Talk:Zimbabwean dollar (2019–2024)/Archive 1

Archive 1

Suggestion: Can we get a picture of the banknotes?

Can we get pictures of both sides of all RTGS banknotes available (including denominations)? That would be some important information to have. 2001:48F8:3022:D9E:CDB5:5A3:1749:DAC0 (talk) 22:07, 10 July 2019 (UTC)

Also, sorry if I did this wrong, I just wanted to make this suggestion and don't know how you get all that fancy stuff, I thought it came automatically {:} 2001:48F8:3022:D9E:CDB5:5A3:1749:DAC0 (talk) 22:07, 10 July 2019 (UTC)

Promote, or prevent

Currently, the article says: "However, the core purpose of the RTGS dollar was to (...) promote locals from pricing of goods in foreign currency only". Is that so? Or should there be "prevent" instead of "promote", which would make sense, but would completely revert the meaning? --Joker Island (talk) 22:38, 3 December 2019 (UTC)

Article rename consultation

I think that we should explore the possibility of renaming this article to "Zimbabwe dollar", while moving the current "Zimbabwe dollar" article to "Zimbabwe dollar (1980–2009)". I say this because the term "Zimbabwe dollar" appears to be a more common name than "RTGS dollar" (sources below). I thought I would get some opinions first before formally proposing the moves.

Sources:

• Al Jazeera (2022)
• BBC News (2022)
• Reserve Bank of Zimbabwe (2020 – long URL, sorry)

--Minoa (talk) 02:54, 20 October 2022 (UTC)

Research: Good catch. So, all three sources, including the official third one, name "Zimbabwe dollar" exclusively (plus a "bond", which can be ignored here). The name "RTGS" is not even sourced in the article, so should not be its title (especially since we have another, well-sourced name).

Looking at ISO 4217: It formally lists one active Zimbabwian currency: "Zimbabwe dollar". Formal ISO code is ZWL. Overview of all ISO 42157 Zimbabwe currencies:

Zimbabwe currencies in ISO 4217 (List One=active, List Three=obsolete)
source	ISO code	currency name in ISO[note1]	entity	start	withdrawal date	current wiki article	proposed wiki article (not R)	Wikidata
A	ZWL	"Zimbabwe Dollar"	ZIMBABWE	2009(?)	active[note5]	Real Time Gross Settlement dollar	Zimbabwe dollar	Zimbabwean dollar (Q65067684)
B	ZWR	"Zimbabwe Dollar"	ZIMBABWE	1980	2009-06	Zimbabwean dollar[note2]	Zimbabwe dollar (1980-2009)	Zimbabwean dollar (Q182803)
C	ZWD	"Zimbabwe Dollar"	ZIMBABWE		2008-08
D	ZWN	"Zimbabwe Dollar (new)"	ZIMBABWE		2006-09
E	ZWD	"Zimbabwe Dollar (old)"	ZIMBABWE		2006-08
F	ZWC, RDN[note6]	"Rhodesian Dollar"	ZIMBABWE	1970	1989-12	Rhodesian dollar(?)		Rhodesian dollar (Q392858)
G	—	"Rhodesian pound" [pre-ISO]	ZIMBABWE	1964	1970	Rhodesian pound		Rhodesian pound (Q2616582)

note1: wiki uses lowercase currency unit names: "dollar", "euro".

note2: currently page Zimbabwe dollar redirects to Zimbabwean dollar (ouch, to be resolved with this proposed change).

note3: "ZWL" is the formal ISO code for the one active currency (so the 'informal' note removed from the Infobox).

note4: Nicknames (like RTGS) should be source, and possibly be timed (is "Settlement" dollar still applicable & used, or historical?).

note5: Obviously, ISO4217 does not diferentiate after 2009: one currency since.

note6: ZWC, RDN needs more clarification, but is irrelevant for the proposal.

References

Now, ISO 4217 is not to dictate to countries how currencies are named (only for ISO themselves), but in this case: ISO 4217 aligns with proposed currency names (both active and historical), proposed article names, and allows a straight good WP:disambiguation term.

Support the move. Sources confirm; ISO 4217 overview confirms current & history; disambiguation easy and obvious. Other minor issues can be resolved in the process. -DePiep (talk) 05:01, 20 October 2022 (UTC)

I would like to point out that there are effectively two currencies that use ZWL, because the first one was demonetised on 30 September 2015 (source).

A similar example is the disastrous 100:1 redenomination of the North Korean won in 2009, which kept the KPW code, but in Zimbabwe's case, there is a significant gap between the two ZWL dollars to consider them distinct. I hope that will be considered in the subsequent rewrite, after the reshuffling. --Minoa (talk) 07:10, 20 October 2022 (UTC)

ISO 4217 assigns the ISO-codes, and noone else. Now there has only one "ZWL" been iussued ever (since 1978=start ISO4217). That included currencies declared obsolete by ISO 4217: no earlier or concurrent ZWL. For ZWL, there is no historical record, only the current (active) Zimbabwe dollar.

Incidentally, I am preparing the ISO 4217 codes for use at enwiki/wikidata. (see {{ISO 4217/overview}} and {{Infobox currency/overview}}). For this, I rely on the one and only source: the publications by ISO 41217, cited at {{ISO 4217/cite}}. That proves that there was ever just one "ZWL" code.

Now countries/entities may juggle with currencies all along, like inflate & demonetise certain denominations & hyperinflate & change name. But as long as the ISO says "it is the same currency", for them it is.

Up to us to make more order in the history of this coin indeed. The four historical Zimbabwe dollar's (historical per ISO4217) can user a clarification, for example because they were distinguished by ISO into codes & eras ZWR, ZWD, ZWN, ZWD. Also, the Rhodesian dollar/pound could use clarification. However, that has no effect on the articles renaming proposal: that is about current dollar (ZWL), versus all earlier ones. DePiep (talk) 08:21, 20 October 2022 (UTC)

Fair enough, my only issue was with the "ZWL" claim. By itself, the story of the Z$ fits and belongs into this article (about Zimbabwes current currency). DePiep (talk) 14:39, 20 October 2022 (UTC)

Understood. I am waiting until 27 October for further comments to this consultation, before making a formal proposal. Best, Minoa (talk) 11:19, 21 October 2022 (UTC)

Requested move 30 October 2022

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

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result:
Procedural close. This request conflicts with another request at Talk:Zimbabwean dollar, so it will be merged into the other request. P.I. Ellsworth , ed. ^put'r there 18:47, 30 October 2022 (UTC)

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Real Time Gross Settlement dollar → Zimbabwean dollar – According to a discussion at Talk:Real Time Gross Settlement dollar#Article rename consultation, there is evidence to suggest that this currency is commonly known as the Zimbabwean dollar. Minoa (talk) 18:18, 30 October 2022 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.