Talk:Serial rapist

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Welcome![edit]

If you are an editor who would like to help improve this article please enjoy this hearty welcome and expression of appreciation. Since it is a newly created article, it is possible to set some pretty high standards right from the start (we want to give the encyclopedia increased credibility and reliable). Please feel free to discuss this list article freely and with the goal of further improvement and expansion – your opinion matters! Best Regards,

Barbara (WVS) (talk) 14:05, 19 July 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Merges, blanking content[edit]

Please discuss any proposed merges here on the talk page before merging this article with another. There are more references and more content that are ready to be inserted. This article is by no means complete and I am requesting other editors refrain from deleting content without discussing it first on this talk page. Thank you and Best Regards,

Barbara (WVS) (talk) 14:05, 19 July 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Barbara (WVS), I don't see that we need a separate article on serial rape or on serial rapist. I once thought about creating such an article, as seen in the past on my user page, but I changed my mind at some point. If we are to have this article, it should probably be titled Serial rape. Either way, I know you won't agree to a merge. I will see how this article develops. And if I still feel the same way about it, I will bring editors in for a merge discussion. Flyer22 Reborn (talk) 03:42, 20 July 2016 (UTC)[reply]
I also got ahead of myself on this article and still have information to add. There is still content to add from the Cosmopolitan website that is very good, and needs to go in. Serial rapist will eventually also describe the personalities and methodologies of these people. I want to get the Project Crime involved in this also. The rape article really doesn't get into serial rape and is very long already. I understand the frustration of seeing an incomplete article, but if we are a little more patient, this could be a very interesting article. Please add the content that you've already collected. If we work fast enough, this could be a DYK and we know people will be interested in this sort of thing. Do you have psychology magazines that get into this? Best Regards,
Barbara (WVS) (talk) 16:12, 20 July 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Barbara (WVS), yeah, when I first thought about how a merge would happen, I thought of the Rape article. Then the Types of rape article that you recently edited came to mind. I'm not yet sure that the content should be merged. As for resources, I used to have some scholarly texts discussing serial rape, but I don't know where those texts are now. Flyer22 Reborn (talk) 04:50, 21 July 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks Flyer, I still understand why a merge first comes to mind. I'm still not finished. If you come across those sources, please feel free to add them. The reason this article is needed is that there could be potentially hundreds of articles that will link to this one. I felt people should have the information about people like this. I kept looking at the rape article and couldn't honestly find a place where it would fit. If you could find an appropriate graphic, it could make it even better. Those old woodcuts or paintings would be good. How about an image of a 'stalker'? Creepy, but appropriate. Thanks again. Best Regards,
Barbara (WVS) (talk) 09:38, 21 July 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Article expansion[edit]

This article will be significantly expanded in the next two weeks. Therefore any discussions of merging this article should wait until that time. Best Regards,

Barbara (WVS) (talk) 14:07, 19 July 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Neutrality[edit]

I am admitting right now that I am having difficulty writing this article in a neutral manner. I would ask other editors to make certain that I do not over-generalize, make synths or write non-neutral statements. I intend to edit in good faith. I will differentiate between those who have been convicted and those who have not.

Barbara (WVS) (talk) 10:07, 21 July 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks for that, Barbara. I will get around to giving the article a read over. Right now, I am very busy with real-life work; really, I'm often very busy with real-life work. Flyer22 Reborn (talk) 13:47, 23 July 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Flyer, I am deeply touched by your encouragement and camaraderie in helping to make this article happen. No one else has offered to help and I am convinced that this topic resonates with you and other women who may have experiences that are reflected in this article. The views per day have been doubling. I also work and attend college full-time so I understand the issues related to real life. I am encouraged to think that some woman somewhere OR some law enforcement professional will be able to find information that will help solve this topic.
P.S. I have nominated this article for a DYK...let's hope that it appears on the main page. The Very Best of Regards,
Barbara (WVS) (talk) 00:16, 24 July 2016 (UTC)[reply]
I was worried about one section in particular, so I thank EEng for cleaning it up. A more encyclopedic passage can be written on that matter. Flyer22 Reborn (talk) 05:53, 25 July 2016 (UTC)[reply]
The section that was deleted is from a University Police Department. I think it can be restored in a different way.
Barbara (WVS) (talk) 19:53, 27 July 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Taking it to talk[edit]

Since apparently no one cares enough to post this, although they may care enough to revert in a wiki wide edit war, let me point out that this article doesn't seem to mention either men or women, and also Jeffrey Dahmer. So how about a little common sense? TimothyJosephWood 02:49, 27 September 2016 (UTC)[reply]

I think a systematic targeting of men for being men is the criterion in question (as per the category description). Does anyone claim that Dahmer chose to mete out violence on his victims on the basis of their gender? I have seen no source that indicates as much. jps (talk) 13:37, 27 September 2016 (UTC)[reply]
He raped and murdered 17 men and boys. TimothyJosephWood 14:01, 27 September 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Do we have sources which indicate that the gender of his victims was "an important determinant in them being selected for violence"? jps (talk) 19:11, 27 September 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Are you suggesting he raped and murdered 17 men and boys by happenstance? He just didn't meet a woman when it was feeling particularly rapey? TimothyJosephWood 19:13, 27 September 2016 (UTC)[reply]

A source? jps (talk) 19:30, 27 September 2016 (UTC)[reply]

  • Masters, Brian (1993). The Shrine of Jeffrey Dahmer. Hodder & Stoughton. ISBN 978-0-340-59194-9.
  • Norris, Joel (1992). Jeffrey Dahmer. Constable Limited. ISBN 978-0-09-472060-2.
  • Dvorchak, Robert J. (1991). Milwaukee Massacre: Jeffery Dahmer and the Milwaukee Murders. Dell.
  • Schwartz, Anne E, (June 1992). The Man Who Could Not Kill Enough: The Secret Murders of Milwaukee's Jeffrey Dahmer. Citadel. ISBN 978-1-55972-117-2.{{cite book}}: CS1 maint: extra punctuation (link) CS1 maint: multiple names: authors list (link)

You know...this guy Dahmer is fairly well known. You might even say he's famous. TimothyJosephWood 19:36, 27 September 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Which of those do you recommend? Have you read them all? jps (talk) 20:37, 27 September 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Yes. 00:28, 28 September 2016 (UTC)
Which is best? jps (talk) 01:42, 28 September 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Do you have anything constructive to add? Because as far as I can tell, I have provided an example of a serial rapist who targeted men, and your rebuttal is to ask for book reviews. TimothyJosephWood 10:56, 28 September 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Having researched more, I have not found evidence that gender was an important determinant in Dahmer's victims being selected for violence. I await your recommendation of which of the four books that you read indicates this. jps (talk) 11:44, 28 September 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Ah. Yes. You see the problem with that is, he raped and murdered 17 men and boys. TimothyJosephWood 11:55, 28 September 2016 (UTC)[reply]
That doesn't mean gender was an important determinant. jps (talk) 17:19, 28 September 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Ah. Yes. You see the problem with that is, he raped and murdered 17 men and boys. TimothyJosephWood 17:20, 28 September 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Let me know when you have a source. jps (talk) 19:18, 28 September 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Already provided. Stop edit warring. You have no consensus to change the status quo of the article, which has been stable since the day it was created. TimothyJosephWood 19:19, 28 September 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Nope. I do not believe you read the books. You have provided no substantive review of any of them that indicates that the gender of his victims was "an important determinant in them being selected for violence". The WP:ONUS is on you. jps (talk) 19:21, 28 September 2016 (UTC)[reply]
The content you describe would make the article better. If you need help formatting it and getting it into the article, please contact me. I don't own the books. I was considering including a section on notable (because of their articles existing on WP) serial rapists but I have to consult with an expert on BLP to find out what NOT to do with such information. How would anyone like it if their name appeared in an article on serial rape? Plus, since I initiated the article and have clearly indicated on WP my full and real name and city of residence, I'm a little concerned about 'outing' serial rapists even if they have already been 'outed' by having their own articles.
Barbara (WVS) (talk) 17:06, 12 December 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Hey Barbara (WVS). Since this was a fairly stale discussion about a category, it's not entirely clear from your comment which content you are referring to exactly.
As far as BLP goes, WP:BLPCRIME is the most relevant policy. Basically, if they've been convicted it's a go. If they've not been convicted it's a no-go, regardless of how many people have made accusations. The exception to this is individuals who are WP:WELLKNOWN, who likely already have a Wikipedia article, and for whom the allegations themselves are sufficiently high-profile that they are likely notable in-and-of-themselves. As always, the content would have to be grounded in high quality reliable sources. TimothyJosephWood 18:17, 12 December 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Sorry, this discussion seems to be occurring in slow motion, and I am completely to blame. Let me see if I understand: You have made suggestions to improve the article and someone else doesn't agree to your improvements, right?

Barbara (WVS) (talk) 22:10, 31 December 2016 (UTC)[reply]
No this was quite an old discussion, and centered around article categories, which are a somewhat obscure part of the project that many casual readers don't utilize. TimothyJosephWood 22:59, 31 December 2016 (UTC)[reply]
Barbara (WVS), given that serial rapists are men, I do find it odd that "men" is not used once in this article. I am not aware of any research identifying women as serial rapists (unless speaking of cases where a woman sexually abused more than one child). Recidivism for crime, especially for sexual offenses, is usually much lower for women anyway. Flyer22 Reborn (talk) 07:09, 1 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]
I will add gendered data at some point; the sources certainly use gendered language. Flyer22 Reborn (talk) 03:13, 5 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

source[edit]

  • [1]
  • [2] deprivation of liberty and rights

Barbara (WVS) (talk) 22:39, 1 January 2017 (UTC)[reply]

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