User:Pfly/Historic Rapids of the Columbia River

Ok, making the real page now: List of rapids of the Columbia River.

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This is a List of rapids of the Columbia River, listed in upriver order. Almost all of these rapids are now submerged in the reservoirs of dams. The list is not exhaustive; there were numerous minor rapids and riffles, many of which were never named.

Lower Columbia from mouth to Snake River

• Cascade Rapids (The Cascades, Grand Rapids, Cascade Falls, Cascades of the Columbia): Located at river mile 146.5 near today's Bonneville Dam in the Columbia River Gorge; at 45°38′34″N 121°56′4″W. The river fell about 40 feet (12 m) over approximately 2 miles (3.2 km), through a channel about 150 yards (140 m) wide. Submerged in 1937 under Lake Bonneville, the reservoir of Bonneville Dam. See also Bridge of the Gods, Cascade Locks and Canal, Greenleaf Peak, and Table Mountain.

• Celilo Falls and The Dalles (many variant names including: The Chutes, Columbia Falls, Great Falls of the Columbia, Five Mile Rapids, Long Narrows, Les Grand Dalles de la Columbia, The Dalles of the Columbia): A series of rapids located between river mile 188 and 200 near today's The Dalles, Oregon in the Columbia River Gorge. The entire set of rapids was known by various names such as The Dalles and The Narrows. The river fell about 81 feet (25 m) over approximately 12 miles (19 km), through a channel that narrowed to 75 feet (23 m) wide in one section. Rapids and falls within the series included (in order downriver): Celilo Falls, 45°38′59″N 120°58′44″W; Tenmile Rapids, 45°39′1″N 121°2′19″W; Fivemile Rapids, 45°37′49″N 121°6′29″W; The Dalles Rapids (not to be confused with the whole series of rapids), 45°37′44″N 121°6′49″W; and Threemile Rapids, 45°36′29″N 121°8′44″W. Except for Threemile Rapids, the entire series of rapids was submerged in 1957 under Lake Celilo, the reservoir of The Dalles Dam. Threemile Rapids is just below the dam, at the upper end of Lake Bonneville, the reservoir of Bonneville Dam. See also Celilo Canal, Celilo Village, Oregon, and Wishram village.

• Preachers Eddy: Located at river mile 214, 45°42′14″N 120°43′24″W, near Rufus, Oregon.

• Schofield Rapids: Located at river mile 215, just below today's John Day Dam; at 45°42′39″N 120°42′4″W. It was small and not a significant hazard. It was submerged in 1957 by the uppermost waters of Lake Celilo, the reservoir of The Dalles Dam.

• John Day Rapids: Located between river mile 216 and 218, near the mouth of the John Day River and consisting of two main rapids: the Lower John Day Rapids, at 45°42′59″N 120°41′9″W, and the Upper John Day Rapids, at 45°44′9″N 120°39′24″W. The rapids were submerged in 1971 under Lake Umatilla, the reservoir of John Day Dam.

• Indian Rapids: Located at river mile 220, just above the mouth of the John Day River, at 45°44′34″N 120°37′4″W. It was small and not a significant hazard. The rapids were submerged in 1971 under Lake Umatilla, the reservoir of John Day Dam.

• Squally Hook Rapids: Located at river mile 223, a few miles above the mouth of the John Day River, at 45°43′54″N 120°33′19″W.. It was not a major hazard although one commentator described it as "short sharp and savage". It was submerged in 1971 under Lake Umatilla, the reservoir of John Day Dam.

• Rock Creek Rapids: Located near the mouth of Rock Creek, approximately river mile 227 to 228. Described as "rough and rowdy" but not particularly hazardous.

• Blalock Rapids: A very minor rapid, probably located near the railway siding of Blalock at the mouth of Blalock Canyon, approximate river mile 233. It was submerged in 1971 under Lake Umatilla, the reservoir of John Day Dam.

• Owyhee Rapids: A very minor rapid located at river mile 240, 45°43′24″N 120°13′59″W, near Arlington, Oregon. It was submerged in 1971 under Lake Umatilla, the reservoir of John Day Dam.

• Canoe Encampement Rapids: A minor rapid located at river mile 265.5, 45°50′47″N 119°46′34″W, about 3 miles (4.8 km) below Boardman, Oregon. It was submerged in 1971 under Lake Umatilla, the reservoir of John Day Dam.

• Umatilla Rapids: Located at what is now McNary Dam, river mile 292, 45°56′17″N 119°18′9″W. There were at least three "riffles", with the third one downstream being the main one. The total length was somewhat over 1.5 miles (2.4 km). A moderately hazardous rapids, rocks were blasted in 1991 to created a passage for steamboats during low water. The rapids were submerged in 1954 under Lake Wallula, the reservoir of McNary Dam. Parts of the dam were built on top of the lower portion of the rapids.

• Homley Rapids: A very minor rapid located about 7 miles (11 km) below Pasco, Washington.

• Bull Run Rapids: A very minor rapid located a few miles below Wallula Gap.

Upper Columbia from Snake River to Canada

The 70 mile stretch between Priest Rapids and the mouth of the Snake River (the Hanford Reach) "has the slowest current of any part of the Columbia above The Dalles".

• Coyote Rapids: A minor rapid located at river mile 382, 46°38′57″N 119°37′8″W, next to the "100 Area" of the Hanford Site, which is home to Hanford's B Reactor (now a National Historic Landmark) and N-Reactor, and others including the C, D, DR, KE, and KW reactors. As part of the Hanford Reach of the Columbia, Coyote Rapids still exist.

• Priest Rapids: A series of seven rapids located approximately between river mile 406 and 397 (an 1893 report says river miles 409.5 to 421), near Mattawa, Desert Aire, and the Yakima Training Center. The USGS provides a single coordinate point, 46°45′17″N 119°58′20″W. The river dropped 72 feet (22 m) over the entire 9 miles (14 km) length, with a drop of 20 feet (6.1 m) occurring in one short section. In 1888 two steamboats were built at Pasco specifically for the purpose of making it through Priest Rapids and Rock Island Rapids to Wenatchee. The first of the two failed. The second, smaller one, City of Ellensburg, under Captain William Polk Gray, succeeded in passing through Priest Rapids and the more difficult Rock Island Rapids. Later, the sister boat, Thomas L. Nixon, also succeeded in ascending both rapids and reaching Wenatchee. In 1959 the rapids were submerged under Priest Rapids Lake, the reservoir of Priest Rapids Dam.

* Island Rapids: Located several miles above Priest Rapids at river mile 437. No GNIS entry. Submerged by Wanapum Dam, I think. Probably about river mile 419, going by USGS GNIS topo maps and the map at p. 196 (of PDF) of Report of an examination of the upper Columbia river and the territory in its vicinity in September and October, 1881, to determine its navigability, and adaptability to steamboat transportation, United States Army Corps of Engineers, 1882.

* Gualquil Rapids: Located several miles above Island Rapids, river mile 447. No GNIS entry. Submerged by Wanapum Dam, I believe.

• Cabinet Rapids: Located at river mile 448, at the mouth of Moses Coulee, 47°16′17″N 120°5′29″W. In 1963 the rapids were submerged under Lake Wanapum, the reservoir of Wanapum Dam.

• Rock Island Rapids: Located at approximately river mile 454, near Rock Island Dam and Rock Island, and a few miles upriver from Cabinet Rapids; 47°20′39″N 120°5′52″W. In 1933 they were submerged in Rock Island Pool, the reservoir of Rock Island Dam. At least two steamboats were wrecked at the rapids. The Selkirk wrecked at Rock Island Rapids on May 15, 1906 (see Shipwrecks of the inland Columbia River). In 1887 a steamboat tried and failed to ascend the Rock Island Rapids. In 1888 two steamboats were built at Pasco specifically for the purpose of making it through Priest Rapids and Rock Island Rapids to Wenatchee. The first of the two failed. The second, smaller one, City of Ellensburg, under Captain William Polk Gray, succeeded in passing through Priest Rapids and the more difficult Rock Island Rapids. Later, the sister boat, Thomas L. Nixon, also succeeded in ascending both rapids and reaching Wenatchee.

* Wenatchee Ripple: At the mouth of the Wenatchee River the US ACE maps show a minor feature labeled the Wenatchee Ripple. There is no GNIS entry, but it was located at present-day Wenatchee, Washington. Submerged by Rock Island Dam.

• For a number of miles northward there are only minor "ripples", bars, and unnamed rapids. Submerged by Rocky Reach Dam.
• Downing's Rapids: Located just south the mouth of the Chelan River and flanked by a few series of "ripples". Submerged by Rocky Reach Dam, I think. Not in GNIS.

• Methow Rapids: Located at river mile 523, at the mouth of the Methow River near Pateros; 48°2′37″N 119°53′30″W. In 1967 the rapids were submerged in Lake Pateros, the reservoir of Wells Dam.

• Reef Rapids: Located at river mile 544, between Bridgeport and Chief Joseph Dam; 48°0′10″N 119°39′27″W. It was submerged in 1967 by Lake Pateros, the reservoir of Wells Dam.

• Foster Creek Rapids: Located at river mile 547-546, just above Chief Joseph Dam and Bridgeport. About a mile long, the rapids are submerged in Rufus Woods Lake, the reservoir of Chief Joseph Dam. A 1893 report by the United States War Department described Foster Creek Rapids as "among the worst rapids on the river", and being about 3 miles (4.8 km) long, including Reef Rapids. Over this length the river fell 21 feet (6.4 m) during low water and 24 feet (7.3 m) at high water.

• Eagle Rapids (also called Whirlpool Rapids and Kalichen Falls): Located at river mile 555, just below Box Canyon; 48°4′49″N 119°29′26″W. Submerged in Rufus Woods Lake, the reservoir of Chief Joseph Dam.
• Long Rapids: Located at river mile 557, just above Box Canyon; 48°4′43″N 119°26′40″W. Submerged in Rufus Woods Lake, the reservoir of Chief Joseph Dam.
• White Cap Rapids: Located at river mile 558.5, between Gaviota Bend and Box Canyon; 48°3′50″N 119°25′29″W. Submerged in Rufus Woods Lake, the reservoir of Chief Joseph Dam. Lewis Freeman described White Cap Rapids as a narrow, straight, and steep channel "heavily littered with boulders and fanged with outcropping bedrock", with a "mad tumble of wallowing waters", somewhat similar to Gordon Rapids in the Big Bend region, but rougher.
• Parson Rapids: Located at river mile 566, at Tombstone Rocks, a few miles below Goose Flats; 48°5′54″N 119°19′33″W. Submerged in Rufus Woods Lake, the reservoir of Chief Joseph Dam.
• Granite Rapids: Located at river mile 570, south of Saddle Horse Flat; 48°6′11″N 119°15′43″W. Submerged in Rufus Woods Lake, the reservoir of Chief Joseph Dam.
• Mah-kin Rapids (also Mahkin): Located at river mile 572.5, at the head of Nespelem Canyon;48°6′59″N 119°13′1″W. Submerged in Rufus Woods Lake, the reservoir of Chief Joseph Dam.

• Nespelem Rapids: Located at river mile 582.5, just above the mouth of the Nespelem River; 48°7′15″N 119°2′12″W. Submerged in Rufus Woods Lake, the reservoir of Chief Joseph Dam.
• Equilibrium Rapids (Jumbo Rapids): Located at river mile 584.5, at Bailey Basin; 48°5′37″N 119°1′22″W. Submerged in Rufus Woods Lake, the reservoir of Chief Joseph Dam. The name "equilibrium" was given by Symons because there was a rock in the rapids that rolled back and forth in the current.
• Monaghan Rapids (Moneghan's Rapids, Buckley's Rapids): Located at river mile 587, just below an island called Buckley Bar.; 48°4′0″N 119°0′55″W. Submerged in Rufus Woods Lake, the reservoir of Chief Joseph Dam.
• Hell Gate: A gorge and rapids located at river mile 619, at the mouth of Hell Gate Canyon, 23 miles (37 km) upriver of Grand Coulee Dam; 47°56′13″N 118°36′14″W. Submerged in 1942 under Franklin D. Roosevelt Lake, the reservoir of Grand Coulee Dam.
• Spokane Rapids: Located at the mouth of the Spokane River, at Columbia river mile 640. Submerged in 1942 under Franklin D. Roosevelt Lake, the reservoir of Grand Coulee Dam.
• Turtle Rapids: A minor rapid located approximately at river mile 670, near Bissell, above Stray Dog Canyon. The name comes from a number of rock outcroppings that resembled turtle backs.
• Rickey Rapids (also called Grand Rapids): At river mile 697, south of Kettle Falls; 48°32′37″N 118°8′34″W. Submerged in Franklin D. Roosevelt Lake, the reservoir of Grand Coulee Dam.
• Kettle Falls: Located at river mile 704.5, about two miles below the mouth of the Kettle River and five miles above the mouth of the Colville River, near the city of Kettle Falls; 48°38′22″N 118°6′34″W. Submerged in Franklin D. Roosevelt Lake, the reservoir of Grand Coulee Dam.

*Marcus Rapid: (minor) 35 miles below Canadian border; short... (War Dept report, Sheet No. 2)

• Pingstone Rapids: (minor) commence 30 miles below Canadian border, 2 miles in length; "16 rocks to be removed"; "through these rapids the current runs at a rate of 8 miles per hour when the river is at nearly low water." (War Dept report, Sheet No. 2)
• Josephs Rapids: (minor) 25 miles below Canadian border; "9 rocks and 1 jutting reef to be removed"; "three miles below there is a cluster of 14 rocks, the removal of which would be desirable" (War Dept report, Sheet No. 2)

• Little Dalles: Located at river mile 729, six miles downriver of Northport; 48°52′18″N 117°52′9″W. The river narrowed to 130 feet (40 m) at the head of the Little Dalles, then widened somewhat over a length of at least 2,000 feet (610 m). Boat navigation through the Little Dalles was not difficult at low water, but during the high water season the drop increased to 20 feet (6.1 m), making it hazardous. In 1942 the rapids were submerged in Franklin D. Roosevelt Lake, the reservoir of Grand Coulee Dam.

*Steamboat Rapids: Seven miles from Canadian border. No actual rapids but awkward for boats (War Dept report)

• Two Mile Rapids: First obstruction below Canadian border. (War Dept report)

British Columbia

US border to Arrow Lakes

* "rapids at the Rock Islands, two miles below town [Trail]." ... two enormous granite rocks through which the river rushed with great velocity... near mouth of Salmon River? (Down the Columbia, p. 204)

• • You mean the Salmo River, "Salmon River" is the old name

• China Rapids: Located a few miles below Kootenay Rapids.

• Waterloo Eddy: An eddy located at the mouth of Cai Creek, about 4 kilometres (2.5 mi) south of the Castlegar Airport, near Waterloo Road; 49°16′00″N 117°39′00″W.

• Kootenay Rapids (formerly called Tincup Rapids or Tin Cups): A minor rapid located 0.5 miles (0.80 km) below Tincup Rapids, near Castlegar, just below the mouth of the Kootenay River. About 0.25 miles (0.40 km) long, the rapids are mild.

• Tincup Rapids (formerly called Kootenay Rapids): A pair of rapids, called Upper and Lower, or Big and Little Tincup Rapids, located at Castlegar, just above the mouth of the Kootenay River; 49°19′N 117°39′W. The river narrowed to 201 metres (659 ft) at the foot of the lower rapid. For steamboats, the rapids were a navigation hazard during low water in autumn and winter. In the 1890s efforts were made to improve the channel by blasting rocks in the river. The rapids were noted as a "strong rapid" by David Thompson in his journal entry of September 6, 1811. During the 19th century Tincup Rapids was called Kootenay Rapids, and what is today called Kootenay Rapids was called Tincup Rapids. Sometime before 1916 the nomenclature was reversed.

::"Big and Little Tin Cup Rapids, which are due to the obstruction caused by boulders washed down by the torrential Kootenay River, gave us little trouble"...just below is "the Doukobour villages" (Down the Columbia, p. 200)

Hard to say which Doukhobour villages are meant; Raspberry is right at the confluence, just above it, Oootischenia, , New Settlement and others are downstream from it. Brilliant, the most famous one, with its famous Doukhobor-built suspension bridge and dam suggestive of an older rapid) are on the Kootenay. See "Skattebo Reach". BC Geographical Names.Skookum1 (talk) 14:10, 10 October 2009 (UTC)

* "Narrows, The". BC Geographical Names. The Narrows (Arrow Lakes) 50°04′00″N 117°54′00″W

Lake Revelstoke and head of Arrow Lakes to Mica Dam

• Big Eddy: A whirlpool located at the sharp river bend just above downtown Revelstoke. 51°0′12″N 118°14′11″W The locality of Revelstoke was first known as "The Eddy" because of a large swirl in the river which had eroded the right bank of the Columbia here.

• Steamboat Rapids: Located just north of downtown Revelstoke, about 4 kilometres (2.5 mi) below Revelstoke Dam; 51°1′15″N 118°13′2″W.

• Little Dalles Canyon: Located just north of Revelstoke; 51°3′N 118°11′W. Revelstoke Dam and the southern end of its reservoir Lake Revelstoke are in the canyon. The name "dalles" implies a rapids.

* Sand Slide Rapid: "fast-rolling serpentine cascade near the head of Revelstoke Canyon".(Down the Columbia p. 190) (unclear to me where these might be, not sure where "Revelstoke Canyon" is, perhaps Little Dalles Canyon is part of it, perhaps these rapids are there?)

• Rocky Point Rapids: Above start of Revelstoke Canyon.(Down the Columbia p. 190)

• Eighteen Mile Rapids: Located near the mouth of Park Creek, about 8 kilometres (5.0 mi) downriver of Downie Creek, 51°23′N 118°25′W. The rapids were submerged by Lake Revelstoke.

• Priest Rapids: Located just south (downriver) from Dalles des Morts and about 5 kilometres (3.1 mi) north (upriver) of the mouth of Downie Creek; 51°30′N 118°30′W. The rapids were submerged in Lake Revelstoke in 1984. The name comes from the drowning deaths of two French-Canadian priests at the rapids. Priest Rapids was reputed to be the fastest rapids of the Columbia River, with a current reckoned to be over 20 miles per hour (32 km/h).

• Dalles des Morts (Death Rapids): One of the most hazardous rapids of the Columbia River, located just above Priest Rapids and about 6 kilometres (3.7 mi) north of the mouth of Downie Creek; 51°31′N 118°30′W. The name dates to 1817 when seven voyageurs wrecked at the rapids and tried to walk to Spokane House, over 300 miles (480 km) away. Only one survived. A number of other fatal accidents occurred at the rapids, including the drowning of twelve people in 1838. Today the rapids are submerged in Lake Revelstoke, the reservoir of Revelstoke Dam.

• Rock Slide Rapids: Located about 1 mile (1.6 km) downriver of the foot of Twelve Mile Rapids. Lewis Freeman described Rock Slide Rapids as the narrowest point of the entire Columbia River below Lake Windermere, with a channel width averaging 70 feet (21 m). The river rushed through the narrows and poured into a "cauldron-like eddy", then into another narrow chute to form the Dalles des Morts. Today the rapids are submerged in Lake Revelstoke, the reservoir of Revelstoke Dam.

• Twelve Mile Rapids: Located just upriver of Dalles des Morts, 51°31′N 118°31′W. The rapids were submerged by Lake Revelstoke.

• Gordon Rapids: Located at the mouth of Ruddock Creek (formerly Gordon Creek), about 2 kilometres (1.2 mi) south of Horne Creek; approximately 10 kilometres (6.2 mi) above the mouth of Goldstream River, 30 kilometres (19 mi) upriver from Dalles des Morts, and 40 kilometres (25 mi) below Mica Dam; 51°45′N 118°40′W. The rapids were submerged by Lake Revelstoke.

Mica Dam to Golden

* Twenty-One-Mile Rapids: Series of rapids btw. outlet of Kinbasket Lake (pre-dam) and the mouth of the Canoe River. Kinbasket Lake was the broadening and backing up of the river behind the "obstructions which cause the long series of rapids". The distance from Kinbasket Lake to the mouth of the Canoe River is (was) 21 miles (34 km), with a total river fall of 260 feet (79 m), "more than 16 feet per mile"; the narrows (or rapids themselves?) are btw 6-7 miles long depending on river stage and from 1-2 miles wide; high cliffs and bouldery shores throughout the 21 mile stretch making camping impossible and lining tricky; the whole stretch must be run in a single day.

I think these might be the series of rapids below... Redrock, Yellow Creek, Weasel, Mink, etc.. have to figure out where Kinbasket Lake ended before the dam.

• Redrock Canyon Rapids: Located near Redrock Harbour near the northernmost Big Bend of the Columbia River, southeast of Wood River, about 5 kilometres (3.1 mi) downriver from Yellow Creek, and approximately 10 kilometres (6.2 mi) upriver from Mica Dam; 52°6′N 118°23′W. Submerged in Kinbasket Lake.

• Yellow Creek Rapids: Located near Yellow Bay, the mouth of Yellow Creek, Wood River, approximately 15 kilometres (9.3 mi) upriver from Mica Dam; 52°4′N 118°20′W. Submerged in Kinbasket Lake.

• Weasel Rapids: Located just south of the mouth of Yellow Creek, approximately 20 kilometres (12 mi) upriver from Mica Dam; 52°4′N 118°19′W. Submerged in Kinbasket Lake.

• Mink Rapids: Located near the mouth of Three Minute Creek, about 3 kilometres (1.9 mi) below (northwest of) the Cummins River and approximately 25 kilometres (16 mi) upriver from Mica Dam; 52°3′N 118°17′W. Submerged in Kinbasket Lake.

• Boulder Rapids: Located about 3 kilometres (1.9 mi) above the Cummins River and approximately 25 kilometres (16 mi) upriver from Mica Dam; 52°0′30″N 118°10′0″W. Submerged in Kinbasket Lake.

• Surprise Rapids: Located just northwest of the Bush River, at the north end of a large island in a wide portion of Kinbasket Lake and just south of a narrow channel called The Elbow; approximately 15 kilometres (9.3 mi) northeast of Mount Sir Sandford and 70 kilometres (43 mi) upriver from Mica Dam; 51°46′N 117°41′W. The river fell about 100 feet (30 m) over approximately 3.75 miles (6.04 km). Within that length there were at least three cascades. The first cascade was the largest, with a drop of 21 feet (6.4 m) over 750 feet (230 m). At the second cascade the river dropped 15 feet (4.6 m) over 1,200 feet (370 m). At the third the drop was 25 feet (7.6 m) over 2,500 feet (760 m). In 1973 the rapids were submerged in Kinbasket Lake, the reservoir of Mica Dam.

• Brinkmans Terror Rapids: Located at the mouth of the Beaver River, approximately 16 kilometres (9.9 mi) downriver from Donald, British Columbia; 51°32′N 117°25′W. Submerged in the Columbia Reach of Kinbasket Lake, the reservoir of Mica Dam.
• Kitchins Rapids: Located at the upper end of Kinbasket Lake, near Redgrave, slightly above the mouth of Wiseman Creek; 51°31′N 117°19′W (or, according to topographic maps, 51°30′34.3″N 117°17′40.7″W). Submerged in the Columbia Reach of Kinbasket Lake, the reservoir of Mica Dam.

Discussion

See here for more resources.Skookum1 (talk) 15:48, 6 October 2009 (UTC)

The river in the area of Golden is really one big rapid, don't know yet if there are any named rapids in that area. I think the Baillie-Grohmann Canal article may have info on stretches of the Columbia and Kootenay where steamboats needed winching, though the main Steamboats of the uppermost Columbia and Kootenay Rivers has yet to be written.Skookum1 (talk) 17:21, 6 October 2009 (UTC)

What I'll do if I get the time is add rapids from the Down the Columbia book and footnote them saying that's where the name is mentioned. Some of the names in that book may be little used, but at least it's something to go on. Looks like the author also describes sections of the river, especially Big Bend vs. Revelstoke area. So I added subsections, although they may need to be changed/renamed/etc. Pfly (talk) 17:31, 6 October 2009 (UTC)

Also, from reading Down the Columbia I get the sense that the "one big rapid" near Golden might be Surprise Rapids, perhaps. Pfly (talk) 23:08, 6 October 2009 (UTC)

Maybe, I don't know; the stretch I'm thinking about was adjacent to a campground by the river right in town.Skookum1 (talk) 14:44, 10 October 2009 (UTC)

YOu should check in with User:Mtsmallwood and let him know about this page; he's a steamboat expert and may have notes/sources on other stretches of the river where steamboats faced obstacles/current etc.Skookum1 (talk) 14:44, 10 October 2009 (UTC)

• Note: Marcus and Northport were the southern end of the Arrow Lakes steamboat route because they were at the upper end of needed portages around obstacles in the river; specifically Kettle Falls itself but also the Little Dalles etc. (actually I think the Little Dalles is in between them and it was an advance in technology that moved the port from one location to the other.Skookum1 (talk) 14:44, 10 October 2009 (UTC)
• Somewhere there's a really excellent local history site for the West Kootenay that may have more, I'll try to find it; I know it had more on Ole Skattebo, so I'll try searching that name.....Skookum1 (talk) 14:44, 10 October 2009 (UTC)
  • The site in question is http://www.trailsintime.org and this is the Skattebo bio which has information on the "cascades of the Kootenay River" etc. (note his cabin was "Skookumchuk cabin", implicitly in connection to a rapids at the location. I haven't looked through the rest of the site for Columbia River-specific info yet, but it's a big site.Skookum1 (talk) 15:03, 10 October 2009 (UTC)
    • Re Tincup Rapids and Kootenay Rapids. Excellent material, no?? Would see to warrant a separate article...Skookum1 (talk) 15:12, 10 October 2009 (UTC)

Hey Skookum, thanks for all the info and leads. Will reply later when I've time. A quick question--do you know how to figure river mile numbers in British Columbia? I've been adding them for US rapids by looking at USGS topo maps, which show river miles for the Columbia. It would be nice to add them for BC rapids, but I can't find a source...? Pfly (talk) 16:13, 10 October 2009 (UTC)

I don't recall ever seeing any such markings on NTS maps or on Basemap, but I suspect there's stuff out there frmo the Water Rights Branch of British Columbia (part of MoE) as there's a data-tree of all creeks/tributaries in teh province and the amount of water available in them and who owns it etc but also how many km from mouth...; I'm not sure if it's publicly-accessible but it might be. Other than that DFO might have some measures e.g. the distance of certain fisheries features like Hell's Gate or the various tributaries which have DFO-monitored spawning channels (Weaver Creek, Wahleach Creek, Seton River to name a few).Skookum1 (talk) 14:36, 11 October 2009 (UTC)

Snake River

The maps also show four rapids on the lower Snake River: Five Mile Rapids, Fish Hook Rapids, Pine Tree Rapids, and Monumental Rapids.

Copyright

I'm unclear on the copyright status for these maps. That they were created in 1882 by a US federal agency implies they are public domain. But Washington State University has an awful lot of copyright warnings on their site. Perhaps they claim copyright to the digitized versions? It would be nice to use these maps for (future) articles about the rapids, but the legally of this is over my head.

Copyright cannot be claimed for material already in the public domain; not even scans of it, i.e. the image itself is inviolate once it's PD. Asserting copyright is one thing, but all copyright means is the right to sue; and they can't sue for something they didn't have the right to assert copyright over. Besides, how do they know the digital image is THEIR copy/version??Anyway this is the logidf that's applied in teh approval (by Wikipedians) for using BC Archives etc photos; VPL and the National Archives dropped their copyright claims a long time ago, I suppose because they were informed that the images were necessarily public domain; the BC Govt, and apparently UW, is trying to hold the line but legally they don't have much of a leg to stand on.Skookum1 (talk) 14:55, 5 October 2009 (UTC)

Army Corps of Engineers materials are definitely public domain - if they scanned the full maps that should include the original publication info in one of the corners. When citing I'd cite the maps directly, not Washington State University. Kmusser (talk) 18:01, 5 October 2009 (UTC)

The University did the digitizing. They have the physical maps in their collections. I know the maps themselves can be cited, but whether the digitized images themslves can be put on Wikipedia, I'm still unsure. I would think Skookum is right, or should be? Not a big deal, not about to do anything with them. Can figure it out later. Also, as SID files they would require some processing to get into a more usable format (I'd have to dust off my old ArcGIS 8 or something!) Pfly (talk) 18:25, 5 October 2009 (UTC)

Oh I see, on "rights" they simply say, "Contact Manuscripts, Archives, and Special Collections, for copyright information 509 335-6691". Pfly (talk) 18:31, 5 October 2009 (UTC)

From your description above I'm not sure you'd want to put the digitized versions on here as they sound hard to read. I'd think making a new map and using the old one as a source for the locations would be easier. Kmusser (talk) 19:04, 5 October 2009 (UTC)

Canadian rapids

The two main ones are the Dalles des Morts (Death Rapids) and The Narrows (between the two Arrow Lakes, which was really just a strong current and some shoals. There's another couple of rapids in the area of the Dalles des Morts which are now inundated - use the radius search off the Dalles des Morts BCGNIS link to find some; one that's not on there but should be is another Priest Rapids, just below, I think, the Dalles des Morts, which was where two fathers were de-boated - Demers and Blanchet I think. I have the whole provincial gazette on file here somewhere, which you could search for "rapids" and "Columbia" but it's a huge file and I haven't had any luck opening it in my Mac spreadsheet (it's a CSV as I recall). Also there's another Little Dalles in the area of the Dalles des Morts; see Dalles.Skookum1 (talk) 14:55, 5 October 2009 (UTC)

I just did that 5km radius search and got only the Twelve Mile Rapids or Twelvemile Rapids; but expanding it to 10km (by adjusting th latitudes in that link) I got Priest Rapids - [ here]. The story of the priests I'm not sure where I saw it; in Howay maybe, or the Akriggs, and/or on a website somewhere....Skookum1 (talk) 15:02, 5 October 2009 (UTC)

Looks like that Freeman book, Down the Columbia, which I just linked below (full PDF available), is chock full of details about the rapids in BC. I have only glanced so far, but it sounds like the Big Bend area had a lot of rapids, some quite nasty. Surprise Rapids is one I think he specifically said was quite challenging. So there's a Priest Rapids in BC too? I assumed the frequent mentions of it were all about the WA one, Priest Rapids. Pfly (talk) 05:21, 6 October 2009 (UTC)

Sources

One Source

Found a source of information about rapids of the Columbia River, at least between Oregon and British Columbia, from the time before the dams were built.

The source (unless otherwise noted) is a series of 27 maps made in 1882 by the United States Army Corps of Engineers as "part of Report of an examination of the Upper Columbia River and the territory in its vicinity in September and October, 1881, to determine its navigability and adaptability to steamboat transportation." The maps are nicely drawn and show not only every "ripple" of the river and quite a few larger named rapids and falls, but also historic sites such as trading posts, Indian villages, "China Camps"s, ferries and river crossings, trails, roads, railroads, geologic features, and an ample number of place names that differ from their present forms (from close calls, like En-ti-at River for Entiat River to more usual forms). The viewing interface is fairly annoying. The image files are in SID format, which few people have the tools to easily view on their home computers. The website's viewing interface limits you to a small window with just a few frustrating controls. But it does work. The site is run by Washington State University and is called Early Washington Maps: A Digital Collection. They have quite a lot of material. I think this link will take you to the search result page showing just the 27 maps in question. If that fails, try going to their main search page and search for "Map of the Upper Columbia River" in just the "Early Washington maps" digital collection. The maps are all titled "Map of the Upper Columbia River, from the international boundary line to Snake River, on a scale of one inch to two miles. (1882) Sheet XX. [Name]", where XX is the map number and "Name" is the map name. You have to load and view each map separately, which can take a painful amount of time, especially as you have to launch their SID viewer and zoom in to read much of the text.

Finding some sources with a lot of information about Columbia River rapids, some US only, some including BC, mostly older "official" accounts (e.g., Army Corps of Engineers) and personal accounts of traveling down the river (e.g., Down the Columbia by Lewis Freeman--lots of info about rapids in BC!). And being older books, some are available for full preview and PDF download at Google Books, yay.

• Freeman, Lewis Ransome (1921). Down the Columbia. New York: Dodd, Mead and company. ISBN 9781548543198. OCLC 1738301.

This one at least mentions, and sometimes describes in detail the major rapids and a lot of lesser known ones, including: Moneghans Rapids, Buckleys Rapids, Death Rapids (Dalles des Morts?), Eagle Rapids, Kinbasket Rapids (p. 108 good), Surprise Rapids (p. 89 good), Owyhee Rapids, Blalock Rapids, Four O'Clock Rapids, Gordon Rapids, White Cap Rapids, Middle and Lower Rapids of Hell Gate, John Day Rapids (p. 241), Gaulquil Rapids (p. 222), Squally Hook Rapids, Schofield's Rapids, Umatilla Rapids, Kootenay Rapids, French Rapids, Hawk Creek Rapids, Rocky Point Rapids (near Revelsoke?), Sand Slide Rapids, Twenty-One-Mile Rapids (above Canoe River), Rock Slide Rapids (Big Bend BC)...more.

• United States. War Dept (1893). Annual reports of the War Department, Part 4. United States Government Printing Office. ISSN 1050-1274. OCLC 1777262.

Focuses on area between Wallula, Washington and Canadian border.

• Symons, Thomas William (1882). Report of an examination of the upper Columbia River and the territory in its vicinity in September and October, 1881, to determine its navigability, and adaptability to steamboat transportation. United States Army Corps of Engineers. United States Government Printing Office. OCLC 13375670.

• Bulletin, Issues 13-17, Washington Geological Survey, 1916.

References

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Skookum1's comments, will move to talkpage tomorrow maybe?

Has me idly thinking about List of rapids, canyons, rocks and other landforms of the Fraser River. I suppose "bars" should also be on the main list, but that's a whole topic unto itself because BCGNIS is incomplete on teh gold bars, as well as some historic now-vanished landmarks, such as the Indian Doctor or Medicine Point or whatever it was, above Yale, on the east side of the river, which was demolished to make way for the CNR....Lady Franklin Rock you must have heard of and I think there's a Lady Franklin Rapid, but I'm not sure - just that there's a second Lady Franklin something. Lots more, too big a subject for tonight, there are only so many named rapids and water-effects on teh Fraser, at least documented ones (other than any available aboriginal toponymy). I can tell you the Fraser is considered to have two "Falls", the Upper Falls being the ones at the Bridge River Fishing Grounds and the other being Hell's Gate (British Columbia), although there's mention of a "Falls of the Fraser" between Yale and Spuzzum, which is why Yale is the head orf river navigation, (other than the Skuzzy...); the "lower FAlls of the Freaser" aka the Loewr Canyon, from Spuzzum downstream, also forced teh pre-Cariboo Road trail over an expensive and steep portage from Yale to Spuzzum over the side-abutment of the adjoining mountain - the route used by today's powerline, which is the other meaning of the Douglas Portage (I've done that powerline road, can't remember how, maybe by mountain bike? or 4x ?; short but intense and steep . that's an interesting area - Yale up to Boston Bar and Siska-Lytton, a guy like you could spend a week puttering into the locatdions and stories around them, nice climate in teh summer and fall and spring too (harsh, very harsh, in the winter, though sunny more of then than not)...well, other than Yale and Spuzzum, which are as wet as teh coast, or among the wettest....Skookum1 (talk) 04:47, 9 October 2009 (UTC)

I've been thinking about working on the Fraser River page and related things for a while. Maybe someday I'll get around to it. Been reading Fred Beckey's book Range of Glaciers about the history of the North Cascades, and there is quite a bit about the Fraser, the gold rushes and their effect on the larger region--also details about the specific bars of the Fraser were gold fever raged. I don't know a great deal about the Fraser's rapids per se (had not heard of Lady Franklin Rapid). My mom was planning to send you an email about their trip up from Squamish to Lillooet and down the Fraser, but she didn't get around to it, did she? Both my parents told me about their visit to Hell's Gate. It was impressive, I take it. Funny how many Hells Gates there are. At least two on the Columbia as well as the Fraser one, and countless ones elsewhere. There's even a Hells Gate on New York City's East River. Anyway, a guy like me hopes to someday spend a week puttering around up there. But will probably have to wait until after the kids are significantly older, sigh. Pfly (talk) 08:12, 9 October 2009 (UTC)

BTW 2 tips for searching BCGNIS: from their main page, you can use "% Rapids" - percent is the wildcard search term, as is also the cse on Basemap and its siblings/children (which you'll find one of on the Water Rights Branch page if you google that up....maybe it's Water Stewardship Division, but there's probably more than one Basemap-clone in their system anyway); also if you limit teh searc to Kootenay Land District at teh same page, that's pretty much identical with what Canadians mean by "Columbia Basin" (i.e. excluding the Okanagan/Similkameen - with which including the Boundary, "Yale Land District, Osoyoos Division", with Greater Kamloops being Yale Land District, Kamloops Division (there's a third, centred on Yale itself, though it's not called that i.e. Yale Division) Also if you use a generated query result from a given item, it's the same as their "within a bounding box" parameter on their main page; but you can manually adjust it without having to go to their page; just add or subtract minutes/seconds of lat/long as you wish in the URL....handy trickSkookum1 (talk) 00:58, 12 October 2009 (UTC)

Ah cool. I only discovered the ability to search with wildcards the other day, but only using * not %. Sounds like % is wilder than *, so to speak. I tried and failed to search by "feature type". In the GNIS query tool you can select a "feature class" (equivalent to BCGNIS feature type) and leave the name field blank, and get all features of that class (eg, "rapids")--at least up to some search result limit (best to limit by state and maybe county). But I couldn't figure out how, or if you can do that in BCGNIS. I saw there is a feature type called "steamboat landing" and another called "landing". It would be interesting to limit searches to those types, or just get a list of ALL steamboat landings in the database. Couldn't figure it out though. Pfly (talk) 05:50, 12 October 2009 (UTC)

Well, looks like I was wrong about searching by administrative unit and/or feature type....they're pretty limited ("water features" is way too sweeping). But for rapids, just use "% rapids" and all those in the province will come up (that are called "x rapids", not classed as....like Big Eddy) - hint, hint, hint, anytning in the Kootenays/Columbia Basin won't be much more than 119 degrees west; note also the Tidal Rapids that show up; Whirlpool Rapids in Hellbore Channel seems a likely candidate and if I'm not mistaken there's sailing/marine literature on that spot (Hellbore would seem to refer to the whirlpool, rather than to hellebore which I think is an old name for belladonna. I think Basemap's search parameters are a bit more flexible, but it's one of teh shortcomings of BCGNIS that you can't search by phrase within its fields, only by title....which is why, on the entry page, off to the left, it's handy to note "provincial gazette" and go to that page, send them the email they tell you to, and they'll send you the whole provincial gazette, which is basically BCGNIS in CSV format (not sure if that use of "gazette" is familiar to Americans - a "gazetted" term in BC means it's got an official name and official survey point). I tried diddling the URL like I described above last night and it didn't work this time; it broke their Oracel system and I couldn't get at any site...what I'd done is field it a longitude that wasn't in British Columbia, i.e. in Alberta as I was trying to expand the listing eastwards from Skookumchuck Rapids (which, despite the name of such a rapids on the Kootenay River, is the offiically-gazetted name for a rapids on the Shuswap River, just below Mabel Lake; the ones on the Kootenay despite being the namesake of the locality/town aren't official on-the-map (though they exist on older non-official maps). For utlimate searchability I suggest you get the gazette; I never had much luck opening it or using the spreadsheet to manipulate it, maybe you can do better (between MacOS conversion and my limited RAM it just wasn't cooperating last time I tried it...)

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