Talk:Foreign workers in Saudi Arabia

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Ideas for development[edit]

  • I was thinking about fleshing this article out as follows:

Background

  • Pertinent information about the country, including why it needs so much foreign labour, economic conditions, what native Saudis do, and other general yet pertinent information

Skilled workers

  • About skilled labourers, where they work, etc.

Migrant workers About persons in lower class jobs, blue collars and maids etc. Include a subsection on human rights issues.

Any thoughts? — Crisco 1492 (talk) 13:18, 14 January 2013 (UTC)[reply]

I've added in a section on "Composition and numbers" to give an overview. Happy to go with the skilled v. migrant headings to see how it goes. An alternative would be to do it on the basis of the experience of national groups, such as: (1) South and east Asians; (2) other Arabs (3) westerners, with a separate section on Human Rights covering all of them (I think there may be some human rights points to cover in the skilled section). But, as I say, happy to go with current structure.
Once that's done, I think additionally two areas that can be added are: (A) impact on Saudi Society. Issues there include (i) lethargy - effect on the Saudi psyche on having others do the bulk of the country's economic activity; (ii) resentment - part in the rise of opposition to the regime, Islamism etc (iii) the government response i.e. Saudization, or the lack of it. (B) Impact on the home countries of the migrants, economic and political impact. DeCausa (talk) 17:00, 14 January 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • Sounds very good. I'll try and give this some more work later today (focus on the oil industry, I guess) — Crisco 1492 (talk) 22:40, 14 January 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • Just wanted to pop my head in and say you two are doing excellent work. The human rights situation (the only part I'm knowledgeable about) seems well covered, but I'll be glad to return later to do copyediting, etc. -- Khazar2 (talk) 17:12, 15 January 2013 (UTC)[reply]
yes, thanks. Also, thanks to Crisco for the idea, and also getting it going. DeCausa (talk) 23:12, 15 January 2013 (UTC)[reply]
  • I think you're the one who deserves the thanks, for bringing more specialised knowledge about the subject. I'm not quite familiar with the Middle East (including Saudi Arabia) — Crisco 1492 (talk) 23:22, 15 January 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Numbers[edit]

I've put in the section "Composition and numbers" a cut and paste of the numbers breakdown from the Saudi Arabia article. This is a reminder for future reference that:

  • there's quite a divergence in the sources on the numbers and there's probably a need for a survey + range for each country of origin rather than a fixed number.
  • the numbers are total non-nationals not just work-force (i.e. inclusive of family members). For many of the nationalities (migrant workers alone) they are one and the same, but for others they are not e.g I think total westerners are 100,000, but if you take out the families it is more like 40,000,

Both the above points means the numbers section needs adjustment (with citations) in due course. DeCausa (talk) 23:46, 15 January 2013 (UTC)[reply]

GA Review[edit]

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This review is transcluded from Talk:Foreign workers in Saudi Arabia/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Reviewer: Harrias (talk · contribs) 11:02, 11 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]

I didn't really mean to come and review this, but I got interested in the article, and ended up reading the whole thing. I figured I might as well, therefore, review it! The article is generally very well written and well-referenced. I've carried out a few spot-checks for copyvio and close para-phrasing, which reveal nothing, but on the whole I will AGF given that it is written by an editor of good standing.

The lead appears slightly short, although reading it, it does appear to adequately summarise the article, so I have no real concerns. The article does lack images, but it is unsurprising that there aren't any relevant images to include, so again there is no real issue there.

I think the linking in the article could be improved: a few terms are linked later in the article than their first use, or linked more than once: Western world, for example is not linked until the Composition and numbers section, despite being mentioned in both the lead and the Background and history section. The list of nationalities in the Composition and numbers section should be more consistent in the articles it links to: there are links to XXX in Saudi Arabia, the country itself (Yemen), the people (Egyptians) and XXX diaspora. I appreciate there is an inconsistency in which countries have each sort of article, but this could be confusing for someone following these links. There is an article on Egyptian diaspora that could be linked to, and Yemeni diaspora redirects to Demographics of Yemen#Diaspora, which would be more useful than Yemen for the link, possibly.

In the Background and history section, the third sentence begins "As a result, in the post-war years.." but there is no mention of which war. I assume the Second World War, but this should be made clear. Later in that section you place the term "guest workers" in quotation marks with little explanation of the term: is it simply a alternative phrase for "foreign workers"?

In the Abuse and scandals section, there is a link to Death row. I have no real issue with this, but the death row article is very US-centric, and actually specifies that the term only applies to English-speaking countries. It is only of a side concern to this review, but it does sort of render the link inappropriate to this article. In that section, there is discussion about "in the millions of riyal" having to be paid: it might be useful to provide a note giving a rough estimate of how much this equates to in USD? I also made a small copy-edit relating to the acronym HRW.

Although I have written lots, the issues with the article are only very minor, and I found the article very interesting, on a subject that I had no knowledge of at all previously. Well done. Harrias talk 11:02, 11 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]

  • Thanks for the comments! Replies follow
Western world - Thought this would have been overlinking, but I guess "Western" (from the West) and "western" (from a westerly direction) may not be enough distinction, so linked. Removed later link
Countries: All links should now either point to the country or the subarticle on said nationality in Saudi Arabia at first mention. Have removed several repeat links.
Post-war years: Right, WWII. Done
"guest workers" - Linked to Guest worker program
Death row: Can't think of another English-language term that sums up the concept as well (and note that several sources use it).
Currency: Have added a short note using the rates given by Google
  • Thanks muchly for the review, from me and my co-nom DeCausa. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 11:31, 11 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]
    • Thanks for those fixes; I'm happy enough with the article now, although I note that there is still some inconsistency in the links to either a nation or "So-and-sos in Saudi Arabia", but it certainly isn't enough of a problem to hold up the review. Good work! Harrias talk 16:46, 11 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Photographs[edit]

Nicely done, but really could use some photos of foreign workers!♦ Dr. Blofeld 17:02, 12 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]

  • I know! Nothing on Commons though, and I'm certainly a ways away from the country. — Crisco 1492 (talk) 13:37, 15 October 2013 (UTC)[reply]

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