their crooked plan first time onWednesday 27 October, 2010time shut down from 11:06-0600 Dahabshiil lawyers wrote to our hosting company Bluehost and they instructed them to put us off air, however Bluehost reinstated our service later. Dahabshiil utilizes plenty of money to bolt on Somali websites such as Sunnatimes.com. These websites and other independent media reports an issues that displeases Dahabshiil bosses, therefore they use their vast money to silence us. Sunatimes belongs to 18 Somali journalists and 17 of those live in Africa where only one resides in Europe. Dahabshiil succeeded to shut us down again on13thof December 2010 17.34-0700. When some journalist from Sunatimes refuses to accept bribe from Dahabshiil Company they took lawsuit actions against the only journalist who lives in Europe, fortunately the Netherlands court in Breda had thrown out the Dahabshiil lawsuit in which they demanded one of the web article that discloses the business interest they had with Somaliland government been taken down. Court decision file no: BP3480 Breda Court: read it on this link. http://www.rechtspraak.nl/Organisatie/Rechtbanken/Breda/Nieuws/Pages/Vordering-Dahabshiil-afgewezen.aspx Dahabshiil paid some vicious cirles in Somalia to hunt down the chief editor of sunatimes.com Mr Abdisalam Abdulle Yusuf, fortunately he was tipped off and he fled from Mogadishu, Somalia. Dahabshiil had once again shut down Sunatimes.com on 17 March 2011, 12:05-0600—this led sunatimes.com moving their hosting service to another company called Ileystech Company. Again, Dahabshiil let up their campaign against Sunatimes.com and their lawyers wrote to Ileystech co by informing them that sunatimes.com violated copyrights, they demanded that article be removed from the website or else they would hold the hosting company responsible. That article related to the failed lawsuit that Dahabshiil brought against the Somali journalists. See attached letter of Bird and Bird LLP. Date: Wed, 27 Apr 2011 10:01:37 +0100. Ileystech closed thesunatimes.comwebsite after the bigAcenet Inc threatened to shut down its Server ,Anyone, who reads the Dahabshiil lawsuits could see that they are at war with Somali independent media. To our astonishments was that Dahabshiil demanded on their letter to remove two contents on Sunatimes’website. One content related to a song sang by famous Somali artist: Sada Ali Warsame. The song named Dhiigshiil, which she puts nice lyrics with beautiful voice to outline the ill intentions of Dahabshiil including their support of terror and lawlessness in Somalia. The other was an article about the court decision at Breda. The harassment and suppression of Dahabshiil Remittance Company have not only touched Sunatimes.com but another 37 Somali media outlets had issued press release to protest Dahabshiil’s continuous threats against Somali Independent Media.Read it here: http://www.galmudugnews.com/2011/04/13/34-website-oo-warsaxaafadeed-ka-soo-saaray-shirkadda-dhiigshiil http://www.badweyn.com/04/37-website-oo-warsaxaafadeed-ka-soo-saaray-shirkadda-dhiigshiil-oo-ugu-horeeso-shabakada-badweyn-com/ The links of Dahabshiil to the Al-qaida was posted to the Wiki leaks, Files ofGuantanamo Bay, please read it here. .http://wikileaks.ch/gitmo/pdf/so/us9so-000567dp.pdf Sunatimes.com isInvestigative media with sense of professionalism, fearless in cultivating the truth, informative, unbiased, independent, educative, a role model and a voice to the voiceless Source : http://sunatimes.com/view.php?id=1546[reply]

NPOV[edit]

I flagged the article because of this. I don't have the time to check every source right now or if information from reliable source were removed. But we should check the history of this article. --Neo139 (talk) 19:00, 6 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

a "former" employee[edit]

This edit introduced the adjective "former" employee. Both the DoD, in its allegations against him, and the employee in question, said that he was an employee at the time of his capture.

I have no problem recognizing that the PR firm, in their bragging about subverting the wikipedia, wanted to characterize him as a "former" employee. But I don't think we should repeat that claim, in the article, as an unchallenged fact. So I removed "former". Geo Swan (talk) 01:57, 20 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

I removed "former"[edit]

The lead section described Mohammed Sulaymon Barre as a "former" Dahashiil employee. But this contradicts both his own testimony and Peter Finn's description of his case in the Washington Post. I don't believe there are any reliable sources to support describing him as a "former" employee. Rather it was the internet line he required to operate his branch that drew Pakistani security official to look at him.

So I removed the modifier "former". Geo Swan (talk) 16:24, 6 June 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Someone removed an entire section of this article, apparently without explanation[edit]

There was a section entitled "Accusations that Dahabshiil tried to suppress unwanted press coverage". It was removed with explanation a month ago. I restored it.

Was this the work of Bell Pottinger employees? I don't know. Geo Swan (talk) 12:43, 20 March 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Series of hard blows for Dahabshiil -Indian Ocean newsletter[edit]

Series of hard blows for Dahabshiil The funds transfer company Dahabshiil, headed by Abdirashid Duale, son of the founder of Group Mohamed Said Duale, is going through a bad patch.http://www.africaintelligence.com/ION/business-circles/2013/04/12/series-of-hard-blows-for-dahabshiil,107955308-ART Until recently, Dahabshiil, was a leading financial services and funds transfer company in the Horn of Africa for the Somalian Diaspora, operated throughout Somalia, even in the zones held by the Al-Shabaab radical Islamists, without encountering any major problems. However, the explosion at its Mogadishu headquarters in the Bakara market on 2 April could be a turning point for it. Since then, many of its clients have asked their relatives abroad to use a different company to send them their monthly remittance, citing security issues as the reason. Moreover, a few days before this explosion, Dahabshiil had temporarily shut ten offices in the Hiraan, Bay and Bakool regions, after the Al Shabaab had banned it from operating. Mohamed Said Duale Ahmed Mohamed Mahamoud Silanyo. The explosion triggered by a remote-controlled device injured two guards and came hours after verbal threats from al Shabab militants. Issued by Sheikh Mukhtar Robow Abu Mansur, a senior commander, the threat also called on Somalis in much of central and southern Somalia to boycott the financial institution. This was reechoed by another senior al Shabab leader, Mahad Warsame Qalley as unkown (Karate), head of the group's assassins. "Every six months, Dahabshiil used to pay $500,000 (USD). They have refused to pay that money and insist on paying $100,000. To make matter worse, they have joined with infidel governments to offer rewards and bounty on the heads of Mujahideen leaders. This was discovered by al Shabab intelligence," he said. People fearing for their lives this week urged their relatives abroad to send their monthly income by other alternatives including other Somali money transfer companies. "I am fearful of visiting Dahabshiil branches because these guys (al Shabab) can carry out suicide attacks at any given time," remittance receiver Mohamed Haji told local Media. It is not just Dahabshiil's Mogadishu branches who will be out of pocket. Their clients in Bay, Bakol, Hiiraan, Lower and Middle Shabelle regions have not been shielded from the threats. Investigators from the Somali Federal government and its ally Ahlu Sunna group said the explosion that rocked the bank's headquarter was an inside job. They revealed that due to international pressure for Dahabshiil to come clean of its links to al Shabab, the bank planted the bomb itself to make it appear that it was under attack. It is believed that Dahabshiil has close working ties to “al Afghani” Ibrahim Haji Jama Mead (Ibrahim Afghani), a rival faction of al Shabab to Mukhtar Robow. In recent times, Dahabshiil and Somalia's breakaway region of Somaliland have been accused of sponsoring terrorism by intelligence groups. The findings have prompted the United States and the United Kingdom to both issue early this year separate travel warnings to the breakaway state. The leader of Somaliland, Ahmed Silanyo, was secretly asked to take practical steps against terrorism by Western governments. Somali leaders including the Puntland region accused Somaliland leadership of not being sincere in efforts to fight terrorism. Just months ago, the minister of Presidency, Hirsi Ali Haji Hassan, released more than eleven suspected terrorists from Somaliland prisons. The suspects include the murderers of an Italian aid worker who was shot dead in 2003 in Somaliland region. Hirsi, who is also a senior manager of Dahabshiil's subsidiary telecommunication firm, SomTel, was arrested in 2008 on suspicion of terrorism. Dahabshiil and Ahmed Silanyo, who has shares in the bank, are feeling huge pressure from the international community. The bank fears of its assets being frozen. Western Intelligence says Dahabshiil will suspended soon as they have a proof of terror support. Sources said its possible that first Security Council resulotion ordered to shut down Dahabshiil Finance over the World. The Islamists could thereby be making Dahabshiil’s founder, , pay for his unflinching support for the President of Somaliland known as “”, whose government has just begun to go after radical Islamists in Hargeisa (ION 1351). To cap it all, Dahabshiil has had a new competitor for the supply of telecoms and banking services in the south and centre of Somalia. It is the group, partly owned by the former head of - NOW DAHABSHIIL IS GOING THE ROAD OF AL BARAKAAT - BACK UP INTELLIGENCE REPORT . — Preceding unsigned comment added by 77.170.26.219 (talk) 09:27, 13 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Blast rocks Dahabshiil bank headquarters in Mogadishu[edit]

Bomb hits Somalia's biggest bank after militant threat 

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By Abdi Sheikh

MOGADISHU | Tue Apr 2, 2013 7:45pm BST

(Reuters) - A bomb exploded outside the headquarters of Somalia's biggest bank on Tuesday, wounding at least two people hours after al Qaeda-linked militants ordered the company cease operations in areas under their control.

The blast outside Dahabshiil's office in Mogadishu shattered its doors and littered the area with debris, police said. FREE GUIDES AND REPORTS FROM DIANOMI ADVERTISEMENT Top 10 Retirement Tips Top 10 Retirement Tips - Special 16 page guide Download Free Guide

"A remote-controlled bomb planted in front of Mogadishu's Dahabshiil bank and money transfer headquarters injured two guards," police captain Nur Hassan told Reuters.


Earlier, members of Islamist group al Shabaab walked into Dahabshiil branches in areas of Somalia under their control and demanded they close, accusing the company of working for aid agencies they have banned in their territories, according to a statement on the movement's website.

Money transfer firms like Dahabshiil are vital to the Horn of Africa country's fractured economy, which lacks a developed banking sector after 20 years of civil conflict.

Security in the coastal capital Mogadishu has improved greatly since al Shabaab fled the city after a military offensive in August 2011. But bombings and assassinations - blamed on militants - are still frequent.

Police said they had yet to identify who was behind the blast, but that a mobile phone attached to the device was used to detonate it. It was the first such attack to target a bank.

"The explosion crashed open the main entrance glass window but good luck it was dark, and customers were not near," a Dahabshiil worker, who asked not to be named, told Reuters.

Somalis typically transfer money via "hawala" agents, an informal system based on trust, including $2 billion (1.3 billion pounds) the Mogadishu government says Somalis abroad send home every year.

Dahabshiil declined to comment on the threats by Shabaab, which in 2010 briefly banned money transfers by mobile phone, saying it helped feed Western capitalism.

"I heard they accused us of allowing aid agencies to send cash through our bank," Dahabshiil employee Sabdow Ali said from the al Shabaab-controlled southern town of Hudur.

Al Shabaab has thrown out more than a dozen humanitarian groups from areas under its control in the past three years, including the United Nations' food agency, the International Committee of the Red Cross and Islamic Relief.

The militants say aid creates dependency.

In control of much of the capital Mogadishu between 2009 and 2011, the group has been driven from most major cities in central and southern Somalia by African Union peacekeepers.

But in rural areas its fighters are notorious for amputating thieves' limbs and stoning to death women suspected of adultery, under a strict interpretation of sharia, Islamic law.

(Additional reporting by Feisal Omar; Writing by James Macharia; Editing by Jason Webb) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 77.170.26.219 (talk) 09:33, 13 April 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Barclays[edit]

There isn't any information regarding the recent and well-publicised court case between Dahabshiil and Barclays. If someone could review my proposed content below and add it to the article if acceptable. Please note that Dahabshiil is my client, however I hope to work with the Wikipedia community to ensure this article is accurate. Thanks, Vivj2012 (talk) 16:34, 8 November 2013 (UTC)[reply]

In May 2013 Barclays announced its decision to end the banks business relationship with Dahabshiil, citing the lack of ‘strong anti-laundering governance structures.’ The decision was delayed after British lawmakers lobbied Barclays.Bloomberg In July 2013 Mo Farah, the Somali-born Olympic gold medallist, called on Barclays to delay its plans.The Daily Telegraph On Tuesday 5 November 2013 the High Court in London granted an interim injunction preserving the banking arrangement between Dahasbhiil and Barclays until the conclusion of a full trial.BBC All Africa Judge Launcelot Henderson described Barclays’ decision to terminate Dahabshiil’s account as ‘unfair’, requesting a detailed examination into the reasons behind the banks decision.Zegabi
I've added this content because it seems informative and neutral enough. Thank you for making the request, rather than adding it yourself. Jehochman Talk 18:30, 21 November 2013 (UTC)[reply]
Yeah, seems alright. Middayexpress (talk) 19:06, 21 November 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Barclays's letter to Dahabshiil & Dahabshiil's statement regarding Bell Pottinger's activities in December 2011[edit]

1. Barclays's letter:
The phrase ‘...citing a lack of "strong anti-laundering governance structures”’ comes from this article on Bloomberg (also republished here on Bloomberg Businessweek). This, however, is at odds with this BBC article, which quotes a letter from Barclays to Dahabshiil that makes it clear that the former's decision was based on sector risk and not on any company-specific concerns about Dahabshiil's AML or CTF controls:
'The decision to exit our business relationship with you is not a negative reflection of your anti-money laundering standards, nor a belief that your business has been unwittingly been a conduit for financial crime.'
This is a fairly unusual scenario as two neutral and reputable sources seem to be contradicting each other. Obviously there has to be an explanation for the situation with Barclays, however, so perhaps the most sensible solution is a succinct outline of both pieces of coverage, for example:
'In May 2013, Barclays announced its decision to end its business relationship with Dahabshiil.1 While Bloomberg reported in October 2013 that Barclays had cited a lack of a lack of "strong anti-laundering governance structures", a June 2013 article on the BBC website had quoted a letter from Barclays to Dahabshiil which made it clear that Barclays's action was a "commercial decision due to the risks of the sector", and was not based on concerns about the AML standards of Dahabshiil itself, or on any belief that Dahabshiil had been a "conduit for financial crime".'2 3
2. Dahabshiil's statement concerning Bell Pottinger's failure to disclose its COI in 2011:
In December 2011 Dahabshiil stated that it had no knowledge of Bell Pottinger's conduct in regard to its Wikipedia article. This 7 December 2011 article on the Bureau of Investigative Journalism quotes a Dahabshiil spokesperson as saying:
'We have never heard of Biggleswiki, and know nothing about them. We are currently trying to get to the bottom of this and get information as to what is said to have happened. We can certainly confirm that we have never asked anyone to do anything other than tell the truth about Dahabshiil.'
This is an important statement by Dahabshiil of its position at the time that is currently not reflected in the article.
If someone could get back to me on these two points that would be much appreciated. Many thanks. Vivj2012 (talk) 15:49, 17 December 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Factual inaccuracies on the page[edit]

I am an external director of Dahabshiil and have noticed that there are a few factual inaccuracies on this page. 1. Dahabshiil is present in "126" countries, not "140" countries <http://www.dahabshiil.com/>. 2. The company is not "managed by Awale Group Holding which has taken over significant shares in Dahabshill" (the reference included does not even state this to be the case)<http://www.webcitation.org/query?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.ft.com%2Fintl%2Fcms%2Fs%2F0%2Fafae0e64-8630-11e0-9e2c-00144feabdc0.html%23axzz1NaW6lBKi&date=2011-12-10>. Would anyone object to me making these amends? Mr LMA Wiki (talk) 16:40, 14 April 2015 (UTC) Mr LMA Wiki[reply]

 Done Middayexpress (talk) 19:12, 14 April 2015 (UTC)[reply]

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This message was posted before February 2018. After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{source check}} (last update: 18 January 2022).

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Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 05:37, 7 November 2017 (UTC)[reply]

External links modified[edit]

Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just modified 5 external links on Dahabshiil. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:

When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.

This message was posted before February 2018. After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{source check}} (last update: 18 January 2022).

  • If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with this tool.
  • If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with this tool.

Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 22:01, 4 January 2018 (UTC)[reply]

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