Talk:Nicolas Jackson

Biography

I did some research and every single biography of Nicolas Jackson talks about him being born in the Gambia and moving to Ziguinchor at age 16. The only source for him being born in Djibonker is the Chelsea website, which actually listed him as being born in Banjul up until at least the middle of 2023. A Gambian source speculates that the Senegal federation may have pushed him to downplay his Gambian background when he decided to play for Senegal.

Without taking a stance on who is pushing the Senegalese roots angle, it seems clear to me that this article should include Jackson's birth and childhood in the Gambia. Hopefully there will be some sort of reporting clearing this up at some point. Catjacket (talk) 00:21, 30 January 2024 (UTC)

Dear Catjacket,

I am writing on behalf of the football agency that represents Nicolas Jackson. We have both his passport and birth certificate that indicate that he was born in Djibonker, Senegal.

As you pointed out, Chelsea's official website recently changed this information. The reason for this is because at the time of writing the article, they did not have Nicolas Jackson's correct information. Once we provided them with the official government documents (passport and birth certificate), they promptly changed this information on their website.

Information on Jackson's birthplace can also be found on Transfermarkt, the official website for all football player profiles.

All the biography sources that you mentioned are from third party sources that state Nicolas Jackson was born in Banjul. No sources give actual evidence of this. This is a continual loop in which this misinformation is allowed to spread.

I really hope that this misunderstanding can be cleared up. Please feel free to reach out of you have any further questions. Epicsports (talk) 14:03, 19 February 2024 (UTC)

We go by what reliably published sources say. Chelsea football club[[1][2][3][4] I really don't care about the issue other than to make sure it follows our sources. Doug Weller talk 12:33, 20 February 2024 (UTC)

It seems to me that there are several acceptable solutions.

1. We could accept that what Chelsea's official website says now is correct. This implicitly assumes that older sources are incorrect. Some of the sources that said he was born in Gambia have become dead links, which could be interpreted as them taking down pages with incorrect information.
2. We could go for the solution of saying that his current employer (Chelsea F.C.) says Senegal, but older sources say Gambia. If we did go for this solution, we should be fair and point out any significant discrepancies between versions of the Gambia story (such as how old he was when he allegedly moved to Senegal), as they cast doubt on the accuracy of these stories.

The first solution is easier. The situation reminds me of the age of actresses, published sources often print the lie put out by their publicist.-- Toddy1 (talk) 10:32, 21 February 2024 (UTC)

Having checked all the links used in this discussion, the only one that I found offline is fifa. I also don't see any discrepancies in the versions of the Gambia story - they all say he moved to Senegal at roughly 16 years of age, having spent most of his childhood in Banjul.

Toddy1's metaphor is well-chosen, beause accepting what Chelsea currently says would be exactly akin to unquestioningly printing the lie put out by the publicist. Explaining the controversy in the main article is by far the better option. So far the only source that addresses this controversy at all is The Alkamba Times, which hints that Senegal may be pushing to downplay Jackson's Gambian heritage. While this isn't exactly a smoking gun, the fact that Chelsea changed their website and that Jackson's agency is engaging in Wikipedia edit wars would seem to back that story up. We have to at least address it. Leaving the article as-is would violate Wikipedia's policy on reliable sources, as @Doug Weller pointed out, and also at this point be intellectually dishonest. Catjacket (talk) 21:44, 27 February 2024 (UTC)

Dear Catjacket,

I believe we all want nothing more than to have a reliable and unbiased source for Nicolas Jackson's origin and birthplace.

I appreciate that there are web articles stating that he was not born in Senegal. However, after checking and reading them thoroughly, I struggle to understand where these sources gathered their information from. To me, it appears that they are engaging in speculation, as they don't have any primary data to back up their claim.

Though Toddy1's metaphor has some similarities with the situation, the key difference, in my opinion, is that Chelsea Football Club is Nicolas Jackson's employer. As his employer, Chelsea will have access to multiple primary sources publish their information, such as: Nicolas Jackson's legal government documents (birth certificate and passport), the player himself who can tell them where he is from or his family members who can provide further info.

To me, it seems that the most accurate portrayal of Nicolas Jackson's biography would be to use the source that has primary data, rather than a source that only engages in speculation. Furthermore, The Alkamba Times is a Gambian publication (as can be seen on their website), which does explain why they would want Nicolas Jackson to have Gambian origins. Having a famous person tied to their native land would certainly boost the image of their country. However, for our purposes, I believe that this can show that this source is not entirely unbiased. EpicSports.Maxim (talk) 09:23, 28 February 2024 (UTC)

In fact you are speculating. There is no reason to believe Chelsea has access to think Chelsea has seen his birth certificate for instance. Or that they did more than glance at his passport. I’ve got a British passport although I’m American. Doug Weller talk 13:14, 28 February 2024 (UTC)

Dear Doug Weller,

I believe that it's not speculation to say that Nicolas Jackson's employer has information such as a passport. As the player is contracted to Chelsea Football Club for employment, a binding contract would have to outline that an individual and a company agree to services in exchange for compensation. The individuals details will always be written within such a contract (so as not to mistake them with a person of the same name) and these details will always be verified through an official form of identification.

Regarding the question of passports. A person's passport will always have a place of birth. People with dual citizenships will always have the same place of birth in their respective passports. Therefore, though your passport may not always reflect what your background is, or where you are from ethnically, the place of birth (which is what we are disputing) will always remain consistent. EpicSports.Maxim (talk) 13:32, 28 February 2024 (UTC)

Passports are not necessarily accurate. I used to have a friend whose passport showed that she was a year older than she was. She needed it for work.-- Toddy1 (talk) 21:02, 28 February 2024 (UTC)

I think we should mention the birthplace as disputed Harvici (talk) 06:45, 3 March 2024 (UTC)

scotty daddy here 2600:100C:B2F3:1871:91C8:18DC:6263:4299 (talk) 10:47, 4 May 2024 (UTC)