User talk:SamMontana

Welcome!

Hi SamMontana! I noticed your contributions and wanted to welcome you to the Wikipedia community. I hope you like it here and decide to stay.

As you get started, you may find this short tutorial helpful:

Learn more about editing

Alternatively, the contributing to Wikipedia page covers the same topics.

If you have any questions, we have a friendly space where experienced editors can help you here:

Get help at the Teahouse

If you are not sure where to help out, you can find a task here:

Volunteer at the Task Center

Please remember to sign your messages on talk pages by typing four tildes (~~~~); this will automatically insert your username and the date.

Happy editing! GorillaWarfare (talk) 02:48, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

Laura Loomer

SamMontana a few things–

• GorillaWarfare is completely correct and has been exceptionally patient in explaining this over and over again to you. Wikipedia isn't like the New York Post where they can pick an image off the internet and slap a "sourced from XYZ" -- that's not how Wikipedia works. Wikipedia policy is that images must be free (that is, released in the public domain or with a different free license).
• Campaign photos are not covered under "fair use" unless they are released as such. I agree with you that "If Ms. Loomer did not want this photo distributed, she would not have had the picture taken"; but if she wanted the photo distributed on Wikipedia, she could have released it under a free licence or even better, into the public domain. She did not.
• Wikipedia always has a preference for a photo of the subject to be in the article. The screenshot from the YouTube video (which was released under a CC licence status -"free licence", and cannot be rescinded) is the only free image we have available. If you find an authentic image that has been released to the public domain, or covered under a different free licence, then perhaps that can be used? otherwise the status-quo image -- the screenshot -- will stay. Please review Commons:Licensing#Acceptable licenses which is pretty helpful in determining what can be uploaded.
• In response to your now filed Wikipedia:Dispute_resolution_noticeboard#Laura_Loomer (which I'm quite confident will close for a complete lack of basis, since GorillaWarfare has only been reciting policy -- you can't really dispute policy), you have not posted on their talk page the required notice ( {{subst:drn-notice}} ). This is a matter of acting in good faith and civilly. In this instance, I have done it for you. In future, please make the courtesy of notifying the editor on their talk page (not the article's talk page).

Thank you, —MelbourneStar☆^talk 04:49, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

@MelbourneStar: Why can't I dispute policy? If the policy is completely illogical, then why should it be impossible to challenge?

You are also assuming she knows about releasing pictures into public domain. Ms. Loomer does not have a lawyer background. She might be assuming that photos released for the press and her campaign will be used freely, as anyone uneducated on copyright law probably would. Why can't there be an exception here?— Preceding unsigned comment added by SamMontana (talk • contribs)

Under the Do you need assistance? heading on the Dispute resolution noticeboard (which should have been read prior to posting) it states that the noticeboard is for content disputes — not policy disputes. So disputes about controversial sections in an article, for example, or the way something is written. Policy is policy, and GorrillaWarfare has done nothing wrong in upholding policy. In reference to you claiming its "illogical" -- please explain how it is illogical that Wikipedia, The Free Encylcopedia, requires free images to be posted and not copyrighted ones?

Ms Loomer doesn't have a law background, neither do I, or the thousands of people who edit Wikipedia. I'm not seeing how that is Wikipedia's fault, though. Copyright is a serious issue, and the onus is on ourselves to be educated on copyright. I see why this may be frustrating. Believe me, I have been there too. The only way around this is by familiarising yourself with copyright, Wikipedia's policies on copyrighted content and images... then you'll be better positioned to find the images you can post.

Also, please remember to sign your comment with ~~~~, otherwise we don't know who has said what. Thank you, —MelbourneStar☆^talk 05:38, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

@MelbourneStar: It is illogical for the "free" Encyclopedia to refuse to use images that other publications use, simply because they have not been explicitly released into public domain. When Ms. Loomer posts pictures on her campaign site, under press releases, I don't think it is unreasonable to infer that anyone can use those pictures. It seems to me this a pointless red tape rule. There is no actual reason for it, because if that was the case, other publications would not be using those photos.

(SamMontana (talk) 05:45, 20 August 2020 (UTC))

Wikipedia takes the issue of copyright very seriously, always has, always will. I can't speak for why or how other publications use these images, that's a matter for them. Ms Loomer or the team she works with can publish images under whatever licences she/they please; unfortunately, she/they have not chosen to release said images under acceptable licences for Wikipedia. You may think that's pointless red tape, but that's policy. —MelbourneStar☆^talk 05:53, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

@MelbourneStar: That was a non-answer if I ever read one. You didn't answer my question. You've made it very clear, overly so some might say, that that is Wikipedia policy. You have not explained why that is Wikipedia policy. No other online source has this policy for using images. (SamMontana (talk) 06:03, 20 August 2020 (UTC))

To answer your question: Wikipedia is a free encyclopedia that hosts free content. Hosting copyrighted content defeats the purpose of a "free" encyclopedia. The great thing about Wikipedia is that you can copy/paste it wherever you want on the internet without fear of it being copyrighted; that's because it is free and hosts free content. You can't do that with copyrighted content. —MelbourneStar☆^talk 06:10, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

Thanks, MelbourneStar, for your additional attempts to explain things here. SamMontana, the fact that Wikipedia is free content is one of the fundamental principles of Wikipedia, and the fact that images must be freely licensed is a policy that has been in place since the beginning. The rule that, excepting extremely unusual circumstances, we can't use fair use non-freely-licensed photos of living people has been in place since at least 2006. You are certainly welcome to try to get those policies changed, but in my opinion it's about as likely to change as our policy that requires us to cite sources. GorillaWarfare (talk) 16:26, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

@GorillaWare: Thanks. I have done just that. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Village_pump_(proposals)#Allow_fair_use_non-freely_licensed_photos_of_politicians (SamMontana (talk) 04:41, 21 August 2020 (UTC))

Looks like I'm too late to weigh in there (your ping didn't work since you misspelled my username). I'm curious, have you considered trying to reach out to Ms. Loomer to ask her to donate a photo? That certainly seems like the most likely way you can achieve your goal of having a better photograph to use in the article. Other than that we just have to wait for her or someone on her campaign team to think to do so themselves, or wait to see if she's elected in which case a professional, public domain photo will presumably be taken.

There is a form at WP:CONSENT that she or her photographer can fill out and email, along with a photo, to permissions-commons@wikimedia.org. Please note that whoever sends the email and signs the form must be the copyright holder of the photo, which in most cases is the photographer and not the subject of the photo (unless the photographer has explicitly signed over the copyright). If you do decide to reach out, and you hear back that she has sent a photo and a release to that address, feel free to ping me to let me know. I have access to the queue and can process the donation. Or if she/her team has questions feel free to direct them my way—my contact info is on my userpage. GorillaWarfare (talk) 19:09, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

Yeah, I was just coming here to suggest exactly that. Except it might be easier to get her staff to release an image on her campaign web site. Send her or them an email, say:

"Hey, the pinko-commie-feminazi-libnuts on Wikipedia have this fuzzy YouTube screenshot on their article about you, but if you put up an image that you own the rights to (a selfie, or one where the photographer explicitly sold or gave you the rights to it) on your web site with the notice that explains how you own those rights, and that you are releasing it under https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/4.0/, then we can use it instead."

By the way, I'm the guy who made the fuzzy screenshot that you don't like in the first place, I do that (and it was honestly the best I could make/find at the time). If you get Loomer or her campaign staff to release an image like that, you can upload it, or ping me and I'll do it, I've got some experience in this area. It's not guaranteed, my success rate with reaching out to article subjects for released images is only somewhere about 10-20%, or I'd do that more often instead of taking screenshots ... but that's not 0. Give it a try! --GRuban (talk) 19:24, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

Can't say I've ever tried the "release a photo of yourself under a free license to own the libs" angle before, but it's worth a shot... GorillaWarfare (talk) 19:27, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

@GorillaWarfare: Sorry about the typo, but yes, as a matter of fact, I have reached out to the campaign. I emailed and requested for comment, but have yet to hear back or receive any kind of reply. I will send the form you suggested, but I am getting the feeling that her staffers (if there are any) don't regularly check their email.

@GRuban: Thanks for the suggestion, but I don't believe anyone actually thinks that way. Nevertheless, I have not given up. Thanks for the vote of support. (SamMontana (talk) 20:51, 21 August 2020 (UTC))

Cool, well if you hear back and/or need any help you know where to find me! GorillaWarfare (talk) 21:15, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

Your submission at Articles for creation: Gabriel Weinberg (August 22)

Your recent article submission to Articles for Creation has been reviewed! Unfortunately, it has not been accepted at this time. The reason left by Calliopejen1 was: Please check the submission for any additional comments left by the reviewer. You are encouraged to edit the submission to address the issues raised and resubmit when they have been resolved.

• If you would like to continue working on the submission, go to Draft:Gabriel Weinberg and click on the "Edit" tab at the top of the window.
• If you now believe the draft cannot meet Wikipedia's standards or do not wish to progress it further, you may request deletion. Please go to Draft:Gabriel Weinberg, click on the "Edit" tab at the top of the window, add "{{Db-g7}}" at the top of the draft text and click the blue "publish changes" button to save this edit.
• If you do not make any further changes to your draft, in 6 months, it will be considered abandoned and may be deleted.
• If you need any assistance, you can ask for help at the Articles for creation help desk, on the reviewer's talk page or use Wikipedia's real-time chat help from experienced editors.

Calliopejen1 (talk) 07:34, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

Hello, SamMontana! Having an article declined at Articles for Creation can be disappointing. If you are wondering why your article submission was declined, please post a question at the Articles for creation help desk. If you have any other questions about your editing experience, we'd love to help you at the Teahouse, a friendly space on Wikipedia where experienced editors lend a hand to help new editors like yourself! See you there! Calliopejen1 (talk) 07:34, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

Actually, the references you have do seem to be about Weinberg, but since they mostly talk about his company, that's kind of a fine line. If you want to try again, you want to do one or more of these things:

1. Add more references about Weinberg; right now you have three, there is room for more.
2. Add more text in the article about Weinberg specifically, not just his company, and make sure it is backed by the references. That demonstrates the references do cover him in depth, not just his company. As it is, it's a pretty short article, there is room for more there too.
3. Add some text and references about Weinberg not about the company at all. That would guarantee he deserves a separate article, and from his own page, https://ye.gg/ it seems there are three possibilities for that:
   1. Weinberg as a privacy activist. He certainly writes articles about it. Do sources write about his activism as a person, not just founding DDG?
   2. Super Thinking, whatever that is. The link that points to is down, but maybe it got press before it went down?
   3. Traction. That's a book he wrote, and it's about making a startup, not DDG specifically. Did it get press coverage?

Good luck! --GRuban (talk) 14:50, 24 August 2020 (UTC)

Image without license

Unspecified source/license for File:Https---upload.wikimedia.org-wikipedia-commons-3-37-85722 SA76470 2020-02-06.t5e3c3f4a.m800.x27Ak5 Ip.jpg

Thanks for uploading File:Https---upload.wikimedia.org-wikipedia-commons-3-37-85722 SA76470 2020-02-06.t5e3c3f4a.m800.x27Ak5 Ip.jpg. The image has been identified as not specifying the copyright status of the image, which is required by Wikipedia's policy on images. Even if you created the image yourself, you still need to release it so Wikipedia can use it. If you don't indicate the copyright status of the image on the image's description page, using an appropriate copyright tag, it may be deleted some time after the next seven days. If you made this image yourself, you can use copyright tags like {{PD-self}} (to release all rights), {{self|cc-by-sa-4.0}} (to require that you be credited), or any tag here - just go to the image, click edit, and add one of those. If you have uploaded other images, please verify that you have provided copyright information for them as well.

For more information on using images, see the following pages:

• Wikipedia:Image use policy
• Wikipedia:File copyright tags

This is an automated notice by MifterBot. For assistance on the image use policy, see Wikipedia:Media copyright questions. NOTE: Once you correct this, please remove the tag from the image's page. --MifterBot ^{(Talk • Contribs • Owner)} 04:46, 31 August 2020 (UTC)

Your submission at Articles for creation: Gabriel Weinberg (September 9)

Your recent article submission to Articles for Creation has been reviewed! Unfortunately, it has not been accepted at this time. The reason left by Primefac was:  The comment the reviewer left was: Please check the submission for any additional comments left by the reviewer. You are encouraged to edit the submission to address the issues raised and resubmit when they have been resolved.

• If you would like to continue working on the submission, go to Draft:Gabriel Weinberg and click on the "Edit" tab at the top of the window.
• If you now believe the draft cannot meet Wikipedia's standards or do not wish to progress it further, you may request deletion. Please go to Draft:Gabriel Weinberg, click on the "Edit" tab at the top of the window, add "{{Db-g7}}" at the top of the draft text and click the blue "publish changes" button to save this edit.
• If you do not make any further changes to your draft, in 6 months, it will be considered abandoned and may be deleted.
• If you need any assistance, you can ask for help at the Articles for creation help desk, on the reviewer's talk page or use Wikipedia's real-time chat help from experienced editors.

Primefac (talk) 22:30, 9 September 2020 (UTC)

Concern regarding Draft:Gabriel Weinberg

Hello, SamMontana. I just wanted to let you know that Draft:Gabriel Weinberg, a page you created, has not been edited in at least 5 months. Draft space is not an indefinite storage location for content that is not appropriate for article space.

If your submission is not edited soon, it could be nominated for deletion under CSD G13. If you would like to attempt to save it, you will need to improve it. You may request userfication of the content if it meets requirements.

If the deletion has already occured, instructions on how you may be able to retrieve it are available here.

Thank you for your submission to Wikipedia. Bot0612 (talk) 10:25, 13 February 2021 (UTC)

File:Light Blade weapon system.jpg listed for discussion

A file that you uploaded or altered, File:Light Blade weapon system.jpg, has been listed at Wikipedia:Files for discussion. Please see the discussion to see why it has been listed (you may have to search for the title of the image to find its entry). Feel free to add your opinion on the matter below the nomination. Thank you. — Alexis Jazz (talk or ping me) 06:40, 10 May 2022 (UTC)