Talk:Local government areas of South Australia

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2007[edit]

Well, i just harmonised the list as best as possible (fixed that 'to do list' item a year later ;)), except for the Aboriginal Councils. Are these actual LGA's or just indigenous reserves? Anyway, i think they need to be included. If no one disagrees, i will put them in, as it will keep the template and this page nice and constant.

Also, Astrokey44 (i think its his) map is slighlty wrong in relation to the types of council. A number of 'District Councils' are incorrect. The Catcher 15:28, 3 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]

which are incorrect? If you tell me I can fix it --Astrokey44 21:01, 3 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]

The only incorrect ones are: Berri Barmera Council, Naracoorte Lucindale Council, Wattle Range Council, Alexandrina Council. On the map they are marked as 'District Council', as opposed to 'Council'. Also, could you include the Aboriginal Councils/Reserves to the map? Thanks. The Catcher 00:03, 4 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Former SA LGAs[edit]

The amalgamations of 1997 caused the demise of many longstanding Adelaide LGAs.

I thought about constructing a sortable wikitable on a page named something like List of LGAs of Adelaide but I couldn't think of a good enough page name. Also, there are multiple choices for table layout.

Your #comments are solicited. Pdfpdf (talk) 02:10, 16 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Summary of #Comments[edit]

(This summary is evolving - i.e. "work-in-progress" - please add/modify/correct as appropriate)

Category:Former Local Government Areas of South Australia be created. - Status: Done as Category:Former local government areas of South Australia
New pages be created (as "redirect"s). - Status: In progress
- One page be created for each former entity.
- New page to redirect to the "parent" of that former entity, preferably to a relevant section header on the "parent" page.
- New page to be added to Category:Former local government areas of South Australia,
- Parent page to contain a list of the new "children" pages.
As/when resources permit, "new page" to be changed from a "redirect" to an article. - Status: In progress
...

Examples[edit]

City of Playford

City of Munno Para (article)
District Council of Munno Para - #REDIRECT City of Munno Para
City of Elizabeth (article)

Wakefield Regional Council

District Council of Wakefield - #REDIRECT Wakefield Regional Council

Incomplete raw data for Adelaide metro[edit]

All data here data snipped by User:Donama 9 October 2017.

Please see much more up to date listing at Wikipedia:WikiProject South Australia/Historic places instead. Thank you. Donama (talk) 04:31, 9 October 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Incomplete raw data for non Adelaide metro[edit]

All data here data snipped by User:Donama 9 October 2017.

Please see much more up to date listing at Wikipedia:WikiProject South Australia/Historic places instead. Thank you. Donama (talk) 04:31, 9 October 2017 (UTC)[reply]

1936[edit]

South Australian councils in existence in 1936 – as published in the Civic record of 1936 pages 2-3. From: Marsden, Susan (2012). "LOCAL GOVERNMENT ASSOCIATION OF SOUTH AUSTRALIA: A HISTORY OF SOUTH AUSTRALIAN COUNCILS to 1936" (PDF).

V-Z: Corporation of Victor Harbour, District Council of Waikerie, District Council of Walkerville, Corporation of Wallaroo, District Council of Warooka, District Council of West Torrens, District Council of Willunga, District Council of Wilmington, Corporation of Woodville, District Council of Yankalilla, District Council of Yorke Peninsula, District Council of Yorketown

1994[edit]

Subset of 1994 LGAs: District Council of Crystal Brook-Red Hill, District Council of Dudley, District Council of Jamestown, District Council of Kapunda, District Council of Kingscote, District Council of Mount Pleasant, District Council of Ridley-Truro, District Council of Rocky River, District Council of Spalding.

Comments[edit]

1881 - The SA Census 1881 provides population broken down to County, then to LGA (corporate towns and district councils), hundreds outside of District councils, and County outside of Hundreds. [1] There are lots of places I have never heard of in this list! --Scott Davis ^Talk 01:42, 23 February 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Suggest creating all non-existent articles as redirects to current LGA covering the traditional area. Detail of the former name and any amalgamations should be included in the history of existing article. I like what you've done for City of Elizabeth. Is a better idea to create the article for historical LGA instead of just a redirect where there's time and material available. Donama (talk) 04:00, 17 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]

That's almost identical to what I had in mind. i.e. I agree. Pdfpdf (talk) 05:00, 17 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Questions[edit]

The list is a fantastic start. Couple of points, though.

If City of Brighton, South Australia is ever created, it might be wise to rename City of Brighton, Victoria. Why should the Victorians get the default?

Yes, agree City of Brighton should be a disambiguation page and existing page there be moved to City of Brighton, Victoria. Donama (talk) 04:00, 17 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Before creating any of these, let's establish some guidelines. For example,
- Should articles be named [City/Town/etc.] of XYZ, or should we follow official convention. Here, for example, there is Town of Gawler but Corporation of the Town of Walkerville. Also, there is City of Holdfast Bay, The City of Burnside but Campbelltown City Council.

Good question, have wondered the same, but still think Walkerville should just be called "Town of Walkerville" as the "corporation of" bit merely means it's incorporated, not that the name of the entity is anything but "Town of Walkerville". Donama (talk) 04:00, 17 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]

- Should Town of Campbelltown and District Council of Campbelltown be separate articles, or should the latter be included in the former? This also raises the question whether to create an article on a former LGA that still exists but under a new name or designation. (E.g. Town of Campbelltown and City of Campbelltown).

I think that where it is simply subtle boundary shifts or renaming then the history of all that can just go in one article. Where it's a case of amalgamation where each constituent has its own detailed history there should be separate articles. Donama (talk) 04:00, 17 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]

We also need to be sure we get the designations right. That is, let's be sure that Town of XYZ really was a town and not District of XYZ.

LordVetinari (talk) 06:35, 16 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks. Good questions, and I agree. (I look forward to resolution of the answers!) Cheers, Pdfpdf (talk) 11:49, 16 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Category[edit]

FYI, I have just begun the relevant category. There's only one article there at the moment, so let's hope some officious WikiElf doesn't delete it before we can add more. LordVetinari (talk) 00:44, 17 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Given that it may be some time before the second member appears ... ;-) Pdfpdf (talk) 02:01, 17 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]

LOL! What's that famous quote? "Accurate prediction is difficult, especially about the future ... " Pdfpdf (talk) 05:12, 17 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]

FYI: Further to #Comments section above: I've added City of Port Adelaide to the category. Pdfpdf (talk) 05:12, 17 January 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Names[edit]

Discussion transferred from User talk:LordVetinari
Sorry mate, I don't want to be a pain, but I really don't like it that you have changed (for example) City of Charles Sturt to Charles Sturt, Town of Gawler to Gawler, and District Council of Ceduna to Ceduna. Those are NOT the names of the LGAs. I was wondering why you changed them thus? Cheers, Pdfpdf (talk) 14:15, 12 April 2011 (UTC)[reply]

The names are still the same. I simply changed how they appeared. I did this so that it is easier to scan through them to find a particular LGA. There's no standard format for LGA names in Australia. Therefore, listing them gives a similar result as, for example,

Town of XYZ
XYZ Regional Council
The XYZ District Council (Should we ignore the The in The Coorong District Council?)
Etc

Consequently, scanning becomes near impossible, making any alphabetical sorting of the list pointless. Having said that, though, I agree with your point about them not being the correct names. As it stands, I can see that it may give the wrong idea to people unfamiliar with the topic.

How do we resolve it then?
Leaving it as it will get us nowhere.

We could only use correct names but, aside from the issue I described above, where do we draw the line? What happens with Corporation of the Town of Walkerville, for example? Remove the Corporation of... part, perhaps, but the reasoning behind that is the same that can justify removing Council from Flinders Ranges Council.

Alternatively, we could combine both options and follow the example shown here. However, that option doesn't seem to fully resolve the readability issue.

May I suggest, then, that where an LGAs identifier (i.e. Town, City etc) appears before the LGAs name, we instead place it at the end, separated by a comma. For example:

XYZ, Town of

XYZ Regional Council

XYZ District Council, The

Etc

~~What do you think?~~ LordVetinari (talk) 14:50, 12 April 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Have just been looking through other states examples. Will work on it and come up with something better. LordVetinari (talk) 02:11, 13 April 2011 (UTC)[reply]

I am working on a new table here that combines elements from the equivalent Qld and WA pages. LordVetinari (talk) 04:03, 13 April 2011 (UTC)[reply]

I like the idea of your new table. Very nice.

In the interim, I've turned Local Government Areas of South Australia into a sortable table. What do you think?

I like it. It solves the previous issues. Now I just need to hurry up and finish all the additional info stuff. LordVetinari (talk) 11:13, 13 April 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Cheers, Pdfpdf (talk) 08:03, 13 April 2011 (UTC)[reply]

P.S. Do you know about the "Sortname" template? Pdfpdf (talk) 08:12, 13 April 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Yeah, I think I've used it before. I don't quite know how it could apply here, though. Template:DEFAULTSORT has already seen to that. LordVetinari (talk) 11:13, 13 April 2011 (UTC)[reply]

I don't understand the correlation between sortname and defaultsort.

Like nts & dts, sortname is for use in wikitable sortable. Example below. Cheers, Pdfpdf (talk) 12:15, 13 April 2011 (UTC)[reply]

text	link	using sortname	sortname text
Adelaide	City of Adelaide	City of Adelaide	{{sortname\|City of\|Adelaide}}
Adelaide Hills	Adelaide Hills Council	Adelaide Hills Council	{{sortname\| \|Adelaide Hills Council}}
Barossa	Barossa Council	Barossa Council	{{sortname\| \|Barossa Council}}
Barunga	District Council of Barunga West	District Council of Barunga West	{{sortname\|District Council of \|Barunga West}}
Burnside	City of Burnside	City of Burnside	{{sortname\|City of\|Burnside}}
Ceduna	District Council of Ceduna	District Council of Ceduna	{{sortname\|District Council of \|Ceduna}}
Cleve	District Council of Cleve	District Council of Cleve	{{sortname\|District Council of \|Cleve}}
Gawler	Town of Gawler	Town of Gawler	{{sortname\|Town of\|Gawler}}
Port Augusta	City of Port Augusta	City of Port Augusta	{{sortname\|City of \|Port Augusta}}
Walkerville	Town of Walkerville	Town of Walkerville	{{sortname\|Town of \|Walkerville}}
Whyalla	City of Whyalla	City of Whyalla	{{sortname\|City of \|Whyalla}}
Wudinna	Wudinna District Council	Wudinna District Council	{{sortname\| \|Wudinna District Council}}

I was about to reply that as defaultsort is used in the various articles, the sortname template isn't needed. However, I just tried sorting your list again and it seems that not all the articles have it. (dammit!) Guess I should use it after all. LordVetinari (talk) 13:23, 13 April 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Are you saying that if DEFAULTSORT is used in an article, then if you put the article name in a sortable wikitable, the table will sort it by the value of DEFAULTSORT?

If so, that's not how the table below is behaving.

If not, what is it that you are saying?

Cheers, Pdfpdf (talk) 15:04, 13 April 2011 (UTC)[reply]

List of Australian Victoria Cross recipients

Names	using sortname
Charles Groves Wright Anderson	Charles Groves Wright Anderson
Thomas Axford	Thomas Axford
Peter Badcoe	Peter Badcoe
Frederick Bell	Frederick Bell

Sorry to confuse. I was tired last night and didn't check the table properly. I thought defaultsort would do the job but I misread. Not that it matters now, though. I've already used sortname in my table. LordVetinari (talk) 03:56, 14 April 2011 (UTC)[reply]

No big deal - as you get to know me better, you'll see that I'm easily confused. Cheers, Pdfpdf (talk)

District Council of Yatala[edit]

Some of you may have noticed me editing the above sections to show where the historic District Council of Yatala fits in. It's part of the history of at least 4 existing LGAs so I felt compelled to start the article District Council of Yatala. Can someone please help me categorise it. I'm hesitant to just go ahead and categorise as Category:Local Government Areas in Adelaide and/or Category:Local government areas of South Australia which are technically correct but currently limited to just present-day LGAs. Donama (talk) 02:20, 13 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Done, using Category:Former Local Government Areas of South Australia. Lord Vetinari 04:00, 13 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Five years on it looks like I got back to this (and Hundred of Yatala for you inner north Adelaide residents!). The cat is now called Category:Former local government areas of South Australia. Donama (talk) 06:20, 23 February 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Historic local government areas[edit]

Hi all, I have created a todo list (based on a chunk of the Land admin divisions talk page that was racking up way too many edits) at a subpage of the SA wikiproject: Wikipedia:WikiProject South Australia/Historic places. I am hoping it can be expanded so we get through all the historic LGAs of South Australia over the next 5 years or so. The todo this on this talk page (see above) might be added in too.

Also, I've made a massive list of all the historic South Aussie LGAs I could find from any source to highlight as many redlinks as possible: User:Donama/SA LGAs. Even then some blue links are devious redirects (e.g. neither City of Brighton or City of Brighton, South Australia is an article about our South Aussie former City of Brighton). Perhaps bits of this might be incorporated into the Historic places todo list too. That's all for now! Donama (talk) 05:07, 11 August 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Council area[edit]

Just checked the approximate area using the PLB area measurement tool (www.maps.sa.gov.au/plb) and it came out as "Area: 1820.552km² Perimeter: 245.442km Result is approximate. Refer to survey plans for accurate measurements." so the recent change to 1832 sq km (instead of 7000+) seems likely correct even though unsourced. Donama (talk) 23:35, 9 November 2017 (UTC)[reply]