Talk:Video game producer

History wrong

The early history of Game Producer is wrong.

The first company to use "game producers" was Activision. This took place in 1981 when Activision realized they were in the entertainment business and that the term "project manager" just didn't fit the reality of the job. Brad Fregger was chosen to be the first "game producer," making him the first game producer in the world. The entire story is told in his book, Lucky That Way. Electronic Arts made the same decision after finding out that Activision had created the title of "Producer" for computer and video games. Remember, at that time, Electronic Arts (San Mateo) and Activsion (Mountain View) were both San Francisco Bay Area companies, very competitive and closely related.

The source for this information is Kenneth L. Coleman (Google the entire name.)

Brad Fregger

Bradfregger 17:27, 29 November 2006 (UTC)

Well, considering the fact that you are Brad Fregger (I assume, by your username) and you wrote Lucky That Way, all the information is suspect. I mean, you have a vested interest in presenting the information the way you outlines above. I'm not saying you're lying, we just need an additional credible source to backup your claim.

When I Google "Kenneth L. Coleman", I get tons of hits, lots of guys have that name. I'm not sure which site you think is relevant. Can you provide a direct link? — Frecklefoot | Talk 18:36, 29 November 2006 (UTC)

By the way, from your MobyGames profile I see you worked on Jack Nicklaus 4 (another article you might want to look at) when you were with Accolade. So did I. However, I don't remember ever meeting you. You must've joined Accolade after I left (in '96). — Frecklefoot | Talk 18:39, 29 November 2006 (UTC)

I checked the link you provided for Ken Coleman (http://fisher.osu.edu/About/Office-of-the-Dean/DAC/Coleman), but it doesn't mention the information you dispute. In other posts, you mention the information is from an email from Coleman. Unfortunately, a personal email can't be verified by the readership. So, unless he posts the information on a web site somewhere or in a book, we can't include it as verified information. — Frecklefoot | Talk 16:45, 30 November 2006 (UTC)

=Notable producer list deleted

I deleted the "notable producer" list for two reasons:

1. Like all other lists I created in the related articles (game programmer, game designer, etc.), this list got bloated with several editor's personal favorites. Since we never established any criteria for inclusion in the list, there was no way to keep any producer off the list. Eventually, it'd just grow to include every game producer that ever worked on a video game.
2. Producers aren't really part of the creative force of games. While every developer has some creative input to the game, including producers, they aren't generally well known, at least not for being producers. For example, while Richard Garriott is a producer, he's really known for his work as a game designer (and a programmer, if you want to go way back), not as a producer. Game producers are very much like project managers, more or less, and, while vital to all titles, aren't really recognized outside the industry.

I vote to keep it off. All these people can go on the big list if notable. — Frecklefσσt | Talk 13:41, 6 January 2009 (UTC)

Merger proposal

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section. A summary of the conclusions reached follows.

The Video game director page AfD Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Video game director was closed as "convert to DAB page", making this merger void. —  HELLKNOWZ  ▎TALK 08:52, 22 March 2011 (UTC)

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Per Game_development#Producer "The producer may also be referred to as project manager, project lead, or director.[47][50]" - reliable sources that say director=producer. I don't see other refs in any of these two articles. —  Hellknowz  ▎talk  13:47, 6 May 2010 (UTC)

Well...kinda. The latest Game Developer magazine salary survey doesn't call "Director" out as a separate job title or speciality - but it doesn't lump them in with "producers" either. Instead, they separate out "Technical Director" as a higher level of programmer, "Art Director" as a higher grade of artist/animator, "Creative Director" as a higher level of designer and "Sound/Audio Director" as a higher grade of audio developer. That fits with my experience in the game business. Directors are more senior specialists - not a separate speciality as producers are.

Directors aren't producers...their job functions are quite distinct.

On that basis, I think I'd be inclined to advocate for keeping this article "As Is" and simply deleting the Video game director article - adding back any important content into the programmer, artist & designer articles to explain those higher level job titles.

SteveBaker (talk) 04:00, 28 June 2010 (UTC)

I based this on my sources, nothing else. I can clearly reference title "producer" and it's varieties, but whenever "director" title is used, it is used as either 1) synonym for "producer" or 2) a variation of senior title ("technical director", "art director", etc.). In the second meaning, these are two distinct titles, but there is not enough material for me to work with these, and I suspect there is not enough published material at all. I may be wrong, but I don't want to OR. —  HELLKNOWZ  ▎TALK 12:07, 28 June 2010 (UTC)

In my opinion, this job is something akin to Executive Producer, but with a different path to get there. It would be given to designers who create something really epic - in the case of Will Wright, for instance, the Sim-world. The director role is given as a way to allow him creative control over what goes on in the world he created, so that his vision can stay intact - however he doesn't have to do the project management part of production for each title... I would merge there and mention it is essentially the pinnacle of titles for game designers. -Addionne (talk) 18:42, 25 October 2010 (UTC)

This is not a matter of opinion, but whether any claims are supported by sources. I can cite references for "art director" or "technical director", but not just "director" as a separate role. Video game director is basically OR and/or personal experience. It is not currently supported by a single reference. —  HELLKNOWZ  ▎TALK 20:03, 25 October 2010 (UTC)

Fair enough. I do think it is verifiable in as much as credits exist for this position for a heap of games - and should therefore be mentioned somewhere in these game-industry job articles, but it's not notable on its own as a job title, so it shouldn't have its own article. Addionne (talk) 20:08, 25 October 2010 (UTC)

I agree with deleting the video game director article. I never encountered such a person in my 15 years in the video game industry and the entire article looks like OR. — Frεcklεfσσt | Talk 21:18, 25 October 2010 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Recruitment section

I moved the section called "Recruitment" here for several reasons. Here it is:

Although qualifications are often necessary it is possible to become a video game producer through internal promotion. Often an entry into the industry comes through being a game tester, however only the top percentile will progress to other roles. One notable example is Justyn McLean at SEGA Europe who came from game testing and made the move to PD becoming "a major player in the SEGA empire".<ref name="game_boy">{{cite journal | quotes = | last = | first = | year = 2006 | month = December | title = Game Boy | journal = [[Daily Mirror]] | volume = | issue = | pages = | publisher = [[Trinity Mirror PLC]] }} </ref>

First off, the only source cited is a tabloid, the Daily Mirror, hardly a reliable resource. Second, it mentions Justyn McLean as a "major player" at SEGA Europe, but the last credit I can find for him is an Associate Producer, hardly a "major player". Thirdly, what is said here can be said about any position in the video game industry. In fact, I graduated from testing to programming. The only problem is finding a verifiable and reliable resource that says as much. If and when it is located, this information should go in the main video game industry article and not singled out for the producer article. — Frεcklεfσσt | Talk 16:29, 20 July 2010 (UTC)

Thanks for the reply, howevr I do disagree. The resource is a tabloid, that is true, a national daily newspaper that ran a profile of a video game producer. Why do you doubt it as a source? Do you think it is lying? I suggest wikipedia quotes newspapers as a source all the time. I think the second objection is an objection to the style of writing in the cited article, it describes him as a "major player" with the pun on "player" of games. It calls him a 'Game Boy' too, but I don't think it is seriously suggesting he was made by Nintendo... Finally, your third point I think is not true, the path from tester to producer is far more common due to the transferable skills than that of tester to marketing, or finance, or artist, or PR etc. I'd say there is a a verifiable and reliable resource quoted here, a national newspaper that states that he has moved from testing to producing and an article that describes that move. You say yourself you have seen proof of him as a producer, so why the need for more verification? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Bcooper77 (talk • contribs) 15:37, 21 July 2010 (UTC)

I had some mention of becoming programmer/designer through starting as tester, but it did not mention producer or in fact other "less-technical" positions. Though all my books are in UK and I won't be there for a while. There is a mention in Game_testing#Employment. I suppose that can (should) be added to VGI article. —  HELLKNOWZ  ▎TALK 09:10, 21 July 2010 (UTC)

Robin Hunicke

Do people feel that Robin Hunicke is sufficiently notable in the video game industry to have her own article? I suggested the idea of merging her article into Thatgamecompany (her current employer), but others don't seem to agree with this proposal. Please understand that I'm not trying to lobby for getting rid of Hunicke's page, and if the consensus is that her bio should stay as its own article, I'm fine with that. Richwales (talk · contribs) 17:54, 31 May 2011 (UTC)

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