Talk:South Park, Los Angeles

	California portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject California, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of the U.S. state of California on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.CaliforniaWikipedia:WikiProject CaliforniaTemplate:WikiProject CaliforniaCalifornia articles
Low	This article has been rated as Low-importance on the project's importance scale.
	Greater Los Angeles portal This article is supported by Los Angeles area task force (assessed as Low-importance).

There's another area called South Park in South Central LA[edit]

There's a park on Avalon, south of Vernon, called South Park, and the area around it is called South Park, at least by the police.

Gentrifiers and developers need to look up the names they want to use for their developments. There are sometimes areas of LA that already use the name you want. Using the same name creates confusion. Rich people can't keep acting like poor people live in a different universe. It's immoral, and it's un-American. Here's a URL http://projects.latimes.com/mapping-la/neighborhoods/neighborhood/south-park/ 99.61.115.77 (talk) 04:29, 12 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I am taking care of this by writing a new article about the original South Park and placing it here. The present article about Downtown's South Park will be copied and pasted to South Park (Downtown Los Angeles). GeorgeLouis (talk) 05:38, 14 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Article Lead[edit]

Hello User:Sbmeirow. You were one of the final voices in an RFC (Request for Comment) at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject_Cities/Archive_19#Request_for_comment establishing a rough consensus against the inclusion of terms such as "affluent" or "poor" in ledes to articles on cities and towns in general.

I am wondering about the lede for South Park, Los Angeles. The RFC would indicate that the term "low income" can be removed. But what about terms like "high ratio of single parents", "low rate of marriage" and "adults over age 25 failed to finish high school—69.4%" that are currently in the lede? I am not sure if the RFC would cover the removal of these terms, or if they do actually belong in the lede. Phatblackmama (talk) 00:02, 18 March 2017 (UTC)[reply]

I moved your question from my personal talk section over to this article. This article should be treated somewhat like a "city article", including the section names and layout. I did a rough cleanup of the article, but someone else needs to cleanup the demographics section. The demographics issues should stay in that section. • Sbmeirow • Talk • 04:05, 18 March 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Hello Sbmeirow...you said that this should be treated somewhat like a "city article". I like what you did and would like to change some of the other Los Angeles pages. Is there a "city article" template I can reference? Thanks, Phatblackmama (talk) 18:32, 8 May 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Hello Phatblackmama. This may be what you are looking for: Cities/US Guideline. cheers, Fettlemap (talk) 21:24, 8 May 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Look at some of the community articles in these lists: List of communities and neighborhoods of San Diego / List of districts and neighborhoods of Los Angeles / List of neighborhoods in San Francisco / List of neighborhoods in Seattle. • Sbmeirow • Talk • 20:54, 3 July 2018 (UTC)[reply]

In general, other than the total population or population density, summaries of other types of demographics don't belong in introduction of community type articles. • Sbmeirow • Talk • 20:38, 3 July 2018 (UTC)[reply]

"All but the shortest articles should start with Introductory text (the 'lead'), which establishes significance, includes mention of significant criticism or controversies, and make readers want to learn more." My own opinion is that if a neighborhood veers significantly from the majority of other neighborhoods in L.A., then we should mention that distinction, good or bad, but not necessarily in the lead, unless a WP:Reliable source has also made a significant mention of it. BeenAroundAWhile (talk) 05:51, 4 July 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Population Tag[edit]

The Tag "‎Demographics: this section needs rework to sound more neutral" was added March 17 by Sbmeirow and recently deleted without any discussion. I agree with that statement and have restored the tag. Phatblackmama (talk) 18:00, 30 June 2018 (UTC)[reply]

What parts of this section are not neutral? Everything seems to be sourced. Thanks for your attention. BeenAroundAWhile (talk) 04:55, 3 July 2018 (UTC)[reply]

I changed the banner. Though "LA Times" is a notable website, it is NOT an official source for demographics information. The information should be pulled from a federal website, such as census.gov, and a reference pointing back to the exact original source should be included. • Sbmeirow • Talk • 20:33, 3 July 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Where do you get the idea that "information should be pulled from a federal website"? Also, the boundary for South Park is an L.A. Times definition, so why shouldn't the population figures be the same? Thanks. I am restoring the article the way it was for many years. There was nothing wrong with it. BeenAroundAWhile (talk) 04:26, 4 July 2018 (UTC)[reply]

1) Though a neighborhood isn't a city, the following still has some influence on neighborhood articles ---> Wikipedia:USCITY. Whether an unincorporated community or other legal words are used to describe a community, this is the guideline that is used for all of them. • Sbmeirow • Talk • 05:09, 4 July 2018 (UTC)[reply]

2) 3rd party sites are NOT considered official sources for United States demographics information, such as population and other statistics that are typically stated in community articles. census.gov is a major source, and some other information is found at other federal sources. • Sbmeirow • Talk • 05:09, 4 July 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Hi! Thanks! I looked at the guideline, which would be hard to follow in neighborhood articles unless the federal census was coterminous with the exact neighborhood boundaries. Since we are using the boundaries of Mapping L.A. to define the perimeter of this neighborhood, it seems that we should also use the population figures that the same source came up with. Anyway, I've made it clearer in the text that we are doing that. Hope everybody is satisfied! Yours sincerely, BeenAroundAWhile (talk) 05:29, 4 July 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Oh, one other thing! If anybody can find other census info, or other ways to define this neighborhood and its makeup, we could incorporate them into this article, of course! BeenAroundAWhile (talk) 05:32, 4 July 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Still thinkin', sorry . . . The figs from the L.A. Times ARE census statistics, labeled as such, "as measured by the 2000 U.S. census." Where we ought to be spending our time is lobbying the Times to update their statistics. The year 2000 was a long way back. (Now that there is new ownership for the paper, maybe we have a chance to get all of these stats brought up to at least 2010.) BeenAroundAWhile (talk) 05:40, 4 July 2018 (UTC)[reply]

I'm not sure what a neighborhood is called in the census.gov database. Prior to editing Wikipedia, I've never heard of the census term CDP which means Census-designated place, so I assume there are other "weird" acronyms too. The government creates statistics in many ways, thus a person isn't just counted in one and only one way.... depending on the boundaries, a person is included in counts for states, counties, cities, school districts, voting districts, zip codes, and other grouping methods. By the way, census bureau has computer generated maps for these grouping methods. I've used some of their computer-generated school district maps in the past. Just to prepare you, digging through the census website isn't easy. Good luck! • Sbmeirow • Talk • 06:09, 4 July 2018 (UTC)[reply]

@Phatblackmama:, @Sbmeirow: See WikiProject Cities/US Guideline|US cities RFC April 2015 as this is about demographics as defined by the census bureau. The "community" typically existed before the CDP was named by the Census Bureau and will remain after they redefine the area. Here is some suggested language as the statistics are based on CDP. "Foo is an unincorporated community in Foo County, Foo State, United States. For statistical purposes, the United States Census Bureau has defined Foo as a census-designated place (CDP). The census definition of the area may not precisely correspond to local understanding of the area with the same name." Cheers, Fettlemap (talk) 04:38, 6 July 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Geography Boxes[edit]

@BeenAroundAWhile and SMcCandlish: There was a discussion about the misuse of the nav box on the Sylmar, Los Angeles Talk page on July 3 with an explanation by SMcCandlish On July 4, a nav box was added to this article, South Park, Los Angeles. It is now removed. Phatblackmama (talk) 02:36, 6 July 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Sorry I didn't see this before. Those boxes, of course, are just fine at the bottom of the page, according to WP:Consensus. Cheers. BeenAroundAWhile (talk) 23:42, 13 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]