Talk:Orontes I

Orontes I = Yervant I

it is one and the same person -ΜΣΧ 16:26, 26 May 2012 (UTC)

Tigranes is not Tigran

Orontes I / Yervand I reigned during the period between 401 BC – 344 BC. .....Xenophon mentioned that he had a son called Tigranes. This is ok.

The link goes to Tigran I (Yervanduni) Armenian King of Orontid dynasty reigning in the period between 560 BC – 535 BC.

But this is obviously is a different Tigranes. Maybe the right Tigranes can be identified. --W.ehrlich (talk) 10:28, 18 March 2015 (UTC)

If you want to understand what the problem really is with the chronologies, check Moses of Chorene article, and the difference between (for example) the King Vahagn article and the Armenian wikipedia version of the same article - hy:Վահագն - the dates are completely off (first is 6th BC, second is during the Artaxiad dynasty of the 4th BC - this is due to Moses Chorenis History book, which is now deemed unreliable). Probably the Tigranes is the same, as someone wrote the article referring erroneously to Tigranes I. --92slim (talk) 01:53, 19 March 2015 (UTC)

Orontes/Yervand in lead

I'm responding mainly to Aṭlas's good faith edit here. I added the Armenian name of Orontes (Armenian: Yervand) because he played a crucial role in the history of the Armenian people, to the point in which many historians claim that Armenia's capital city, Yerevan, may be named after him. It has since become a very popular name in Armenian and many streets and villages have been named after him. So per WP:OTHERNAMES, his significance remains a key factor in keeping his Armenian name there. Étienne Dolet (talk) 03:39, 18 October 2016 (UTC)

Bactrian? Armenian?

Per, Encyclopaedia Iranica, "Orontes, a Bactrian, son of Artasouras/Artasyras (OGI no. 264. 4f.), satrap of Armenia under Artaxerxes II Mnemon (Xenophon, Anabasis 3.5.17; Pompeius Trogus, prolog. 10), who in 401 B.C.E. had given him his daughter Rhodogoune in marriage (Xenophon, Anabasis 2.4.8; 3.4.13; Plutarch, Artox. 27.7; OGI no. 391–2) and so obliged him to the royal house. In two inscriptions of king Antiochus I of Commagene (ca. 69–34 B.C.E.), to be found on his monument at Nemrut dağı (OGI no. 391–2), Orontes, called Aroandes (son of Artasouras and husband of Artaxerxes’s daughter Rhodogoune), is reckoned, among others, as an ancestor of the “Orontids” ruling over Commagene, who traced back their family to the great Achaemenid kings. According to Plutarch (Arat. 3.5) he resembled Alcmaeon, the son of Amphiaraus, in appearance." --Kansas Bear (talk) 21:03, 3 July 2020 (UTC)

GA Review

This review is transcluded from Talk:Orontes I/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Nominator: HistoryofIran (talk · contribs) 12:26, 4 April 2024 (UTC)

Reviewer: Relativity (talk · contribs) 19:05, 7 April 2024 (UTC)

Hey, I'll be reviewing this article and checking it against the good article criteria. Let me know if you have any questions by leaving a message on my talk page or by pinging me here. ‍Relativity ⚡️ 19:05, 7 April 2024 (UTC)

Copyvio check

Ran it on Earwig's. 6.5%. I won't mark that criterion as pass until I do the source spot check, though.

Source spot check

• Briant, Pierre's source— looks good.
• Clark, Jessica H.; Turner, Brian's source—
• Garsoian, Nina's source—
• Osborne, Michael J. (1971) source—
• Ruzicka, Stephen's source—
• Schmitt, Rüdiger's source—
• Troxell, Hyla A.'s source—

I may add more sources to this list as time goes on for any reason. ‍Relativity ⚡️ 01:42, 16 April 2024 (UTC)

Feedback

Main feedback is completed for now, but I might have some points added as I re-read.

• Lead: was a Bactrian nobleman, who served as— remove comma

Done. --HistoryofIran (talk) 20:08, 7 April 2024 (UTC)

• Lead: He first appears in 401 BC as the satrap of— does this mean that he first appeared in history works in 401 BC?

Yup. Fixed. --HistoryofIran (talk) 20:08, 7 April 2024 (UTC)

• Lead: Per MOS:LEADLENGTH, the lead is a bit long. Although the figures in that table are just suggestions, for the length of the article, you might want to consider trimming the lead just a bit.
• Lead: The second, third, and fourth sentence in the first paragraph in the lead should be moved to the second paragraph in the lead. The first paragraph in the lead should then summarize the most important things Orontes I did.
• Question: there's no estimated time for when Orontes I was born? My assumption is no, since he only first appears in records in 401 BC.

That's right. Btw, I won't be with my own pc for a few days, so won't be able to properly address this review until then. --HistoryofIran (talk) 15:04, 10 April 2024 (UTC)

No problem. If needs be, I can place this on hold. ‍Relativity ⚡️ 00:02, 11 April 2024 (UTC)

• Lead: This led to Tiribazus' dismissal and imprisonment. This was followed by— Having two consecutive sentences start with "this" seems a bit repetitive to me. Could you possibly find a way to reword those?

Done. --HistoryofIran (talk) 14:06, 18 April 2024 (UTC)

• Lead: The terms of the treaty was that Evagoras was obligated to pay tribute to the Persian king, but as a subordinate king rather than a slave.— Too specific for the lead, I suggest removing it.

Done. --HistoryofIran (talk) 14:06, 18 April 2024 (UTC)

• Artaxerxes III did not deem the conclusion of the war satisfactory, as it had cost 15,000 talents, and a result Orontes fell into disfavour.

• Lead: Trim this so it only says what the war did to Orontes (e.g. "Orontes fell into disfavor as a result of the war")

Done. --HistoryofIran (talk) 14:06, 18 April 2024 (UTC)

• Expedition to Cyprus: add "as" after "and"'

Sorry, I'm not sure I understand. Where should it be added? --HistoryofIran (talk) 14:06, 18 April 2024 (UTC)

@HistoryofIran: Ah, sorry, this is pertaining to and a result Orontes fell into disfavour. ‍Relativity ⚡️ 03:35, 19 April 2024 (UTC)

• Lead: Orontes later reappears in 362/1 BC, as the hyparch of Mysia — "hyparch" in this sentence links to "satrap". What's the difference between the two?
• Lead According to the classical Greek historian Diodorus Siculus (died c. 30 BC), Orontes thought that he would be greatly rewarded if he did so at such a critical point. — Too specific for the lead IMO

Made it less specific. Thoughts? --HistoryofIran (talk) 14:06, 17 April 2024 (UTC)

• I'm noticing that a lot of sentences that are in the lead are also in the body with the exact same wording. I don't think that there's anything wrong per se with that, but you do end up getting more detail in the lead than a lead is supposed to have, and it does have the feeling of déjà vu. What's your opinion: should these duplicate sentences be reworded or should they stay as-is?

I think it's fine, since the lead is ultimately meant to a summary of the body of the article. --HistoryofIran (talk) 14:06, 18 April 2024 (UTC)

• Background— Him and his father are the only— change to "He and his father"

Done. --HistoryofIran (talk) 14:15, 15 April 2024 (UTC)

• Background, second paragraph— why is the claim supported by his marriage? And how does that marriage show that Orontes was probably descended from Hydarnes from his maternal line?

Unfortunately the source doesn't say, I assume he couldn't get married into the royal family if he wasn't of high descent. As for the maternal line bit, it's because Hydarnes was Persian, so the author states that Orontes couldnt have been descended from him through his paternal line, as it was Bactrian. I've adjusted that bit to make it more clear. --HistoryofIran (talk) 22:35, 15 April 2024 (UTC)

• Expedition to Cyprus— when he as satrap of Armenia harassed the Ten Thousand— How did he "harass" them?

Changed it to "pursued". --HistoryofIran (talk) 22:50, 15 April 2024 (UTC)

• Expedition to Cyprus— feared that he might be accused of cooperation.— Why was cooperation a bad thing?

I've changed it to "cooperating with him" (Tiribazus), as Tiribazus had just been jailed due to suspicions of rebellion. Thoughts? --HistoryofIran (talk) 14:22, 15 April 2024 (UTC)

• Expedition to Cyprus— him much of Greek unit of the Persian forces— add "the" before "Greek"

Done. --HistoryofIran (talk) 14:15, 15 April 2024 (UTC)

• Legacy— A relief of Orontes was also erected by the stelae— surely the stelae itself didn't erect the relief?

Ops, changed it to "on the stelae". --HistoryofIran (talk) 14:26, 15 April 2024 (UTC)

• Coinage— It has been suggested that the gold coins minted at Lampsacus were by Orontes due to two reasons.. So did Orontes design the coins himself? Did he mint them? Or did they just have his face on them?
• I don't see what the second paragraph in the Coinage section has to do with coinage, excepting the last line of that. Why is that description there?

I've rewritten the first part of the Coinage section. Thoughts? --HistoryofIran (talk) 22:20, 23 April 2024 (UTC)

Image check

• File:MYSIA, Adramytion. Orontes. Satrap of Mysia, Circa 357-352 BC. Æ 10 mm (1.10 g). Head of satrap right.jpg— looks good and relevant
• File:Ancient kingdoms of Cyprus en.svg— Usage looks good, and from what I understand, those are city-states, correct?

Yep, adjusted the description to reflect that better. --HistoryofIran (talk) 14:12, 15 April 2024 (UTC)

• File:Evagoras-Stater 733597 C.jpg— Looks good and relevant
• File:Asia Minor in the Greco-Roman period - general map - regions and main settlements.jpg— Relevant, usage looks good. I don't see a lot of borders on that map. Not really a problem, just slightly confusing because I'm not sure where each country ends and starts.
• File:Orontes I.jpg—Looks good and relevant. There looks like a lot of coins of Orontes I [1], have you considered doing a gallery?

Overall: Image usage and relevancy looks good; just a few comments

Review Progress

Good Article review progress box Criteria: 1a. prose () 1b. MoS () 2a. ref layout () 2b. cites WP:RS () 2c. no WP:OR () 2d. no WP:CV () 3a. broadness () 3b. focus () 4. neutral () 5. stable () 6a. free or tagged images () 6b. pics relevant () Note: this represents where the article stands relative to the Good Article criteria. Criteria marked are unassessed