Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Humanities/2021 March 15

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March 15

airwave breach 1/4/2021

I'm probably not the only one to have thought about this, but does anyone remember that there was a thread delivered by ATC frequency breach on 4 January 2021: "We are flying a plane into the Capitol on Wednesday. Soleimani will be avenged." (6 January 2021 was a Wednesday.) Since it anticipates the 2021 storming of the United States Capitol, I thought that it might deserve mention there as a foreshadower, but I'm not sure. Does there appear to be a meaningful connection between the two events other than the coincidence?

Some points against this theory to show that I thought this out:

• The threat is pretty hard to interpret as threatening anything other than an intentional plane crash, 9/11-style.
• It looks like Trump supporters acted of their own accord/inspired by a Trump rally on the same day. I think might have been hard for Iranian intelligence, or people with Iranian government sympathies, to convince the Trump supporters to invade the Capitol. (The reason I mention the Iranians is because Qasem Soleimani was beloved among Iranians while he was alive and after he died.)
• According to the intelligence community, Iran is against Trump, but Trump supporters are very obviously for Trump. So if this was conducted by Iranian intelligence etc., this would have been counterproductive for the result that they would have wanted to achieve.

Duckmather (talk) 06:08, 14 March 2021 (UTC)

A threat, not a "thread".  --Lambiam 08:01, 14 March 2021 (UTC)

An act by Iranians to avenge the assassination of Qasem Soleimani should have had 3 January as the obvious date and a military target (or possibly a high official in the executive branch). Together with the use of a synthetic voice to make the message anonymous, this makes an Iranian origin extremely implausible. Clearly, the aim was to disrupt the proceedings of the 2021 United States Electoral College vote count to be held on 6 January, and the claimed avenge motive was a guise. This aim coincided with that of Trump telling his supporters to march on the Capitol and fight as hell, but I see nothing concrete pointing at collusion. If taken seriously, it should in fact have kept the mob from storming the Capitol.  --Lambiam 08:29, 14 March 2021 (UTC)

Thanks for the analysis, Lambiam! Since this theory is extremely implausible, I don't think I'll take this very seriously as a possible theory from now on. (I think I was also considering a mention of this in the article, even with a disclaimer that the two are probably unconnected, but since it seems like this hasn't been discussed in relation to the Capitol storming much - here, here, and maybe here? - and because editing in your analysis would violate WP:NOR, I decided that it's not worth it.) Duckmather (talk) 04:53, 15 March 2021 (UTC)

Linking the threat to the storming or to Iran, or the storming to Iran seems a stretch. But this is pure OR/speculation but it's also not clear that the storming was counter productive to Iran if that's what you're suggesting. Iran may have preferred Biden to Trump, but it's not realistic to think anyone in Iranian intelligence who has a decent understanding of the US would expect there was any chance the storming would lead to Trump remaining president. Actually if anything they would have expected it to likely damage the chance of another Trump presidency and also reduce his influence. (Although frankly, I'm not convinced Iranian intelligence would think of Trump as some boggieman who must be destroyed at all cost once he lost. I suspect they're more worried about Mike Pompeo and others.) Further, it seems likely there would be plenty in Iranian intelligence, just like it's generally claimed to be the case for Russian and Chinese intelligence, who would be happy with anything which destabilises the US and leads to further polarisation. (In other words, it's quite likely plenty of countries somewhat hostile to the US would have been happy with the outcome especially if they also didn't like Trump. Doesn't mean any were involved thought.) Nil Einne (talk) 13:02, 14 March 2021 (UTC)

When the raindrops come along

A barbershop music tag I learned long ago has the lyric "let it pitter patter 'cause it really doesn't matter when the raindrops come along".

Now, a tag is generally the last few measures of an actual barbershop song. But so far I've been completely defeated in trying to figure out which song this tag is the last few measures of. My searches find hits for the tag, and for unrelated stuff.

Anyone have any insight as to the original song? --Trovatore (talk) 00:59, 15 March 2021 (UTC)

If Singin' in the Rain (written 23 years before the Musical it inspired) were rendered in barbershop style, that passage would make a plausible coda. {The poster formerly known as 87.81.230.195} 2.221.80.5 (talk) 03:10, 15 March 2021 (UTC)

Mmm, tags usually evoke both the melody and the lyrics of the song more than that. Thanks for the suggestion though! --Trovatore (talk) 05:22, 15 March 2021 (UTC)

I guess it could fit the classic "Come Rain or Come Shine" which (in the rarely sung intro) begins with "Let it storm let it thunder let the whole world go under". Some versions of your tag I found in online collections go slightly different: "Don't be blue when raindrops come a long (listen to the patter 'cause it really doesn't matter when the raindrops come along". I'm not very familiar with barbershop music. Are tags always composed for one specific song? ---Sluzzelin talk 15:48, 15 March 2021 (UTC)

As far as I know, yes. I wonder if in this case there's no song, just the tag, or rather the tag is the song? --Trovatore (talk) 17:35, 15 March 2021 (UTC)

Not an exact match, but the Irving Berlin song "Isn't This a Lovely Day?" (well known to Astaire-Rogers fans) ends with the lines "Let the rain pitter-patter / But it really doesn't matter / If the skies are gray; / Long as I can be with you, it's a lovely day." Deor (talk) 17:54, 15 March 2021 (UTC)

That is quite a coincidence! I'm sure Trovatore is aware of this (and it's even mentioned in our article Tag (barbershop music)), "In addition, good tags can be sung as short, stand-alone works." So they could be composed as such too. I'm sure I've seen this type of stand-alone tag in comedies and advertisement, and the first video examples of Trovatore's tag I found online were short clips, only the tag, including contestants for a virtual tag contest last year. ---Sluzzelin talk 19:03, 15 March 2021 (UTC)

Sihanouk question

Why did Sihanouk not make himself King of Cambodia again after the death of his father Suramarit in 1960? Futurist110 (talk) 01:38, 15 March 2021 (UTC)

In his abdication speech, Sihanouk explained that he was abdicating in order to extricate himself from the "intrigues" of palace life and allow easier access to common folk as an "ordinary citizen". According to Osborne, Sihanouk's abdication earned him the freedom to pursue politics while continuing to enjoy the deference that he had received from his subjects when he was king. Presumably, his attitude towards the conflicts of interest that led him to abdicate in 1955 still existed in his mind in 1960. --Jayron32 11:26, 15 March 2021 (UTC)

Thanks! Futurist110 (talk) 19:01, 15 March 2021 (UTC)

Love and romance in Pakistan

Greetings,

South Asia in general and Pakistan in particular, mighty takes away every thing but commoners (read women) suffer for their free choice. In latest instance, just days after Women of Pakistan marched for their emancipation demands on International Women's Day; a university in Lahore chose to expel a student couple from University because the female student dared to publicly propose her boyfriend on campus while their circle of friends cheering for them.

Same time Pakistan celebrity and leadership has sizable number of successful love marriages, and I am looking for help in listing the same for new article Draft:Love in Pakistan.

Pl. do help expand the article. Thanks and warm regards. Bookku (talk) 04:09, 15 March 2021 (UTC)

All Wikipedia articles with comparable titles (Love in Canada, Love in Germany, Love in Jamaica, Love in Morocco, Love in Nepal, Love in Singapore) seem to be about movies, so your title may not be the most suitable... AnonMoos (talk) 00:20, 16 March 2021 (UTC)

Would draft talk would be appropriate location than Reference desk to discuss article title? Since anyway you have taken issue may be we can name it as a longer explanatory title some thing like 'Draft:Love in Pakistan (Non entertainment encyclopedic article for which encyclopedias are meant for since Wikipedia is now entertainment pedia and no scope for non entertainment subject of love!)' (It would be interesting coincidence like a couple is thrown out of university for expressing non fictional real love but one can study fictional love in University of Lahore, similarly let the topic of real love be barred from Wikipedia and only fictional love allowed! an interesting proposition !! Bookku (talk) 01:54, 16 March 2021 (UTC)

Birth registration for non-Westerners, non-Japanese, and non-Christians 100+ years ago?

What was the situation in regards to birth registration for non-Christians who lived outside of either Europe, European offshoot countries (such as the U.S., Canada, Australia, New Zealand, and the various Latin American countries), or Japan 100+ years ago? Futurist110 (talk) 19:07, 15 March 2021 (UTC)