Talk:Unbelievable (miniseries)

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When will they do one on men who have been falsely accused?[edit]

When will they do one on men who have been falsely accused? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 65.94.214.46 (talk) 04:57, 11 February 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Summary of the series[edit]

More input/discussion on this edit would be useful.

Davidnicholsknowsbest believes it is misogynistic to describe the series as about "a series of rapes/rape cases" and that it should instead be described as about "the methods and working relationships which led to the solving of a series of rape cases in Washington State and Colorado" / "the way [the cases] were solved".

I believe these descriptions are non-neutral as they imply that [good] "working relationships"/"methods" led to the case's [successful, positive outcome] "solving", but the show can be viewed as about institutional police and care work failure at every level. Rape is indeed dramatised in the series, and the first episode and other portions of the series are not about the case being "solved" at all. You could say the case was "solved" in that the rapist was imprisoned, but is this the point of a series titled "Unbelievable" where the main subject is raped and then charged with a crime for reporting it?

"Were the cases 'solved' through police methods and working relationships?" just isn't something we should be taking a position on at all in Wikipedia's voice, and instead editor time would be best focused creating an Analysis section and expanding the Reception section based on critics' views of the series' message and effectiveness.

When I reverted, I mistakenly reinserted the text "a series of rapes" rather than writing "a series of rape cases" in the lead, but otherwise I think this version is better. — Bilorv (talk) 11:59, 22 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

The fact that the first episode is not about solving the crime does not mean that the series does not follow this narrative arc - like most crime procedural drama. True, the first episode is about an unsolved crime and the negative experiences of one victim, but subsequent episodes propel the narrative whereby the crime is eventually solved - by which I mean - the rapist is identified and imprisoned. Anyway, or should I say 'therefore', my point stands. The show is not about a series of rapes, or even a series of rape cases, it's about police methods and working relationships, their success or failure, and to go one step further, it's about the way two women can work together on a case like this in a way their less agile male counterparts apparently cannot. I agree that there is a case that a wikipedia entry should not take a position on this - but to describe the show as being about a 'series of rape cases' is not a non-neutral position. It's a misogynist position, which ignores a major, overarching element - indeed, the point - of the series, which is the working relationship of the two women who solve the crime. Instead this so-called 'neutral' description focuses on violence done to women: 'a series of rapes/ rape cases'. Davidnicholsknowsbest (talk) 04:56, 23 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

@Davidnicholsknowsbest: if I've been too indirect—I find your version misogynistic and offensive. I hope we can find some version that neither of us consider offensive. My new suggestion would be Special:Diff/1191471031. In a sign of good faith I've immediately self-reverted as I hope we can reach mutual agreement on a new version before it goes live.

I believe this suggestion:

Avoids making judgement on whether the case was "solved" or whether the police were successful or not.
Summarises the two facets that Deadline used to summarise the series: Marie's story; and the two detectives' investigation.
Avoids quotes wherever the same information can be conveyed in our own words per MOS:QUOTE.

— Bilorv (talk) 19:33, 23 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you for your revision it is acceptable to me and I welcome the chance to stop thinking about this. Davidnicholsknowsbest (talk) 00:39, 24 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]