Talk:Heinrich Rau

Heinrich Rau has been listed as one of the History good articles under the good article criteria. If you can improve it further, please do so. If it no longer meets these criteria, you can reassess it.

Article milestones
Date	Process	Result
December 29, 2011	Good article nominee	Listed

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Clean up[edit]

Informative article but seems to be a machine translation from the original German. Could some kind passing soul with a better knowledge of German than I tidy it up? It's a bit garbled in places. Roger 16:52, 25 April 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I changed a few things that were common errors of online translators, but the article still requires quite a bit of work. User:Jwaghray 18:56, 11 June 2007

I improved the article a bit. Feel free, to continue. --Henrig (talk) 09:12, 9 January 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Meanwhile I've widely expanded and improved the article. I assume, for native English speakers it should be more easy to correct last mistakes and make the article also stylistically full acceptable now. I think the Quality-template from 2007 can be removed now. --Henrig (talk) 17:58, 31 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I made a stab at improving the word flow in "early life to WW 1". I'm still not satisfied with it but it is better. Haverberg (talk) 15:46, 21 September 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Erich Rau[edit]

I deleted a paragraph which claims that Erich Rau is Heinrich Rau's son. He is not even a relative. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Tom-O-Mat (talk • contribs) 01:14, 29 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Werner Gertler, who in 1972–1973 was a close associate of Erich Rau in the by Erich Rau led National Organisation Committee for the festival, described him in his book -also readable in the linked file- as "the son of the antifascist 'Heinrich Rau'"! Henrig (talk) 07:40, 29 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Werner Gertler might have assumed that Erich Rau is the son of Heinrich Rau but this is definitly not right. The names of the sons of Heinrich Rau are Manfred, Heinrich and Thomas. Gertler has some more inconsitencies in his article with respect to the 'X. World Festival of Youth and Students' in 1973, e.g. Egon Krenz was not First Secretary of FDJ at this time. He was Chairman of the "Pionier Organisation". He became only in 1974 the First Secretay of FDJ. Moreover I see no relationship between Heinrich Rau and the renaming of the 'Walter Ulbricht Stadium' in 'Stadium of the World Youth'. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Tom-O-Mat (talk • contribs) 20:43, 30 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Hello Tom,

not mentioning the then correct position of Egon Krenz at this time is an excusable slip. But erroneously emphasizing Erich Rau as the son of Heinrich Rau would be, in German, a 'Dicker Hund'. (Gertler considered this relationship even more important than the not so well-known first name of the chairman of the organisation committee for the festival, whom he called elsewhere simply 'comrade Rau'.) Gertler should have known it! Therefore I've removed the certain passages for now, but I'm not sure!

At the moment there stands a source against an user. But you give the impression to be an insider. Is this impression correct or not? Are you perhaps even an insider, who could provide some pictures of HR, perhaps from his younger days? This would be superb and in this case I would also have different questions, also per mail. Kind regards Henrig (talk) 13:06, 31 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Hmm, Tom-O-Mat doesn't makes the impression of a vandal and I can't imagine, that a man like Werner Gertler here nowingly wrote the untruth. Thus it seems not unlikely to me, that there had been a rumour in the committee, that ER was the son of the well-known HR which Gertler believed. (I also assume, I could find people who would know the relationship. But it would be a bit laborious and there is no haste.) Thus, with this only one reference, I would leave this passage out. Henrig (talk) 05:42, 5 August 2011 (UTC)[reply]

GA Review[edit]

This review is transcluded from Talk:Heinrich Rau/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Reviewer: Hchc2009 (talk · contribs) 17:20, 25 November 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Update - looking pretty much there. I'll have a check through later, but hopefully we're very close to closing. Hchc2009 (talk) 08:14, 18 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

1. Well-written:

(a) the prose is clear and concise, and the spelling and grammar are correct;

Some work needed; if you can do the below, I'll give it a final ce once over.
"the German Revolution of 1918/19." - worth checking that this complies with the MOS ("Year ranges, like all ranges, are normally separated by an en dash, not a hyphen or slash: 2005–06 is a two-year range, whereas 2005/06 is a period of twelve months or less, such as a sports season or a financial year.")

Done.Henrig (talk) 08:12, 3 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

" he was a leading agricultural politician " - what's an agricultural politician? (I'm not sure if this is a politician from an agricultural area, or a politician specialising in agricultural issues)

Replaced with "agricultural policy maker".Henrig (talk) 21:36, 4 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

"As an ememy of the Nazi regime" - spelling of "enemy"

Done.Henrig (talk) 08:12, 3 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

"After his first imprisonmend" - spelling of "imprisonment"

Done.Henrig (talk) 08:12, 3 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

"The last two-year station of his imprisonments was" - I'm not familiar with "station" used like this - "location"?

Replaced with "location".Henrig (talk) 08:12, 3 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

"war service in 1917/18" - as per the above

Done.Henrig (talk) 08:12, 3 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

" the following German Revolution 1918/19 until autumn 1920" - I'm sure there was a reason for it, but this begged the question of what happened to him in the first half of 1920.

Replaced 1918/19 with 1918-1919.Henrig (talk) 08:12, 3 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

"During the following years, which saw the beginning of World War I, Rau's youth group, whose leader he became in 1916, was significantly influenced by the left wing of the Social Democratic Party of Germany (SPD), which considered the war a conflict between "imperialist powers"." This is quite a complex sentence, and might be usefully broken in two.

Now divided into two sentences.Henrig (talk) 08:12, 3 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

"western front" - should this be capitalised?

Done.Henrig (talk) 08:12, 3 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

" While in Ludwigsburg, Rau managed to get vacation at short notice on 8 November 1918 and joined the in those days developing revolution in Stuttgart.[2]" - vacation, or leave?

Replaced with "leave".Henrig (talk) 08:12, 3 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

"shortly after a revolutionary crowd had stormed his residence, the Wilhelm Palais and flew a red flag above the building" - "flown", not "flew", given the tense of the sentence.

Done.Henrig (talk) 08:12, 3 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

"These happenings were a first cumulation of a civil commotion, that had started a few days earlier, by the end of October 1918, with large strikes and demonstrations" - the sequencing here is unclear - I'd suggest moving the "end of October" bit to the start of the section.

Removed "end of October". Large demonstrations started at the end of October. At the moment I'm not sure when the strikes started.Henrig (talk) 08:12, 3 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

" a first Workers' council " - this should either be capitalised on both words, or neither.

Done. Henrig (talk) 12:06, 3 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

"and took over a large part of the power in" - could you lose the "the power in"? I think the sentence would still mean the same.

Done.Henrig (talk) 12:06, 3 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

"In this quickly established first government, which for the present shared power with the councils, the Spartacist Albert Schreiner, then chairman of a soldier council, initially assumed the key position of Minister of War. " - If you restructured this sentence as "The Spartacist... initially assumed... in this quickly established..." it would probably read easier.

Done.Henrig (talk) 12:06, 3 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

"While the Spartacists considered aims similar to those of the last year's October Revolution in Russia as an ideal, parts of the other USPD members and the SPD followers considered such conditions more as a deterrence" - I think I know what this means, but it could be clarified.

Rephrased and shortened this sentence.

" by armed rebellion" - "by force"?

Added a clarification.Henrig (talk) 12:30, 3 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

" During such an attempt, at the beginning of April 1919, the time, when in Munich the Bavarian Soviet Republic was formally proclaimed, a general strike took place in the Stuttgart area and 16 people died in gunfights, in which even cannons were deployed." - again, the sentence sequence doesn't read easily. NB: by cannons, do we mean the genuine, antiquated kind of cannon?

Rephrased the sentence and replaced "cannon" with "gun". (My dictionary is not very helpful.)Henrig (talk) 12:30, 3 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

"In this time, the party leader in Württemberg was Edwin Hoernle, a former visitor of Rau's youth group in Zuffenhausen and since then Rau's long-standing friend. In former years, Hoernle had also become a kind of influential teacher for Rau. Then he made his voluminous library available to Rau and talked with him about the upcoming questions during Rau's self-study." I was having trouble with this bit. How about "The party leader in Württemberg at this time was Edwin Hoernle. Hoernle had visited Rau's youth group in Zuffenhausen and had become a long standing friend; he was an influential teacher for Rau and made his voluminous library available to Rau to use."?

Done. It seems the information is the same and there is no danger of confusion with a school teacher. The longer version emphasized the self-study. The shorter version implies it.Henrig (talk) 13:40, 3 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

"The most outstanding ideological authority of the movement in Stuttgart, during the time of Rau's political involvement there, was however Clara Zetkin, a founding member of the Second International, about whom Friedrich Engels once had written, that he liked her very much, while emperor Wilhelm II is said to have referred to her as the "worst witch in Germany". Worth breaking the sentence after Clara Zetkin's name.

Done.Henrig (talk) 13:40, 3 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

"She had also been living in a Stuttgart suburb" - The "also" implies that someone else had been living in a suburb in Stuttgart - was this the intent?

Yes. Rau lived in a suburb of Stuttgart. But "also" is not necessary. Removed. Henrig (talk) 13:40, 3 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

" and since then, been gathering a circle of Württemberg Marxists around her, among them Rau's friend Edwin Hoernle" - you need a paired comma after the "and"; you don't need to give Edwin Hoernle's full name again, as he's just been mentioned.

Done.Henrig (talk) 13:40, 3 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

"Rau became a secretary and full-time member of the agricultural division" - just to check, was he "a" secretary, or "the" secretary?

"The secretary". Changed this sentence to "Rau became a full-time party functionary and the secretary of the agricultural division" Henrig (talk) 14:45, 3 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

"After Hoernle had been elected..." - the "after" is superfluous here, as you can only succeed to someone's post after they've been appointed to it; I'd go for "Hoernle had been elected to the Executive Committee of the Comintern (ECCI) in November 1922 and Rau succeeded him to this position the following year."

Done.Henrig (talk) 14:45, 3 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

"via Czechoslovakia and" - needs a comma after Czechoslovakia

Done.Henrig (talk) 18:24, 3 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

"he was supposedly at odds" - the footnote is useful here, but it would be good to be clear in the main text if this means that contemporaries thought he was at odds, or if this the opinion of historians.

Replaced "supposedly" with "might have been". At the moment I don't know such a statement by a historian.Henrig (talk) 18:24, 3 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

"However, it seems that..." Starting with however changes its meaning slightly. I'd advise "It seems, however, that..."

Done.Henrig (talk) 18:24, 3 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

"At the beginning of 1939 Rau crossed the border to Spain again and subsequently led, together with Ludwig Renn, the remainders of the XI Brigade, which, together with other remaining international units – now combined in the "Agrupación Internacional" – fought on Spain's northern border after the fall of Barcelona, protecting the stream of refugees escaping to France." I'd break this in two after Brigade.

Done.Henrig (talk) 18:24, 3 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

"sent to Camp Vernet, the internment centre in France" - To check, do you mean "the" internment centre (implies only one existed), or "a" centre?

~~Changed to "the main internment centre".Henrig (talk) 18:24, 3 December 2011 (UTC)~~ Changed to "an internment centre" (Vernet is well-known, but it was not even the largest camp.) Henrig (talk) 23:14, 9 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

" and sat until March 1943 " - "was held until March"?

Changed to "held".Henrig (talk) 18:24, 3 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

" the camp rebellion" - first mention of this, so would suggest "a camp rebellion"

Done.Henrig (talk) 18:24, 3 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

"When Rau was free again, " - unclear if this was the result of the camp rebellion or the end of the war.

Changed to "When the war was over".Henrig (talk) 18:57, 3 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

"became now chairman of the central administration" - "now" is unnecessary.

Removed.Henrig (talk) 18:57, 3 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

"Rau was member of the commission for the execution of the land reform in the province." - "a" member

Done.Henrig (talk) 18:57, 3 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

"the responsible president for economy and transport in Brandenburg" - this isn't my usual period: president of what?

It's also not so clear in the source. Obviously there was a president for Brandenburg and a few vice-presidents. The vice-presidents are mentioned as responsible presidents for .... Replaced this passage with "assumed responsibility for" Henrig (talk) 18:57, 3 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

" In this capacity, he was since June 1946 " - "he was, from June 1946 onwards,"

Done.Henrig (talk) 21:02, 2 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

"new established sequester commission " - "newly"

Done.Henrig (talk) 21:02, 2 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

" 1946 was also the year of the forced merger of eastern KPD and eastern SPD into the Socialist Unity Party of Germany (SED).[35] Thus Rau became a member of the SED." - I'd combined this two sentences.

Done.Henrig (talk) 21:19, 8 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

"A remarkable 1946 event in Brandenburg were in November elections, which preceded an official status change from a province to a federal state in the following year." - check the grammar here (event is singular); it's not clear from this why this was remarkable (as opposed to, say, just "important")

Replaced with "Important 1946 events in Brandenburg" Henrig (talk) 21:02, 2 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

" which became in this time the centralised administration organisation for the Soviet Occupation Zone " - "became during this period"

Done.Henrig (talk) 21:02, 2 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

"An especially notable and momentous event in this time was the currency reform of 1948." - you could easily cut this sentence.

Removed "and notable" (User VM repl. 'especially" with "particularly")Henrig (talk) 21:34, 6 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

"leaving the eastern zone alone with the old common currency." - "eastern zone to use the old common currency"

Done.Henrig (talk) 21:02, 2 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

" the DWK under Rau's leadership " - I'd go for "the DWK, under Rau's leadership,"

Done.Henrig (talk) 21:02, 2 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

" In doing so, the DWK also instrumentalized the currency reform to redistribute capital by using highly different exchange rates for private and state-run companies" - I'm not sure what "instrumentalized" means here. I'd suggest just "different exchange rate" rather than "highly different"

They used it for the purpose to redistribute capital. (Perhaps the meaning is not exactly the same like in German for the term "instrumentalisieren".) Apparently not! Replaced with "exploited".Henrig (talk) 20:49, 7 December 2011 (UTC) Removed "highly".Henrig (talk) 21:02, 2 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

"The following quarrel, which of the two new currencies should be used in Berlin, was the starting of the Berlin Blockade by the USSR and the western airborne supply of West Berlin." - The following quarrel? I'm not quite sure if this means the disagreement you've just mentioned, or a subsequent quarrel that isn't in the article.

Replaced with "disagreement ... triggered the Berlin Blockade."Henrig (talk) 20:22, 2 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

"The time of Rau's German Economic Commission ended on 7 October 1949..." > "Rau's German Economic Commission was abolished on..." might be better

I'm not sure. Perhaps a judicial body remained for a while.Henrig (talk) 20:22, 2 December 2011 (UTC) Actually, the DWK was formally abolished five days after the proclamation of the GDR. I've rephrased this passage now. Henrig (talk) 12:52, 10 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

"Thereupon Rau..." > "Rau thereupon..."

Done.Henrig (talk) 20:22, 2 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

"in 1950, a full member of the Politburo" - "in 1950 he became a full member of the..."

Done.Henrig (talk) 20:22, 2 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

"In 1949–1950" - "Between 1949-1950..."

Replaced with 'Between 1949 and 1950'Henrig (talk) 20:22, 2 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

"In a later letter to Pieck of 28 November 1951" - probably needs a comma after 1951.

Done.Henrig (talk) 20:22, 2 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

"In 1952–1953, Rau led the newly established Coordination Centre for Industry and Traffic at the East German Council of Ministers." - single sentence paragraph - should really be incorporated into one of the adjacent para's.

Expanded this paragraph.Henrig (talk) 20:02, 5 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

"In this connection " - you could safely delete this clause

Done.Henrig (talk) 20:54, 5 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

" Thereupon the leading SED party ideologist Rudolf Herrnstadt, a candidate member of the Poliburo, drew with support and assistance by Heinrich Rau a concept for such a New Course in East Germany" - the language here needs a little work.

Rephrased by user Volunteer Marek.Henrig (talk) 18:31, 6 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

"( plus six candidate members )" - spaces on the inside of the brackets should be removed

Done.Henrig (talk) 19:31, 2 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

"while Rau's Spanish Civil War fellow" - I think you meant "comrade", not "fellow" (unless you meant to put "Rau's fellow Spanish Civil War veteran")

Comrade. Done.Henrig (talk) 19:31, 2 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

"The very next day after the meeting Ulbricht went by plane to Moscow and the Soviet leadership, who in part also feared, that deposing Ulbricht might be construed as a sign of weakness, secured Ulbricht's position now." Excess comma after "feared"; the "now" should be before "secured".

Done.Henrig (talk) 19:31, 2 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

"became now a new candidate member of the Politburo" > "now became..."

DoneHenrig (talk) 19:31, 2 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

"'Number One'" - is this a direct translation of the German? If it's English, I'd suggest its too casual, and would advise "the senior leader"

Not sure at the moment, but "senior leader" seems to be better. Done Henrig (talk) 19:01, 2 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

" the points of dissension" - could just be "the dissension"

Done.Henrig (talk) 19:01, 2 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

"widely avoided an appearance of disharmony with Ulbricht present at this time" - "avoided giving the impression of any disagreement with Ulbricht"

Done.Henrig (talk) 19:01, 2 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

" during that time:" - should end in a comma

Done.Henrig (talk) 19:01, 2 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

"which combined the responsibilities of three other until then existing ministries" - "which combined the responsibilities of three existing ministries"

DoneHenrig (talk) 19:01, 2 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

"who would later, in the early 1960s," - "who would, in the early 1960s,"

Done.Henrig (talk) 19:01, 2 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

" This reform in the 1960s partially had already a forerunner reform in the middle of the 1950s and the economic historian Jörg Roesler considers the NES in the 1960s as a continuation of this foregoing reform." > " This later reform was presaged by the reforms in the middle of the 1950s; the economic historian Jörg Roesler considers the NES in the 1960s as a continuation of these reforms."

Done.Henrig (talk) 19:01, 2 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

" a scientific study, which was ordered by Rau's ministry in 1953, for the purpose to achieve knowledge about needs for more economic efficiency in the factories" " a scientific study, commissioned by Rau's ministry in 1953, to assess the need for greater economic efficiency in the factories"

Done.Henrig (talk) 20:23, 1 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

"promised more economic efficiency" "more" > "greater" or "enhanced"

Done.Henrig (talk) 20:23, 1 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

" Unrests in other Eastern Bloc countries during the previous year 1956, in particular in Hungary, had obviously awoken the desire for more central control again." - "obviously" - I'd suggest removing this word.

Done.Henrig (talk) 20:23, 1 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

"However the subsequent unsatisfying economic development during the following years eventually led in the 1960s to the concept of a new planning reform, the NES.2 - "however" at the start of a sentence has a different meaning. "The subsequent unsatisfying economic development, however, during..."

Done.Henrig (talk) 20:23, 1 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

"'Inter-German Trade' " - double speech marks