Talk:Martin Eberhard

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Excess external links[edit]

I moved these from the main article per WP:ELNO - some may or may not be usable as reference material:

- David Gerard (talk) 19:13, 28 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

David Gerard, I agree. The CNBC video isn't necessary, the second link is a 404, third link is a bare link to a forum, fourth link has a bad SSL cert AND is a 404, fifth link is a blog in contravention of WP:ELNO, sixth link is an archive.org link to a parked domain, the official tesla motors site has no need to be there, and the mercury news link is a 404. ScottishFinnishRadish (talk) 11:43, 29 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

PamKayJohnson (talk) 11:46, 29 July 2021 (UTC)Dear David,Scottisch, I can agree that the outdated 404 links make sense to be removed, but the CNBC talk is critical due to the extensive press drama about claims that Martin not actually founding Tesla. Why has the section "ongoing" been deleted? Clearly interesting to know what an important person like Martin Eberhard is currently up to.PamKayJohnson (talk) 11:46, 29 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

PamKayJohnson, that section was deleted as there was no sourcing in it. Unsourced claims shouldn't be added to a WP:BLP. The press drama and if he was a founder of Tesla should be covered in the article, not via an external link. Per WP:ELNO, Any site that does not provide a unique resource beyond what the article would contain if it became a featured article. In other words, the site should not merely repeat information that is already or should be in the article. If it should be covered in the article we shouldn't be using external links. ScottishFinnishRadish (talk) 11:50, 29 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]
PamKayJohnson, Please stop reverting on the article, or you're likely to be blocked for edit warring. You're already at 5+ reverts in 24 hours. ScottishFinnishRadish (talk) 11:54, 29 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

PamKayJohnson (talk) 11:59, 29 July 2021 (UTC)I can point to others who have performed a number of reverts as a team against my reverts and edit, without answering my concerns and questions. I do appreciate you answering my questions and concerns. I do not want to cause problems, but I do want the page to be accurate and complete, I do wonder about the intense interest in fighting some reasonable updates of this page. I'd appreciate those who have questions to address them before simply deleting edits.[reply]

That there are others who have performed a number of reverts shows that WP:CONSENSUS seems to be against your edits, so that leaves you to discuss with the goal of swaying others to your position. ScottishFinnishRadish (talk) 12:01, 29 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

COI notice for PamKayJohnson added to talk page, {{COI}} added to article - David Gerard (talk) 13:27, 29 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

David Gerard, just a heads up, there's also some discussion on their talk page about this. ScottishFinnishRadish (talk) 13:33, 29 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]
It looks like the vast majority of PamKayJohnson's edits have been reverted so I am not sure why the article itself should have COI banner. Certainly one on the Talk page is appropriate though. QRep2020 (talk) 16:02, 29 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]
I would have to agree. The talk space tags make sense, but article space tag is generally reserved for pending substantial or controversial rewrites. I haven't seen it used in one-off cases where the user was quickly reverted. --Elephanthunter (talk) 18:14, 29 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]
She's been at least one IP as well - David Gerard (talk) 17:36, 29 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Looks like the template has been removed, which I don't see an issue with at this time. I see the connected contributor template has already been placed on this talk page as well. ScottishFinnishRadish (talk) 17:40, 29 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Indeed David Gerard, you are right, I was one IP. That was before I had made an account for myself, which I made so I could access your talk page when I had questions about the removal of the external links and to ask what to do about the slanderous comments that kept being added repeatedly over months. Thank you very much for your help and understanding and I apologise for my not being fully informed about the process.PamKayJohnson (talk) 17:45, 29 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

David Gerard and ScottishFinnishRadish is it possible to have the birthday and place of birth removed? Martin has been the target of some malicious identify theft this past year, several times, and this information is very private and compromising for him. Can it be removed? Thank youPamKayJohnson (talk) 17:45, 29 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

I don't see any actual sourcing for his DoB or birth place in the article right now. I'm removing it for now, pending some evidence that it is widely published in reliable secondary sources. ScottishFinnishRadish (talk) 17:52, 29 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]
@ScottishFinnishRadish: Ah I didn't even see that it wasn't sourced, so good catch. I'd argue that even if we find reliable sources, we should just publish the birth year per WP:DOB since there is evidence the subject of the biography is concerned about identity theft. --Elephanthunter (talk) 18:01, 29 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]
Elephanthunter, I think the threshold in policy is widely published in secondary sources. If that's the case then it doesn't matter if it's in the article because it's still a quick search away. It seems we're far from that standard though. ScottishFinnishRadish (talk) 18:04, 29 July 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Hi ScottishFinnishRadish, I've been checking the links in the citations and I found a link that is strangely truncated in the middle text with the rest blocked by a paywall

It is citation number 3:http://www.businessinsider.com/tesla-the-origin-story-2014-10

The following link is same story with full text and without a paywall https://www.businessinsider.com.au/tesla-the-origin-story-2014-10

Would it be possible to make this change? Many thanksPamKayJohnson (talk) 13:02, 2 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]

PamKayJohnson, All set. thanks. ScottishFinnishRadish (talk) 18:20, 3 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]

hi ScottishFinnishRadish, many thanks, greatly appreciated. The link at the top of this page had the same problem. No rush, but when you have time, it would help others who want to read it when they come to this talk page. Many thanks again PamKayJohnson (talk) 05:05, 6 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]

A link on the talk page? Per talk page guidelines we generally won't edit posts to the talk page, rather we'll keep them as an full archive of discussions. ScottishFinnishRadish (talk) 10:45, 6 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Hi ScottishFinnishRadish I realised that I did not respond to your comment about an edit to the talk page. At the top of this Talk page under "Refideas" the highlighted section that says "the following article might be useful in referencing content on this page". The link that appears to be to the intended business insider story is no longer valid. Therefore, my suggestion to use the same non-paywall link to the business insider story that was corrected in the references on the page itself: https://www.businessinsider.com.au/tesla-the-origin-story-2014-10 many thanks and best regardsPamKayJohnson (talk) 08:18, 5 September 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Hi ScottishFinnishRadish, Is it appropriate to add podcasts to wiki pages? A new podcast has come out which is very comprehensive, produced by Watt It. the link is https://www.powerhouse.fund/martin. Perhaps it could be added in its own section, or to the references or to external links? Just an idea. Many thanks for your thoughts. PamKayJohnson (talk) 14:34, 3 September 2021 (UTC)[reply]

PamKayJohnson, it would only be WP:DUE if there were reliable secondary sources discussing the podcast. That's fairly uncommon for new podcasts, generally they only get press coverage once they're popular. ScottishFinnishRadish (talk) 14:36, 3 September 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Hi ScottishFinnishRadish I've noticed that a noticed has been added to the "early career" potion of Martin's Wiki page claiming there are no sources. One source is the podcast that I mentioned earlier. What other sources are required? How does a person prove where he worked over 40 years ago? Please advise what needs to be provided to have the flag removed that threatens to delete the whole section. Many thanks PamKayJohnson (talk) 18:50, 5 November 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Hi ScottishFinnishRadish Citation for Nuvomedia: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rocket_eBook PamKayJohnson (talk) 18:52, 5 November 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Hi ScottishFinnishRadish citation for acquisition of nuvomedia by gemstar https://www.infotoday.com/it/mar00/news12.htm many thanks PamKayJohnson (talk) 18:55, 5 November 2021 (UTC)[reply]

I probably won't have any time to look into this until some time next week. We can't use a wikipedia article as a source, so I suggest you look through that article and find the appropriate source that it uses. Per WP:V we have to be able to verify information on wikipedia, so if there's no way to verify where he worked 40 years ago then it may be removed. ScottishFinnishRadish (talk) 19:04, 5 November 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Hi ScottishFinnishRadish please see the Wyse wiki site under "notable Employees" and you'll see the exact reference to Martin being the engineer of the WY-30 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dell_Wyse

Can you please insert these citations, or should I do it? Many thanks PamKayJohnson (talk) 19:02, 5 November 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Hi ScottishFinnishRadish thanks for the answers. I'll find better sources for Nuvomedia and the WY-30. The citation for the Gemstar claim is ok?PamKayJohnson (talk) 19:34, 5 November 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Hi ScottishFinnishRadish Citations for Nuvomedia https://goodereader.com/blog/electronic-readers/the-tale-of-rocketbook-the-very-first-e-reader https://books.google.ch/books?id=8_oaAAAAIBAJ&pg=PA4&dq=%22Martin+Eberhard+rocket+ebook&article_id=6905,3545569&hl=en&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjt_qal84X0AhW7gv0HHZYCCV4Q6AF6BAgIEAI#v=onepage&q=%22Martin%20Eberhard%20rocket%20ebook&f=false PamKayJohnson (talk) 19:39, 5 November 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Hi ScottishFinnishRadish some citations for his employment at Wyse (some also cite Nuvomedia) https://www.britannica.com/biography/Martin-Eberhard-and-Marc-Tarpenning https://www.wikiwand.com/en/Dell_Wyse#/Notable_employees https://www.businessinsider.com/tesla-the-origin-story-2014-10?r=US&IR=T https://www.cooperhewitt.org/2010/11/16/designing-media-martin-eberhard/ I hope this helps. Many thanks, I know you are busy and I appreciate your time and help PamKayJohnson (talk) 19:56, 5 November 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Hi ScottishFinnishRadish Following are citations for the reference to him being a founder of Network computing devices https://www.ithistory.org/db/companies/network-computing-devices https://www.solvusoft.com/en/file-extensions/software/network-computing-devices/ https://en-academic.com/dic.nsf/enwiki/4571925

many thanks again for for time and best regards PamKayJohnson (talk) 05:02, 6 November 2021 (UTC)[reply]

I added the Cooper Hewitt and Business Insider sources. The rest were either user generated, which we can't use, or mirrors of wikipedia, which we also can't use. ScottishFinnishRadish (talk) 12:05, 10 November 2021 (UTC)[reply]

ScottishFinnishRadish many thanks for making the changes. I know you are busy but since I agreed not to make changes myself, may I please ask for the following errors to be corrected:

Punctuation/capitalisation error in first section: "...(then Tesla Motors) with Marc Tarpenning. In 2003, where Eberhard...", should read: "...(then Tesla Motors) with Marc Trapanning in 2003, where Eberhard..."

Repeated text in Early career,"the Rocket ebook" appears twice: "...where they developed the Rocket eBook, the first e-book with secure internet delivery of content, the Rocket eBook.", should read: "...where they developed the Rocket eBook, the first e-book with secure internet delivery of content.

many thanks and best regards PamKayJohnson (talk) 07:09, 11 November 2021

ScottishFinnishRadish

I just made an emergency revert of some changes to Martin's page which were malicious entries of his personal home address to the first line, by IP 65.129.197.35, which I have located to be in Meridian Idaho. This is as far as I understand a crime? I am pretty sure I know the person who did it. Hope you'll understand why I made this change without first checking with you PamKayJohnson (talk) 18:36, 4 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]

That's fine. Reverting vandalism is always acceptable. ScottishFinnishRadish (talk) 18:38, 4 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]
I've also requested the edits be removed from the history. ScottishFinnishRadish (talk) 18:42, 4 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]

ScottishFinnishRadish Thanks very much. Given the recent extremely public attacks on Martin by Elon, Martin has become a target. Is there a way to block any changes being made to his page? It's bad enough having the richest man on earth attacking him.PamKayJohnson (talk) 18:45, 4 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]

If it continues to be an issue I'll request page protection. ScottishFinnishRadish (talk) 18:46, 4 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]

ScottishFinnishRadishthank you very much. Can you help me please, is it a crime to make private information like this public without any permission? PamKayJohnson (talk) 18:48, 4 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]

To be honest, I have no idea. I would assume it's not, but I'm no expert. ScottishFinnishRadish (talk) 18:50, 4 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Hi talk I was browsing recent changes made to Martin Eberhard's page and found more vandalism, performed at 21:03, on 2 December 2021‎ by a user with IP 77.243.25.48 The word "found" was changed to "find out about" in the first sentence of the section titled "Tesla Motors". I've gone ahead and changed that back manually

"Eberhard's interest in sports cars, dependence on oil imports, and global warming led him to find out about..."

best regards, PamKayJohnson (talk) 17:38, 22 December 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Hi ScottishFinnishRadish the edits to Martin's page by the anonymous user 4 days ago are not in fact consistent with the AC Propulsion references, nor with Martin's Linked in Page. Martin in fact worked with AC Propulsion both with financial investment and technical support to convert the tzero to Lithium Ion batteries. See below, the quote taken from the wiki ""AC Propulsion zero" page reference number 3: "Morris, Charles (2014-04-07). "Tom Gage on ZEV mandates, Tesla's early days, BMW's EV commitment and V2G tech". Charged Electric Vehicles Magazine. Gage: I had a neighbor named Steve Casner, who had a Toyota RAV4 electric, and I always had an EV in my front yard, so we got to talking. He was working at a company with Martin Eberhard, so he told Martin about me. Martin called me, and he had all these schemes, and I was sort of talking through what the realities were. We were just converting the tzero over to lithium-ion batteries. He got involved with that. He actually put some investor money – a small amount – into AC Propulsion, and we finished the conversion of the tzero to lithium-ion batteries."

It is also not true that he bought a zero,he tried to buy one, but they could not build one for him (they needed money) he only borrowed one they they could loan to him (see other links on the AC propulsion page). The only part that is true in the text put in by the anonymous user is that Martin tried to get AC propulsion leadership to take it to production and they declined. If it is okay with you, I'd like to edit the edits made by that anonymous user to reflect the actual reality as in this reference. Or if you prefer, I can provide you with some text that you can put in. many thanks and best regardsPamKayJohnson (talk) 14:28, 13 March 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Hi ScottishFinnishRadish I have just undone a malicious/vandalism edit by user Dhruvh, who according to his talk page, has already been warned about vandalising pages and at this point should now be blocked. Can you please have a look? many thanks PamKayJohnson (talk) 16:33, 13 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

It doesn't look like vandalism. The lead should follow the body, and there is no mention of invention in the body. ScottishFinnishRadish (talk) 17:00, 13 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you for your help ScottishFinnishRadish. Would it be possible then to add something like this to the body: "Eberhard is an inventor with over 40 patents to his name." ref: https://patents.justia.com/inventor/martin-eberhard Many thanks PamKayJohnson (talk) 14:17, 14 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

A secondary source would be best, as there are plenty of people with patents that aren't known as inventors. ScottishFinnishRadish (talk) 14:56, 14 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Hi ScottishFinnishRadish thank you for your feedback. Martin literally invented the rocket ebook - forefather of today's kindle. Not to mention much of the battery technology used in e-autos. I've found a few external links. Does this help? https://www.powerhouse.fund/martin https://williamliggett.com/2020/07/25/martin-eberhard-co-inventor-of-tesla/ http://grupobcc.com/wp/wp-content/uploads/2016/04/MARTIN-EBERHARD-2-ENGLISH-VERSION.pdf https://goodereader.com/blog/electronic-readers/the-tale-of-rocketbook-the-very-first-e-reader https://dbpedia.org/page/Martin_Eberhard

many thanks for your help PamKayJohnson (talk) 06:02, 15 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

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