User talk:Irtapil
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I finally gave in and archived this mess.
Fonts (Basmala)[edit]
"Arial" is a commercial font which is only available on a limited range of systems, so what you did is probably not as helpful as you thought it would be... AnonMoos (talk) 16:18, 7 March 2020 (UTC)
- @AnonMoos: I am aware Arial is a commercial font, but it is more likely to be already installed on a reader's computer than any of the free fonts which contain the applicable characters. Most people won't want to install a new font to read a small detail on a page, free or not, and if they don't have Arial font, won't it just default to something else?
- Which systems don't include Arial? Linux? That's surely a far smaller number of readers than the people who would already have a free font installed that contains characters like dotless ba. Irtapil (talk) 17:29, 7 March 2020 (UTC)
- @AnonMoos: this is what it looked like before i changed the font:
it seems likely not everyone was seeing that, or it would be fixed already, and the people who see the same error seem more likely to also be windows users, or have the same glitchy font that comes ahead of Arial in the queue? Irtapil (talk) 18:25, 7 March 2020 (UTC)
the lang-ar had a less streaky option Arabic: ﷽, but it was illegibly small, in a table you can increase font size, but in line with text that's not a winner.
{{script|Arab|﷽}}
﷽
gives the same error.
Irtapil (talk) 18:36, 7 March 2020 (UTC)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Template:Script/Arabic
"Amiri (appears feathery on Windows; errors with combining shadda with kasra and in Rohingya [1])"
﷽
{{font|font=amiri|﷽}}
that font looks fine in other programs, just goes weird for that character in chrome.
i'm still not sure what you mean by "not as helpful as you thought it would be" ... how helpg=ful did you think i thought it'd be? Irtapil (talk) 19:06, 7 March 2020 (UTC)
@AnonMoos: what would your idealised solution be then? do you actually have a better idea or are you just complaining that my quick fix for a small problem isn't perfect?
As far as i gather the effect of forcing Arial font displays Arial if it is present then if it's not installed it goes back to whatever it would have displayed without that setting? so it possibly helps a lot of viewers, and has no effect for others? The "feathering" mention on the help page sounds like it is likely to be just a windows thing, and Arial comes with windows, so it likely solved it for everyone who has the problem.
The problem seemed likely to be restricted to that particular obscure character, a generalised solution (e.g. editing the template font list) would likely create WAY more problems than it solved.
i could work out the offending font - Amiri - and uninstall it from my own computer, but that solves it for only ONE user, and Amiri displays other characters fine, without streaking into the toolbars.
what proportion of users would actually not have Arial? i do wonder if some people might have Arial without the full character set? but if they don't have the Arabic characters from Arial the chances of them having a specific Arabic font are even lower.
you say Arial only works for some people, but is there any stable and extensive Arabic font they are more likely to have installed? i didn't just pick the most common font in general, i picked the font with the most extensive Arabic charachar set, out of the fonts likely to be installed on an English speakers computer. the SIL fonts would work too, but they are way less common than Arial. do you actually have a better idea? if you want to add a list of all of the fonts other than Amiri to the formatting on that one character, just go do it rather than complaining that i didn't. i even worked out which don't was causing the problem, if you want to add a solution for the tiny proportion of people who don't have serial, just go do it. but they likely weren't even getting the same glitch, so it's a bit pointless.
Irtapil (talk) 01:43, 8 March 2020 (UTC)
old {{script|Arab|﷽}} ﷽
new {{font|font=arial|{{lang|ar|﷽}}}} ﷽
no lang tag {{font|font=arial|﷽}}}} ﷽
no lang tag amiri {{font|font=amiri|﷽}}}} ﷽
Irtapil (talk) 02:20, 8 March 2020 (UTC)
those all display identically on my android, so, the solution does nothing, but there was also no problem to solve. if you want a solution that applies to people who do not have the problem, then that's a fairly eccentric approach...
if you actually do have a better idea i am keen to hear it. i often use arial because pages use have obscure characters, and some fonts will have these but not connect them properly, so they look completely different. i add the appropriate lang tag lang|ar or lang|ur etc. as well and as far as i know, this means that if the user is one of the 1% of internet users who do not have Arial installed or will default back to the fonts associated with that lang tag. so, if you have a better solution please do share. i could add additional fonts, but most of what i would add is already attached to those Lang tags, so that's a bit pointless. Irtapil (talk) 02:33, 8 March 2020 (UTC)
"Also probably many mobile systems, to start with... AnonMoos (talk) 20:30, 7 March 2020 (UTC)" well the solution does nothing, see above, but they also don't have the problem. Irtapil (talk) 02:35, 8 March 2020 (UTC)
[edit]
Hi. Thanks for commenting at the recent AfD for the above list. There is now an ongoing discussion around the best way to split the list, if any, if you wish to comment further. Lugnuts Fire Walk with Me 17:45, 29 November 2020 (UTC)
2021[edit]
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2022[edit]
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2023[edit]
Drafting on article talk pages[edit]
It seems you often draft your comments on article talk pages as hidden text before making them. Could you avoid doing this, as it causes the pages to show up on watchlists?
Instead, I would suggest you use your sandbox or another user space page. BilledMammal (talk) 14:32, 31 December 2023 (UTC)
- @BilledMammal
- Sorry I've been having trouble with my computers today and needed to switch devices a few times.
- I have been drafting in my userspace. I actually thought that was what someone might be annoyed at when I saw I had a talk page message.
- I thought drafting in my userspace might mean people get tagged on user space pages? If copy stuff in context, which is necessary for a long discussion. I copied it unfinished whenever I need to switch devices.
- I thought commenting stuff out might annoy people less.
- Getting tagged in userspace pages is annoying and confusing? Whereaswatch list notifications on an already very active i thought the commenting out thing would annoy people less?
- If there is a way to turn off all tagging in a userspace page up switch to doing that.
- Irtapil (talk) 18:05, 31 December 2023 (UTC)
- @BilledMammal
- Also I have a bad habit I am trying to break, leaving unfinished edits open in lost tabs. I'm trying to break that habit by switching to a "save as I go" approach. Otherwise I end up losing my work, or when I try to save it clashes with other edits that happened while I had it open. But that's more on main pages than talk pages. Irtapil (talk) 18:08, 31 December 2023 (UTC)
- If you don't sign your draft comment while you are working on it nobody will be tagged; alternatively, you can use {{noping|BilledMammal}} to avoid pinging people.
- Trouble with watchlist notifications is that they get people to look at the page, only to discover that there are no real changes to see; if they use the diff they might even get half way through your comment before realizing its still a draft, which is an even bigger waste of time. BilledMammal (talk) 05:13, 1 January 2024 (UTC)
- So a quick search and replace to break any signatures "~~ ~~" would stop anyone getting pinged to my user space? I was doing that already so they didn't timestamp the time I saved the draft. So that's probably the best solution? and it's a lot quicker than commenting out. Irtapil (talk) 12:20, 1 January 2024 (UTC)
- Commenting out drafts made them invisible to my view. Were you reading direct from track changes to find new replies more easily? and missing the < ! - - at the start?
- For very active discussions, it can be tricky to reintegrate drafts from my user space back to the discussion without overwriting comments other people made in between. For those very active discussions, would "DRAFT REPLY I'LL FINISH LATER" at the top (possibly with colourful emojis pointing at it) work? it would be easier to see than the < ! - - combo? Just for very active discussions where reintegrating a draft would be particularly tricky and people are probably getting constant watchlist notifications already?
- Often i get interrupted by tech difficulties or offline events.
- Irtapil (talk) 12:35, 1 January 2024 (UTC)
- @BilledMammal
- Does linking someone's talk page tag them?
- e.g. User talk:BilledMammal
- Irtapil (talk) 16:34, 3 January 2024 (UTC)
2024[edit]
Talk page archival[edit]
I would be happy to set up page archiving for you if you would like. Let me know. Mathglot (talk) 04:47, 23 April 2024 (UTC)
- @Mathglot Maybe, let me think about it. Why the offer now? Irtapil (talk) 08:14, 28 April 2024 (UTC)
- Because it's getting really long. If you want to set it up yourself, a good place to start is Help:Archiving (plain and simple). Good luck, Mathglot (talk) 08:29, 28 April 2024 (UTC)
There is, however, a problem with your page that will block archiving, which is the section marked Fonts (Basmala) = near the top of the page. This has unbalanced equal signs, and because of that, is slurping all the other sections as subsections under it. To fix this, change
= Fonts (Basmala) ==
to:
== Fonts (Basmala) ==
(i.e., add an equal sign at the front). That should fix the problems on this page, and reenable archiving again. Mathglot (talk) 06:36, 30 April 2024 (UTC)
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