Wikipedia:Featured list candidates/List of Meerkat Manor meerkats

Add links
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
The following is an archived discussion of a featured list nomination. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the article's talk page or in Wikipedia talk:Featured list candidates. No further edits should be made to this page.

The list was promoted 02:13, 13 March 2008.

List of Meerkat Manor meerkats[edit]

I am nominating this list for featured list as I believe it meets all of the criteria for being a featured list. It is comprehensive, combining well referenced information from the Meerkat Manor series with available real-world information from the Kalahari Meerkat Project and other references. It is well-constructed, grouping the major meerkats by their family groups. It complies with all applicable MOS's, with a proper lead section and an appropriate image of the main meerkats of the series. Finally, I believe it is well-written, and it has been copyedited so it should not have any major grammatical or wording problems. AnmaFinotera (talk) 02:21, 1 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Just a quick comment, I was reading through the list and it seems like Flower has enough notability to warrant her own page, is there a particular reason why she doesn't? -- Scorpion0422 04:51, 1 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Thus far, there has been no need or any real desire to create one. While she is the most prominent of the Whiskers, even the book seems to focus primarily on the group as a whole and the project. Though her death was covered in the newspapers, before that, there is actually little outside sourcing about her, so there isn't much real world expansion. KMP does not make a ton of information available beyond what's already sourced from their site. The book might be used to give more prehistory, but that won't be released in the US until April 18th, so I can't say for sure if that will provide more information to allow for a fuller article. The movie might also give more info, at which time it might be something to consider. For now, though, I don't think she really needs one. AnmaFinotera (talk) 05:00, 1 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Resolved comments from Matthew

Comment Wow – I'm just skimming over it right now. From the contents it looks like it's going to be a hard read, but it's actually not.

  • Repeated word use at "the primarily purpose of the Kalahari Meerkat Project is to study the "...the breeding success"
  • Do the references back up the statements that the meerkats were named after other people/characters, for example Zaphod Beeblebrox?
  • Where does the description of being a "bruiser" come from?
  • Where does the description of having "some social problems" come from? Is there a narrator or something on the show that these come from? If so, it's probably from a script, or descriptions the producers wanted to give and could be one-sided. Are there any third-party descriptions available?
  • "possibly from when he was dropped on his head by a bird of prey as a pup" – did this event actually happen? Was it shown on screen, or is it discussed elsewhere?
  • What is a "roving male" I assume it means he's off chasing the ladies?
  • As {{cite episode}} has a field for credits, the director, camera operators or something might be good to include.
  • For Axle, it says "In the US broadcast, the spelling of Axle's name is changed to Axel". Did they actually have credits at either the beginning or end, or is this taken from closed captioning, DVD cover text, or something else?
  • Additional: Are there any more pictures that could be included, especially for the more prominent characters?-- Matthew | talk | Contribs 08:37, 1 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Other than those few questions, it's a really nice read! -- Matthew | talk | Contribs 08:35, 1 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks :) The repeated word has been fixed. Yes, the KMP FAQ gives some specifics on which meerkats were named after specific people/groups. "Bruiser" is specifically used on the AP meet section on their website (see the reference). "Some social problems" is the phrase used through the first series in the opening sequence. For the possible head dropping, it is stated in the episode cited (#3). Roving male...basically, yes, its a male meerkat that has left the security of his group to find females to mate with outside of his group, returning to his group sporadically between trips. The director/writer for each episode isn't information that I've been able to find, unfortunately, as none of the UK sites I could find with episode information gave those specifics. I removed the statement on Axle's name being respelled. The AP site now has it spelled as Axle instead of Axel.
On the question of pictures, I originally planned to put a picture of each group, however during the peer review, it was felt that one was sufficient as meerkats generally look the same. If more group images would be good, though, I can try to get some more from the DVDs. AnmaFinotera (talk) 08:56, 1 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Well if that's what the peer review said, I'll go with that. I can see the reasoning behind it. I've taken a closer look just now and found a couple of the same things The Rambling Man did, but other than that have nothing new to add right now. -- Matthew | talk | Contribs 05:30, 2 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Support - This is a really good list. Well written, sourced, presented. Meets the criteria. And all my comments were either fixed or refuted with good explainations. -- Matthew | talk | Contribs 05:32, 10 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Resolved stuff from The Rambling Man (talk) 08:55, 6 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Comments - nice list, some comments...

  • Avoid getting too wordy in the caption (succinctness is the key).
  • "which only appear in one or two episodes" - one or two? Which is it? Need to be definitive really rather than familiar.
  • "Dominant Female" - why capitalise the Female?
  • "three square mile" - use {{convert}} for folks who aren't Imperialists.
  • "several adults and pups to death, " - expand, i.e. did they all get killed in one go? Did they get sick? Sounds serious enough for explanation.
  • "(ISBN 0-297-84484-9)" - not sure this is really needed in the prose - move it down to references with a good {{cite book}} template.
  • "Flower was a devoted mother" - just "she was a devoted mother" will work fine here.
  • "she was bitten in " - "she was killed after being bitten.." (some may not be aware that the bite was terminal.
  • " primarily purpose" - primary?
  • British English article presumably (since its about a British show) so "eulogized", "named for" etc need to be Brit-ified!
  • Keep citations in numerical order (I see a couple of [3][2]).
  • "series 3" - series three.
  • "research name " - explanation needed.
  • " and get pregnant" - clumsy.
  • Link goshawk.
  • "in a (very) rare event for meerkat society" - phrase used twice in consecutive sections, firstly is it cited by the reference and secondly, can you use a slightly different phrase?
  • "premature birth caused by the strain of her new-found leadership" - is that referenced?
  • "research number" again, needs explanation.
  • There's a lot of "burrow move"s - perhaps an explanation the first time round what this means (for the non meerkat experts?)
  • Link euthanize (or it's Brit Eng equivalent)
  • Link Commandos.
  • "Meerkat Manor states that Lola has been the leader of the Zappa for three years. In reality, she was born in March 2005..." - why the discrepancy?
  • "Starsky" - was it, perchance, named after the TV cop?
  • De La Soul is mentioned three times but doesn't have a section...
  • You've got one deadlink (see this) and you seem to be referencing Wikipedia a lot - as far as I'm concerned, this doesn't meet WP:RS.

So several comments to attend to, I'll have to oppose for the moment. Let me know if you'd like to discuss anything I've written here! The Rambling Man (talk) 16:26, 1 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I'm not sure I understand the second item? That section is noting that meerkats which only appear in one or two episodes are not listed, so it could be any one or two? How do you Britify eulogized? I tried to get as many as I could, but since I'm American, I probably missed some. For "Link Commandos" where should they be linked to? No idea why MM changed Lola's leadership. They haven't really explained why they sometimes change things from reality, but I reworded to try to make it clearer. Starsky may have been named after the cop, but we have no reference on her name source. :) De la Soul is only actually named in the one episode where she disappears, so there isnt' much to say beyond her being the sister of Kinkajou and Mozart, and that she disappeared. I can add a section if its warranted, though that would go against the list qualifications.
"you seem to be referencing Wikipedia a lot" - I don't understand this comment. There are no references at all to Wikipedia? I've fixed the dead link and I think I've addressed everything else with the edits I've made. AnmaFinotera (talk) 21:02, 1 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Okay, quick response - Brits eulogise, not eulogize, we name things "after" things not "for" them. I'll do my best to find some time to Brit-Eng the article for you should you find it difficult. The reference section, in general, does not contain links external to Wikipedia, they link to episode articles or character articles in Wikipedia, nothing which would be considered a reliable source. More comments should you need them. The Rambling Man (talk) 19:41, 2 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]
I've changed the two items you mentioned, but feel free to fix the rest as I have little Brit-Eng knowledge beyond what I could find in the MOS. I still do not understand your complaint about the references. How is citing an episode from the series not an RS source? It is the primary source and is a perfectly reliable sources when citing information about "characters" in that series that was stated in the series? Yes, the citations do link to the List of episodes, because that is part of the {{cite episode}} template. I can go strip out the links, but it wouldn't change anything. All of those are references to the actual episodes, not to any Wikipedia article. The Cite Episode template is the one making links to the episode list. It is like wikifying an author name or publisher. You aren't referencing that article, just giving a link if someone wants to follow through. AnmaFinotera (talk) 20:43, 2 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]
I caught a few more z's which should be s's in British English so I think that's covered now. My biggest problem with your references is that they do not link out to a external reliable source. They link to a Wikipedia article (which does not necessarily have any pedigree, could be full of {{cn}} templates). I don't want the links to be stripped out, I want them to point out to reliable external pages, not Wikipedia season, character or episode pages. The Rambling Man (talk) 11:16, 3 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]
That isn't how the cite episode template works. The template instructions explicitly state to only link to an outside site if there is no Wikipedia episode list or episode article. In the case of Meerkat Manor, there is an episode list so the cite episode instances are all being properly used. Again the episode itself is the source, not any Wikipedia article, website, or anything else. Only the episode. AnmaFinotera (talk) 14:55, 3 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Well live and learn! Good, thanks for clearing that up... Still seems anomalous to me as you could be linking to stubs or, worse, nonsense. I'm sure in this case it's not the case but you get my drift? Anyway, since that's the way it's supposed to be, I can't very well object on that alone. Please allow me some time to go over the list again and check it for what I've commented on and possibly anything else that may arise. All the best. The Rambling Man (talk) 16:18, 3 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Yeah...basically this kind of linking is the same as linking to the author. It isn't meant to be a reference at all, just a "further info link" if someone wants to explore the topic further. So the author's article could also be a stub, but that would be okay because that isn't the source, only a connection. :) AnmaFinotera (talk) 16:26, 3 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support, I raised a number of issues and they were dealt with well. I made a minor edit to order references numerically but other than that it's in great shape. The Rambling Man (talk) 09:07, 6 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]
  • Support It's a very nice list. Out of curiosity, are you aiming for a Meerkat Manor Featured Topic? -- Scorpion0422 02:11, 13 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]
The above discussion is preserved as an archive. Please do not modify it. No further edits should be made to this page.
Retrieved from "https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Wikipedia:Featured_list_candidates/List_of_Meerkat_Manor_meerkats&oldid=1126718901"