Talk:Trinity College (Connecticut)/Archive 1

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Archive 1

Old discussions

Id like the see the section about white flight related to Trinity - this is more about city of hartford then Trinity.—Preceding unsigned comment added by Afinemetsfan (talk • contribs) 20:31, July 15, 2005

Some statistics about the crime would be nice- they are somewhere on trincoll.edu —Preceding unsigned comment added by Afinemetsfan (talk • contribs) 20:34, July 15, 2005

"Hartford gives Trinity many advantages over other liberal arts colleges, or LACs" -- this is an opinion and hardly belongs in an NPOV article. 15.235.153.107 14:37, 21 August 2006 (UTC)

Hartford, as an urban center, has opportunities owing to its size and infrastructure which suburban and rural colleges cannot match in such close proximity: that is hardly an issue for NPOV. If you want to detract from the school's prestige, you're welcome to factually research and report on the implied varia suffered by Trinity and its community from being located in Hartford - IF you can find and document it. I'd like to see some illustration of the college's recent proactivity in recruiting more minority students instead of rehashing the Princeton Review's yellow journalism.—Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.83.243.7 (talk • contribs) 16:37, March 19, 2007

this whole article is nothing but glowing words about trinity and its surrounding community. every time i add something about the huge and frightening problem with crime, people getting stabbed at frats, and there being an ice cream truck that sells crack, it gets taken out. if trinity wants to advertise for themselves, dont do it on wikipedia—Preceding unsigned comment added by 157.252.66.54 (talk • contribs) 11:19, April 5, 2007

Gosh, that's awful. How can you have a complete, balanced article about the college without including ice cream trucks selling crack and frat murders? This article is supposed to be a factual report on the college, not a crank's tell-all pulp novel about the neighborhood, and whether true or urban myth, these horror stories are hardly typical or representative. Sounds to me like you're the one who needs a sense of perspective. If you're just here because you have an axe to grind, well, don't do it on Wikipedia. 69.30.112.12 22:22, 18 October 2007 (UTC)
Probably worth mentioning that the "frat murders" dont exist. I can't vouch for the ice cream truck, because though I have seen it around, I have not seen anyone purchase crack from it. ---You'reMyJuliet 04:40, 19 October 2007 (UTC)

i agree with what the last individual wrote. i have lived in the same neighborhood as trinity almost all my life, and i know what this neighborhood is like. recently, it's gotten better but it can still be called a troubled area. but the thing about trinity is that it is very insular. it does at times cooperate with local communities, but it is a bubble world. and any talk about diversity in trinity is pure crap. trinity is selective, and it usually chooses members of hartford's 'old money' families, or rich folks in general. it has made little progress in diversifying its student population with people of color from hartford.—Preceding unsigned comment added by 64.251.55.200 (talk • contribs) 14:54, April 5, 2007

The assertion that Trinity 'usually chooses ...'old money'... and 'rich folks in general' is ignorant and sad. That may have been true 100 years ago, but hasn't been for a long time. Trinity has a vested interest in accepting the best students who apply, and has been extremely proactive about recruiting for diversity. Do you know anything about what you're talking about? You could learn a lot with five minutes of honest, intelligent effort. Sure it's insular. A lot of colleges are. They're not studying Hartford. Sorry. And sorry if this is a harsh reality for you, but Trinity is not a community college or some kind of public charity, and does not owe 'people of color from Hartford' some kind of unearned free ride just because they live nearby, as you imply. I think it's pretty clear you have a chip on your shoulder. Go educate yourself a little before you open your mouth. That's something YOU owe people. 69.30.112.12 22:22, 18 October 2007 (UTC)

References

I started to mark a few sections as unreferenced but I'm stopping as I would have to do that to every section. Please add citations to this article. --ElKevbo 23:55, 6 May 2007 (UTC)

International Hip Hop Festival

Having been site of the first International Hip Hop festival I'm surprised there isn't anything in the article about this, especially given that it's become an annual affair since 2006. Is it worth researching in order to add this sort of information to the article? Angel of Mons (talk) 22:52, 2 February 2008 (UTC)

I agree. I will be do some research about this and add a relevant section in the coming weeks. -randrew06110 —Preceding unsigned comment added by Randrew06110 (talk • contribs) 01:27, 18 August 2010 (UTC)

Peter Kraus

Your link goes to the wrong page -- a German singer, not an investment banker. I don't know how to delete the linking. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.10.198.120 (talk) 18:06, 20 September 2008 (UTC)

I fixed that. Thanks! (Joseph A. Spadaro (talk) 13:05, 21 May 2011 (UTC))

NPOV?

"Furthermore, Trinity College is a community united in a quest for excellence in liberal arts education. Trinity's purpose is to foster critical thinking, free the mind of parochialism and prejudice, and prepare students to lead examined lives that are personally satisfying, civically responsible, and socially useful." -- written for a press release, not NPOV —Preceding unsigned comment added by 137.99.115.90 (talk) 15:51, 8 April 2009 (UTC)

No, that is the mission statement of the College. It is one of the top liberal arts colleges in the world. 157.252.146.251 (talk) 06:20, 19 February 2010 (UTC)

Irrelevant Phillippine college reference

"In 1963, Capitol City College in Quezon City, the Philippines, was purchased by the The Episcopal Church of the United States and renamed Trinity College of Quezon City, after Trinity College (Connecticut). The 1920-1943 president of Trinity College Connecticut was the father of Bishop Ogilby the head of the The Episcopal Church of the United States (Philippines Missionary District). Trinity College of Quezon City has since expanded and been renamed Trinity University of Asia, still maintains its strong links with the Episcopal Church in the Philippines, and still proudly proclaims its early links with Trinity College Connecticut [1]."

I deleted the above text about the Trinity College in Quezon City , Phillippines. While this information may be interesting, it does not belong here. Trinity College Hartford has made and sustained links with many colleges and institutions around the world in the last hundred and eighty years, but such links do not merit a mention, let alone a prominent and out-of-context paragraph, in a general article about the College. Perhaps this bit of ephemera would be appropriate in an article about the Phillippine college. I would ask the no-doubt earnest and well-meaning author of this paragraph to please understand that the information is inappropriate here and to refrain from re-including it. 174.25.155.1 (talk) 23:05, 28 December 2009 (UTC)

References

  1. ^ http://www.tua.edu.ph

Endowment

The source cited for $501.5 million at June 30, 2011 (http://www.trincoll.edu/AboutTrinity/offices/accounting/Documents/DP006AFBE4%20Trinity%20College%20-%20FINAL.pdf, p.4) shows the amount is for "Endowment and similar net assets", not just endowment. The $416.5 million cited by NACUBO at June 30, 2011 is for endowment only, and is identical to the endowment amount reported by Trinity College in "Endowment Statistics 2010-2011" at http://www.trincoll.edu/givingtotrinity/endowment/Pages/statistics.aspx . — Preceding unsigned comment added by Contributor321 (talk • contribs) 19:34, 18 January 2013 (UTC)

External links modified

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"In popular culture" section

An unregistered editor is insisting that the following material be included in the article in a "In popular culture" section of this article:

Films
  • In the opening scenes of the thriller film Jaws (1975), Cassidy states that he is a student at Trinity.
  • In the Bollywood film, Desi Boyz (2011), the song "Allah Maaf Kare" features Trinity banners and the Bantam throughout the song.
  • In the romantic comedy movie That Awkward Moment (2014), Daniel talks to his friend about a girl from Trinity.
Television

I contend that this information is not only poorly sourced (not sourced at all) but it's also so poorly connected to this college that readers don't learn anything from this information. In short, this information is trivial and should not be included in this encyclopedia article. ElKevbo (talk) 19:57, 6 October 2017 (UTC)

This contention is erroneous. Popular culture is a common entry for institutions such as Trinity, and these are legitimate instances of Trinity appearing in popular culture. If you contest the legitimacy of these appearances, then please state it, but the lack of a link is not a sufficient grounds for removing a popular culture reference. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 157.252.97.113 (talk • contribs) 11:50, October 16, 2017 (UTC)
The lack of a well described link to this subject is precisely why this information doesn't belong. The burden is on you to justify why material should be added to or retained in an article! We cannot and should not include every passing mention of this college. In what way do this information help readers understand critical information about this subject? ElKevbo (talk) 16:21, 16 October 2017 (UTC)
The section deals exactly in this question... when the college has been mentioned in popular culture. If you are wanting popular culture references to "help readers understand critical information," then that is an issue with all articles on people and institutions with popular culture references. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 157.252.97.113 (talk • contribs) 12:43, October 16, 2017 (UTC)
You seem to be mistaking this encyclopedia article for a scrapbook. I admit that many other editors do the same thing and this is a widespread problem. But that in no way excuses the behavior especially when you've been alerted to it. So again I ask: In what way do this information help readers understand critical information about this subject? ElKevbo (talk) 16:58, 16 October 2017 (UTC)

All of these are passing mentions and have no secondary sources to demonstrate any importance to the article topic. That's trivia, and shouldn't be included. Toohool (talk) 20:43, 20 October 2017 (UTC)

"Notable alumni" section

One or more unregistered editors are insisting that the "Notable alumni" section only include deceased alumni e.g., Tucker Carlson has been repeatedly removed. This is out of step with how nearly every other article handles this section so I think those editors who insist on this criterion should at a minimum explain their rationale instead of continuing to edit war with other editors. ElKevbo (talk) 20:00, 6 October 2017 (UTC)

In response to your query of notable alumni, there is an entire article on Trinity College alumni with hundreds of entries. For this section, it is necessary to limit these entries to alumni with some significance. Historical significance is one method that is relatively less controversial than allowing more recent alumni. If you have a different criterion on choosing significant alumni, please suggest it. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 157.252.97.113 (talk • contribs) 11:50, October 16, 2017 (UTC)
I don't know of any article that limits listed alumni to only dead people. More importantly, it paints a very incomplete picture of this university if some living alumni aren't included here unless your intention is to tell readers that there are no living alumni of note. Your proposed criterion is certainly clear cut but it's unworkable because it's painting a very incomplete and misleading image of this college.
More importantly, you don't own this article and get to unilaterally decide all of its content. And learn to sign your posts, please. ElKevbo (talk) 16:25, 16 October 2017 (UTC)
So why update the article to include that one alumnus? What criterion did you use? Among all the living alumni of the college, why focus on the one whose inclusion is a thinly-veiled political statement? His notability is certainly controversial, as evidenced by his repeated deletion by multiple users. Your assertion that I am trying to own the article is inaccurate... I am simply trying to remove an entry whose significance is disputed, similarly to your assertion that the contribution in the popular culture section that the "information is trivial and should not be included." — Preceding unsigned comment added by 157.252.97.113 (talk • contribs) 12:43, October 16, 2017 (UTC)
I don't really care very much about this particular alumnus. But he is quite well known so it seems odd to me that you want to omit him from this article. And I'm not convinced that "multiple editors" have removed this information; as far as I can tell only unregistered editors have removed the material which certainly raises the possibility that you're using multiple computers to make the same edits.
Aside from Tucker Carlson, what exactly is your objection to including George Will, a Pulitzer Prize winner? ElKevbo (talk) 17:03, 16 October 2017 (UTC)
I've told you my criteria... it is simple and it serves the purpose to avoid exactly this type of conflict. What is your criteria for wanting these two polarizing figures in this article, among the hundreds of alumni listed on the other article? And you can call me a liar, but that doesn't mean you are correct. It seems to me that you are trying to own this article yourself. 157.252.97.113 (talk) 17:08, 16 October 2017 (UTC)
"Has earned worldwide recognition and the top prize in his or her field" is a quite reasonable and workable criterion. So I'm adding Will back to this article. If there are other living alumni that are of similar stature, I encourage you to add them, too. ElKevbo (talk) 17:13, 16 October 2017 (UTC)
Why didn't you include Jim Murray, Edward Albee, Charles McLean Andrews, Hyam Plutzik, or William Marimow? What criteria did you use for choosing that one person over the five others who earned the exact same prize? 157.252.97.113 (talk) 20:54, 16 October 2017 (UTC)
If they've also earned a Pulitzer or something similar then they probably should be included, too. Feel free to add them! ElKevbo (talk) 21:28, 16 October 2017 (UTC)
That wasn't the question. The question was why you seem so intent on adding this particular character. There seems to be a trend to the people you would like to add, and it is not the fact that they are particularly notable people. 32.213.224.119 (talk) 02:17, 17 October 2017 (UTC)
What? ElKevbo (talk) 03:07, 17 October 2017 (UTC)

I reformatted the Carlson link as 69.204.160.169 added it as [[Tucker Carlson|Tucker]] [[Tucker Carlson|Carlson]]. Good to know that Trinity as other notables to list besides Carlson. There are quite a few redlinks on List of Trinity College (Connecticut) people that appear not to meet wp:listpeople.
Perhaps the Some notable alumni of Trinity College include: should be rephrased. This would seem to invite all sorts of riffraff. Jim1138 (talk) 22:59, 18 October 2017 (UTC)

I agree with ElKevbo. Also, Carson is by far the most currently known and popular on that list due to his media personality, hence there is no reason he should not be there. Also, the 'Notable Alumni' sections have always hosted bot alive and dead people, I don't understand the dead-only criterion. Here's a quick trick: https://tools.wmflabs.org/massviews/?platform=all-access&agent=user&source=category&target=https%3A%2F%2Fen.wikipedia.org%2Fwiki%2FCategory%3ATrinity_College_(Connecticut)_alumni&range=latest-20&subjectpage=0&subcategories=0&sort=views&direction=1&view=list. All the people in the Trinity College alumni category listed by pageviews on Wikipdia. Quick way of assessing populirty. Carson tops the list. This shows that on Wikipedia he is objectively the most popular alumnus. BAsed on this, I would reccomend also the insertion of Danny Meyer and Stephen Gyllenhaal. Eccekevin (talk) 16:37, 20 October 2017 (UTC)
I disagree. That shows absolutely no objectivity. 32.213.224.119 (talk) 19:56, 21 October 2017 (UTC)
You're welcome to disagree. You're not welcome to impose your minority view on this article. ElKevbo (talk) 20:02, 21 October 2017 (UTC)
Was just about to say the same thing myself. Jonathan A Jones (talk) 20:05, 21 October 2017 (UTC)
Neither are you. I have proposed a solution that would eliminate any controversy for this article. You unilaterally decided that this was not acceptable to you, with no objective criterion to replace it. I'm still waiting for you to come up with such a criterion. Just that people tend to click on a link is an indication of how controversial the character is, not how notable the person is. 32.213.224.119 (talk) 20:06, 21 October 2017 (UTC)
Three different editors disagree with you and your edits here. You're welcome to try to continue to convince us and propose edits but this is not your article to own. Stop making the edits with which many other editors have explicitly disagreed or you're going to end up blocked which won't get you anywhere. ElKevbo (talk) 20:09, 21 October 2017 (UTC)
There is no controversy to begin with, you made it up. All articles have a Notable Alumni section. Tucker Carson is by far the most notable alumni of this school, proven by objective pageview statistics. That is all.Eccekevin (talk) 01:23, 22 October 2017 (UTC)

I have been contacted off-wiki by a faculty member at Trinity College. They're clearly quite upset about this issue because of some local controversy which I don't entirely understand. I have explained that per WP:NOTCENSORED attempts to remove mentions of Tucker Carlson are unlikely to succeed, but I have also suggested some slightly more sensible alternatives to edit warring which they could pursue if they have genuine concerns. Jonathan A Jones (talk) 19:03, 24 October 2017 (UTC)

Oh. Ok. Thanks for letting us know!
For anyone who is associated with this college: I'm afraid that publicly disowning an undesirable alumnus, especially by edit warring at Wikipedia, is unlikely to be successful. In fact, it's probably going to make things worse. If you believe that an alumnus is not representative of your college then my best suggestion is to add alumni who are representative. Surely there are more than two living alumni who are notable and interesting! I'm sure that some of them can and should be added to this article to make it more informative and helpful for readers. It would also be helpful if this section were changed so it's not just a bulleted list but a paragraph or two of prose that discusses representative alumni. I recommend looking at the very best college and university articles for examples of how they discuss alumni especially when there is already a separate list article dedicated to listing all notable alumni. Finally, I caution anyone associated with this university to please read and adhere to our guidelines surrounding conflicts of interest; it's probably best that you make suggested edits here in Talk instead of editing the article yourself. ElKevbo (talk) 19:51, 24 October 2017 (UTC)
Archive 1
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