Talk:Heather Heying

Claim that Heather Heying is spreading misinformation is disinformation

There are multiple studies that point to the potential toxicity of the spike protein:

SARS-CoV-2 Spike Protein and Lung Vascular Cells, SARS-CoV-2 Spike Protein Elicits Cell Signaling in Human Host Cells: Implications for Possible Consequences of COVID-19 Vaccines, SARS-CoV-2 binds platelet ACE2 to enhance thrombosis in COVID-19

Considering PolitiFact as a source of the fact check is ironic. They just admitted that their "Pants on Fire Lie" rating of the lab leak hypothesis was false. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Shinshinshingan (talk • contribs) 06:54, 2 July 2021 (utc) (UTC)

You posted the same thing at Bret Weinstein. It is irrelevant here too. Alexbrn (talk) 06:56, 2 July 2021 (UTC)

Care to explain why, instead of expecting readers to waste time searching the Bret "talk" page? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 209.204.220.84 (talk) 18:59, 4 July 2021 (UTC)

At last but not least: Lab leak theory is no longer considered a misinormation. --AsiBakshish (talk) 10:43, 21 March 2022 (UTC)

Alexbrn, as a senior Wikipedia contributor I ask You, what are You going to do in order not to slander Bret Weinstein and Heather Heying? Or has Wikipedia become a tool o willingly slander people? Do You still see the current state as appropriate? --AsiBakshish (talk) 12:17, 22 March 2022 (UTC)

It's fine. I've added more appropriate links. Alexbrn (talk) 12:50, 22 March 2022 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 4 July 2021

Change "fears" to fears 104.178.252.234 (talk) 00:35, 4 July 2021 (UTC)

 Done Terasail^[✉️] 02:03, 4 July 2021 (UTC)

 Not done. Undone. It's a quoted word from the source, and should not be in Wikivoice. Alexbrn (talk) 03:00, 4 July 2021 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 4 July 2021 (2)

INCORRECT: "Weinstein and his wife Heather Heying have spread misinformation about the COVID-19 pandemic on numerous occasions.[5][6][7]"

PROBLEM: The claim is a logical fallacy [appeal to authority] and is in NO way scientific. The sources cited, Vice, Politico and Reuters, are NOT scientific sources.

To be clear, Weinstein and his wife, Heather Heying, are exploring two COVID-19 hypotheses: 1. COVID-19 may have escaped a viral lab in Wuhan, China. 2. Ivermectin, a ubiquitous and affordable drug with a long-standing record of safety and efficacy, may be safe and efficacious as a prophylaxis and treatment for COVID-19.

Weinstein and Heying have had esteemed scientific experts on his Darkhorse podcast, now threatened by YouTube censorship, including the inventor of the mRNA vaccine, Dr. Robert Malone. Malone agrees and validates Weinstein's hypotheses related to lab leak, Ivermectin, and COVID-19 vaccine hazards, specifically toxicity of spike proteins.

This Wikipedia page is NOT correct, and is politicizing a public health issue, shutting down critical thinking and public dialog, and Dr. Weinstein's professional reputation is impuned. It appears Wikipedia's incorrect claim is political -- not factual -- by design. The censorious nature of Wikipedia's false claim is deeply alarming.

Weinstein and his wife, Heather Heying, are not advancing misinformation. To the contrary, they are advancing and exploring QUESTIONS and HYPOTHESES, the questions to which are not yet clear or definitive. Furthermore, Weinstein and his wife are NOT anti-vax. They believe that futher conversation will inevitably lead to scientific evidence supporting public health measures benefitting all humanity.

REQUEST FOR CORRECTION:

Wikipedia could make a simple correction:

"Weinstein and his wife are well-known for employing scientific methodology, exploring controversial hypotheses and questions related to origin, hazards and treatments associated with COVID-19."

I submit this request in good faith. Thank you for your time and serious consideration.

SOURCE: Dr. Robert Malone

RW Malone MD, LLC’s was co-founded and managed by Dr. Malone.

The inventor of mRNA vaccines and one of world’s foremost experts on messenger mRNA therapeutics - having invented the field in 1988, Dr. Malone has extensive research and development experience in the areas of pre-clinical discovery research, clinical trials, vaccines, gene therapy, bio-defense, and immunology. He has over twenty years of management and leadership experience in academia, pharmaceutical and biotechnology industries, as well as in governmental and non-governmental organizations. 76.92.26.208 (talk) 06:55, 4 July 2021 (UTC)

 Not done. Answered elsewhere. Malone's claims about himself are not verified by independent sources. Alexbrn (talk) 07:00, 4 July 2021 (UTC)

Semi-protected edit request on 5 July 2021

Hello,

According to your policy for administrators to edit wikipedia pages, " Administrators... are expected to observe a high standard of conduct, to use the tools fairly, and never to use them to gain advantage in a dispute." There has been a serious campaign to silence Bret Weinstein and Heather Heying, who are evolutionary biologists, careful thinkers, and look at up to date science and report on the science involving the pandemic from around the world. YouTube has been working with our government ( https://taibbi.substack.com/p/a-case-of-intellectual-capture-on ) to keep Bret Weinstein and Heather Heying from talking about repurposed drugs that seem to work. I realize it sounds improbable, but I've been witnessing it in real time, all the while checking into Bret and Heather's sources as they post/show them. I've found multiple articles from the NIH on the data Bret and Heather are reporting on regarding Ivermectin: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/34145166/ ; https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/33278625/ ; https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8088823/

Please delete the sentence saying "Heying and her husband Bret Weinstein have spread misinformation about the COVID-19 pandemic on numerous occasions.[3][4]". Regarding the spike protein and cytotoxicity [3][4], I refer you to another NIH article calling into question the spike protein, which is a conservative view on the topic: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7827936/. A quote from another published article: "In the new study, the researchers created a “pseudovirus” that was surrounded by SARS-CoV-2 classic crown of spike proteins, but did not contain any actual virus. Exposure to this pseudovirus resulted in damage to the lungs and arteries of an animal model—proving that the spike protein alone was enough to cause disease". This is from the Salk Institute, which links to the actual study in this article: https://www.salk.edu/news-release/the-novel-coronavirus-spike-protein-plays-additional-key-role-in-illness/.

Please also delete the section on Heying's Wikipedia page, "Further information: COVID-19 misinformation Both Heying and Weinstein have said that they have taken ivermectin to guard against COVID-19 and that they not been vaccinated because of their "fears" about COVID-19 vaccines. Heying compared the use of ivermectin for this purpose to taking anti-malarial drugs.[20] There is no good evidence of benefit from ivermectin in preventing or treating COVID-19.[21][22]" You may keep the part saying, "On January 29, 2021 Heying appeared on Real Time with Bill Maher along with Weinstein, presenting the "Lab Leak" hypothesis around the origins of SARS-CoV-2.[19]", as it is true. For this deletion request, I refer you to the initial NIH articles regarding Ivermectin's potential efficacy above. For convenience, here they are again: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/34145166/ ; https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/33278625/ ; https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8088823/. To be clear, I am not asking for a replacement at this time. Please simply delete these sections and work with Heather Heying on what to replace them with. I am sure she will be more than fair in describing herself for others to see.

In the future, I would strongly encourage all the administrators from Wikipedia to look for data from medical journals regarding COVID-19, not news media. When reading medical journals, always be sure to check the conflicts of interest sections, financial disclosures, and the comments, if any. These sections in a medical journal are a secondary source of scrutiny on medical journals and their robustness of methodology and accuracy of reporting data.

Thank you,

Katelyn Woodworth 76.17.212.95 (talk) 02:17, 5 July 2021 (UTC)

 Not done This is essentially the same edit request with the same links as you made on Talk:Bret Weinstein#Protected edit request on 4 July 2021. Not done for essentially the same reason. e.g. sources are not WP:RSMED Adakiko (talk) 05:43, 5 July 2021 (UTC)

@76.17.212.95 not done, because you don't agree with the conclusions. The use of ivermectin, lab leak etc. have further been substantiated.

https://wokeguru.org/brazil-study-shows-ivermectin-prophylaxis-reduces-covid-19-mortality-90-percent-hospitalizations-deaths-2021/

https://ncats.nih.gov/news/releases/2021/large-clinical-trial-to-study-repurposed-drugs-to-treat-covid-19-symptoms

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S1201971221009887

https://www.independent.co.uk/asia/japan/ivermectin-omicron-japan-kowa-co-b2004901.html

There is plenty of evidence in support of their discussions. Whoever is doing these replies, actually LOOK at the other side. All the other side has large financial incentive to silence this side. No one profits, however, from the ivermectin. The lower and middle class, and largely minorities could be helped if this information were found to be correct. Let the discussion happen. LysolPionex (talk) 16:39, 19 March 2022 (UTC)

Modification proposal

Two changes need to be made to this article. I provide the corrections required, a summary of the supporting background information plus context, as well as the sources.

Under the section personal life sub heading covid 19. Two points, one statement is clearly defamatory the other contains a FALSE statement that spreads medical misinformation :

1. Defamatory statement reported as accurate and credible ( ie a famous oncologist claims Bret is spreading medical misinformation): "David Gorski, a surgical oncologist and scientist known for exposing pseudoscience,[39] described Weinstein as a prominent "COVID-19 contrarian and spreader of disinformation" who supports using ivermectin as a treatment for COVID-19.[40]" 2. False stament on page: " There is no good evidence of benefit from ivermectin in preventing or treating COVID-19.[42][43]"

1. Strike the claim reporting that Weinstein is spreading medical misinformation. Rationale: This content is defamatory especially when presented as an unchallenged pronouncement from an authoritative source who's ALSO making uninformed defamatory statements. The discussion of his ban from YouTube for violating their policy fails to report Alphabet' (YouTube's parent company) financial interest in the RNA vaccine company that holds the IP for the Moderna Vaccine, which under curent federal law would lose its emergency authorization to distribute vaccines if Ivermectin was acknowledged to be a safe reliable and effective treatment (reporting his YouTube ban as resulting from violating their policy against spreading medical misinformation without providing this context is misleading and also defamatory). Furthermore, the sources that were cited are low quality not reliable and contradict the extensive indepemdent scientific literature documented below. Giving the benefit of the douht to this wiki, the author is at best guilty of cherry picking the data. The actual literature available on this topic is extensive, peer reviewed, free financial coflicts of interest, high quality, internally consistent, consistent with our current understanding of biology, biochemistry, medicine, immunology, and virology, as well as providing results that were independently and repeatedly REPLICATED, bringing me to me the second requested edit.

2. Insert the text below in place of the text that currently says "There is no evidence..."

"Despite many individuals corporations and institutions with conflicting financial interests [127] attempting to smear Dr Weinstein over the issue of using Ivermectin to treat and prevent covid, he has consistently and accurately presented the FACTS surrounding this research which clearly demonstrates Ivermectin to be a safe and effective treatment, at great personal risk to his own financial wellbeing. To correct previously inaccurate statements circulating online it is important to state that the available scientific evidence clearly and overwhealmingly demonstrates that Ivermectin is a safe and effective treatment for covid. This statement is consistent with the WHO's published data on the subject and 7 other meta analyses examining over 60 studies using Cochrane methodology."[1], [2],...,[125],[126]

Rationale supporting the above changes: Currently all statements about Ivermectin in this article are flagrantly innaccurate and fundamentally antiscientific and unlike Bret Weinstein ACTIVELY promote medical misinformation, as there's a mountain of high quality evidence including 36 randomized controlled studies 32 peer reviewed articles covering over 18,000 participants all demonstrating that Ivermectin is effective along with dozens more establishing its mechanism of action and likely impact on the pandemic if widely adopted. [1],[2],...,[125],[126].

The science here is NOT CONTROVERSIAL. To see the current state of the science on Ivetmectin see the meta analysis published at ivmmeta.com as well as 8 other meta analyses they systematically review that are comsistent with their findings (including the results published by the WHO[OR]). Their analysis covers over 60 studies with more than 18,000 total participants meet the exclusion criteria for a Cochrane meta analysis that shows Ivetmectin performs as well if not better than the vaccine as prophylaxis, has a SIGNIFICANTLY superior safety profile to the vaccines, provides instant reliable protection (vs a wait for of up to 6 weeks for full immunity in the case of vaccines), and reduces mortality by 96% in those who are treated AFTER being infected.

The probability that an ineffective treatment generated results as positive as the 61 studies to date is estimated to be 1 in 354 billion (p = 0.0000000000028)

The WHO meta analysis cited above clearly establishes the effectiveness of Ivetmectin demonstrating an 81% improvement over control in the data they examined. The WHO position that references this report was formulated by a heavily politicized committee consisting of individuals with industry conflicts who claim there's insufficient evidence. Agian the WHO position INCONSISTENT with the numbers the WHO cites to justify their recommendations. These recommendations contradict those recently issued by another committee CORRECTLY recommending the approval of Ivermectin as a safe treatment for scabies on an order of magnitude less evidence (10 small trials with less than 900 total participants and less over all effectiveness).

Sources

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— Preceding unsigned comment added by 93.176.151.228 (talk • contribs) 22:23, 7 July 2021 (UTC)

TL:DR. I tell you what, I'll try to help. Of all those citations, tell us which of them are the best evidence to support your contention, whatever it is, bearing in mind WP:MEDRS, and I'm sure a few people will comment. -Roxy the grumpy dog. wooF 21:36, 7 July 2021 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 30 July 2021

The entire statement "covid19 misinformation" section is factually inaccurate and intentionally misleading. The sources linked do not vindicate the header statement. The statement is opinion and libel. It best be removed in it's entirety. Additionally, NIH has changed the recommendations regarding Ivermectin.

1. https://www.covid19treatmentguidelines.nih.gov/therapies/antiviral-therapy/ivermectin/clinical-data/ JR (talk) 01:13, 30 July 2021 (UTC)

 Not done for now: please establish a consensus for this alteration before using the {{edit extended-protected}} template. ––𝗙𝗼𝗿𝗺𝗮𝗹𝗗𝘂𝗱𝗲^(talk) 03:42, 30 July 2021 (UTC)

Worth noting that the citeation here does not support the contention of the OP. -Roxy the grumpy dog. wooF 06:32, 30 July 2021 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 30 July 2021 (2)

Second Paragraph of the COVID-19 Section

MISSING WORD. CHANGE: "...to guard against COVID-19 and that they not been vaccinated..." to "...to guard against COVID-19 and that they have not been vaccinated..." Sheepdog11 (talk) 19:40, 30 July 2021 (UTC)

 Done ScottishFinnishRadish (talk) 19:43, 30 July 2021 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 16 August 2021

Change "Both Heying and Weinstein have said that they have taken ivermectin to guard against COVID-19 and that they have not been vaccinated because of their "fears" about COVID-19 vaccines."

to

"Both Heying and Weinstein have said that they have taken ivermectin to guard against COVID-19 and that they have not been vaccinated because of their fears about COVID-19 vaccines." Reporter277 (talk) 16:58, 16 August 2021 (UTC)

 Not done for now: please establish a consensus for this alteration before using the {{edit semi-protected}} template. See previous request for the same change at #Semi-protected edit request on 4 July 2021. ‑‑ElHef (Meep?) 17:18, 16 August 2021 (UTC)

Strongly support this suggested edit. The use of scare quotes does not befit the proper encyclopedic tone of Wikipedia.

2601:5C2:300:6D80:ADD4:E6C:5C1C:C895 (talk) 04:40, 11 September 2021 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 26 October 2021

The line stating “there is no good evidence supporting the use of Ivermectin in COVID-19. Firstly, “good” is a subjective term that misleads readers who may not come from a scientific background. This should be amended to reflect the true standard of evidence that exists in scientific literature. It is dangerous and incorrect to conflate a lack of consensus with total lack of evidence as this sentence states in its present iteration. Attached bellow you will find 3 peer reviewed studies which refute the statement on the page currently and at the very least should guide an amendment stating that there have been both studies in support of and not.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8088823/

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8248252/

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/33278625/ 199.254.16.12 (talk) 16:01, 26 October 2021 (UTC)

 Not done for now: please establish a consensus for this alteration before using the {{edit extended-protected}} template. ScottishFinnishRadish (talk) 16:05, 26 October 2021 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 7 November 2021

I request that it be acknowledged that there is debate in the scientific and medical community about Ivermectin as a Covid treatment. Organisations like the Front Line Covid Critcal Care Allience do believe it is effective. https://covid19criticalcare.com/ivermectin-in-covid-19/ To state that there is no good evidence is not a representative statement, many believe there is good evidence and the split in opinion should be recognised instead of listing only the writers personal opinion. 90.249.245.98 (talk) 13:12, 7 November 2021 (UTC)

As this is not an edit request in the form Change A to B, no change will be made to the article. Worth noting that there really is no good evidence despite what this IP editor claims. Also note that no personal opinions have been used as sources, despite what the IP editor claims. Lastly, I've never heard of the Front Line Covid Critcal Care Allience, and their views certainly do not tally with the most reliable sources on the subject. -Roxy the sceptical dog. wooF 13:19, 7 November 2021 (UTC)

Haha, now that I have read the link I see that they appear to be involved with Kory, so no, they are unreliable as a source. -Roxy the sceptical dog. wooF 13:21, 7 November 2021 (UTC)

See Frontline COVID-19 Critical Care Alliance. Alexbrn (talk) 13:26, 7 November 2021 (UTC)

POV in "book review"

The "book review" in the "Post-Evergreen" section appears to be a polemic from the reviewer as a thinly veiled ad hominem attack on the subject (Above all, Heying and Weinstein are really annoying.). We need to remove this "review" and/or add other more genuine reviews for WP:BALANCE. Normchou ^💬 21:56, 16 November 2021 (UTC)

NPOV means reflecting decent sources, not removing stuff editors don't like. If there are other RS reviews they may be useful. Alexbrn (talk) 02:36, 17 November 2021 (UTC)

NPOV also means relevancy and dueness. And for WP:BLP, the bar is high. BTW, it seems you do understand NPOV means not removing stuff editors don't like, though you've left me with a quite different impression regarding this point given your editing history. Normchou ^💬 03:03, 17 November 2021 (UTC)

I believe I'm correct in saying NPOV does not mean "removing stuff editors don't like", and not sure your reference to my excellent editing history is relevant. But I see you're edit-warring your drive-by tag in. Let's see what others think. Alexbrn (talk) 03:10, 17 November 2021 (UTC)

My apologies - perhaps "your history" or "the editing history associated with you" would be better wording. And I was actually trying to make improvements, unlike the edit-warring that you just did. Normchou ^💬 03:22, 17 November 2021 (UTC)

Don't be obtuse, and remember to WP:FOC. Has the book had other reviews in RS like The Guardian? Alexbrn (talk) 03:31, 17 November 2021 (UTC)