Talk:Trot (music)

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Name[edit]

Why is this named so? I find it odd that the name of the article is the Korean pronunciation of an English word. SKS2K6 08:07, 13 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I would have to agree. How about Trot (Korean music)? -- Visviva 09:05, 13 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I've moved it to trot (music), since that has been a longstanding redirect here; apparently it is not considered ambiguous with foxtrot. -- Visviva 09:11, 13 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

What is ppongjjak?[edit]

The article defines and blue-links the common English word "foxtrot," but a Korean word is used with neither explanation nor link: " (sometimes called ppongjjak, due to its distinctive background rhythm)." What is ppongjjak?Kdammers (talk) 10:58, 17 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I have part of the answer — ppongjjak is the onomatopoedic word for the beat. I'm not sure if it means anything beyond that, though. SKS (talk) 16:24, 17 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

User SKS has it right - that's simply how Koreans characterize that strong underlying instrumental line. Sort of like the western term "oompah". --Snow (talk) 20:08, 30 August 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Trot originated from Enka?[edit]

No, no, no. It's originated from Korean Minyo, even Enka comes from Korean Minyo originally introduced by Korean immigrant.--KSentry(talk) 04:58, 16 August 2011 (UTC)[reply]

I reverted your edit. You removed a description along with the following supporting four references and added a description without any source.

The reference you removed are: (emphasis added)

Bernstein; Sekine, Naoki; Weissman, Dick (2007). The global music industry: three perspectives. Routledge. ISBN 0415975794. From the 1950s to the 1980s, Korean pop music was overall much the same as Japanese enka and popular music. This music was called trot, which was influenced by Japanese songs during the land's occupation by the Japanese army
Shepherd, John (2005). Continuum encyclopedia of popular music of the world, Volumes 3-7. Continuum. ISBN 0826474365. Teuroteu, influenced by Japanese enka, owes its name to the fox trot, as its duple- meter structure was a striking departure from the triple-meter structure of most indigenous musics in Korea.
Lee, Gang-Im (2008). Directing Koreanness: Directors and playwrights under the national flag, 1970--2000. ProQuest. ISBN 1109055269. Despite the considerable popularity of trot song in South Korea, due to the origin of trot song in Japanese enka, this genre is still debated among (pop) critics.
Chaedan, Kyoryu (1997). Performing arts. Korea Foundation. ISBN 8986090112. Most South Korean pop singers of the 'trot" or ppongtchak style, a sentimental genre influenced by Japanese enka, prefer the characteristically powerful chest voice of the p'ansori singers to the typical Japanese style which employs ... {{cite book}}: |first1= missing |last1= (help); Missing pipe in: |first1= (help)CS1 maint: extra punctuation (link) CS1 maint: numeric names: authors list (link)―― Phoenix7777 (talk) 09:01, 16 August 2011 (UTC)[reply]

But all above sources doesn't saying anything about Trot being originated from Enka, Who founded Enka in first place? It was Korean immigrant who used Korean minyo to came up with Enka. There are sources like "Encyclopedia of contemporary Japanese culture By Sandra Buckley", "http://repositories.lib.utexas.edu/bitstream/handle/2152/1699/sonmj12158.pdf?sequence=2", "Tears of Longing: Nostalgia and the Nation in Japanese Popular Song By Christine Reiko Yano" all say differently than your sources say (like Trot was INFLUENCED by enka) can be debated by using these sources from both Korean AND Japanese sources alike. Also, the modern Enka started in the 30s, as for Trot, started earlier according to the the Trot songs from 20s and 1910s. --KSentry(talk) 00:57, 24 August 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Please see above source by Lee, Gang-Im says "due to the origin of trot song in Japanese enka". I have no intention to reproduce the real world dispute and try to resolve it here. You cannot remove the sourced content. What you can do in this situation is to add a counter argument with a reliable source to this article. ―― Phoenix7777 (talk) 08:38, 24 August 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Lee, Gang-Im never said about Trot GENRE, he mentioned a PARTICULAR TROT SONG, if you rephrase the quote, she said it is "debated" for the Trot GENRE, not a Trot SONG (he refers to in first paragraph). "due to the origin of trot song in Japanese enka, this genre is still debated among (pop) critics." Sources I provided above "Encyclopedia of contemporary Japanese culture By Sandra Buckley" and "Tears of Longing: Nostalgia and the Nation in Japanese Popular Song By Christine Reiko Yano" all contradicts your claims.--KSentry(talk) 00:34, 25 August 2011 (UTC)[reply]

I am sorry I couldn't understand your argument about the song and the genre. In the sentence "Despite the considerable popularity of "trot song" in South Korea, due to the origin of "trot song" in Japanese enka, this genre is still debated among (pop) critics.", what do you think this genre refers to? Do you think the word "trot song" in the sentence refers to a "PARTICULAR TROT SONG"? Then Isn't a definite article "the" required to the word "trot song"?.

I am not interested in your contradicting sources, However if these are your reason to revert my edit, please provide the page number and the relevant direct quote supporting the contradiction. Otherwise I will restore my edit blanked by you. As far as my research, none of these two sources contradict my edit. ―― Phoenix7777 (talk) 08:54, 26 August 2011 (UTC)[reply]

I was waiting for your response patiently more than a week. However your first edit was an irrelevant edit to our discussion without respondng this discussion. So I reverted your edit. ―― Phoenix7777 (talk) 11:13, 5 September 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Greetings, I am a student of Music in International Relations, and for my class project I chose to examine how Korean trot music, or t'urott'u, has, over the course of time, developed multiple meanings for different social groups in Korea, and how it has been used and conceptualized throughout contemporary Korean history. As such, I'd like to contribute my findings to this article. I noticed a few folks were talking about the debate of t'urott'u's origins, and I mean to include that debate (an overall summary of it) within my contributions. I will refrain from inserting my own ideas, and will attempt to offer the most objective account of this debate. I also will include the history of t'urott'u, and how it has adopted different names and meanings throughout time. The article, as is of now, has very vague accounts for the history of t'urott'u. I wish to contribute to the following: 1) the development of t'urott'u during the colonial era, 2) the Western influx of this new type of song, along with its Korean elements, 3) the rise of its popularity during the 1950's-1970's, 3) political influences (government's encouragement of Western-style influences during the 1950's, its banishment of Japanese influences), 4) the decline and debate of its origins, 5) the recent revival of t'urott'u during the mid 00's, 6) its usage during reunification talks between the North and South in the 1990's, as well as 7) it's use along the DMZ line in the 2000's. I will support these findings through articles, books, and the like, from scholars such as Keith Howard, Min-jung Son, Gloria L. Pak, and among many others. Chika826 (talk) 18:31, 13 April 2012 (UTC)[reply]

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"Trot (music" listed at Redirects for discussion[edit]

The redirect Trot (music has been listed at redirects for discussion to determine whether its use and function meets the redirect guidelines. Readers of this page are welcome to comment on this redirect at Wikipedia:Redirects for discussion/Log/2024 February 21 § Trot (music until a consensus is reached. Utopes _{(talk / cont)} 07:23, 21 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]