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January 26[edit]

Correct usage of the word Realtor[edit]

Please note the word Realtor is only to used with a capitol R...i.e. Realtor for the beginning r. It is a coined, patented word and will be found in dictionaries with a capitol R.

Check with a REAL dictionary and or the National Association Of Realtors.

Sandy Jo Messingham...a retired Realtor (1964-1988) with service on local board and state association publicity committees.

A Realtor would be a state licensed real estate salesperson or state licensed as a real estate broker. But said licensees cannot use the term Realtor without membership with the National Association of Realtors. -- Preceding unsigned comment added by 173.26.91.235 (talk) 23:59, 26 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Baloney, with a capital (not capitol) B, brought to you by a Faketor. As I understand it, you can't patent a word, only trademark it. More to the point, even if the organization did trademark "Realtor" for its members, that doesn't mean you can't use the word "realtor" for non-members and/or non-Americans. Clarityfiend (talk) 00:16, 27 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Yes, Sandy should've said "trademarked", not "patented". But also, the Reference Desk is for questions, not complaints. --142.112.149.107 (talk) 00:31, 27 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

EO has it capitalized,[1] but there is no law compelling the average person to do so. Not even in Iowa. <-Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots-> 01:23, 27 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

The Realtor organizations can't control how ordinary people use the word "realtor" but they can definitely take action to prevent uncredentialled persons from advertising themselves as "realtors" in the United States. The word came into use to try to distinguish the more respectable practitioners following a series of scandals, such as in Florida in the 1920s... AnonMoos (talk) 06:41, 27 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Of course, realtor shouldn't be used at all on wiki ideally, since it's a very US-centric term. Fgf10 (talk) 10:02, 27 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]
The term is a registered trademark both in the US^[2][3] and in Canada.^[4] Although you'll also find real estate agents in the UK advertizing themselves as "realtors",^[5][6] they may be targeting US expats; it is not a commonly used term here. --Lambiam 12:23, 27 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]
I note that in Real estate broker, the capitalization is inconsistent. Maybe that's what the OP was griping about. Also, don't Brits use the term "estate agent"? <-Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots-> 12:25, 27 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Yes, we do. {The poster formerly known as 87.81.230.195} 90.200.40.9 (talk) 13:31, 27 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

And that article is tagged as being UK-centric. Is there any practical difference between what a USA realtor does vs. what a UK estate agent does? <-Baseball Bugs ^{What's up, Doc?} carrots-> 16:35, 27 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Someone with knowledge of the professions in both countries would have to answer that. (I myself have never been closer to the USA than the west coast of Ireland.) {The poster formerly known as 87.81.230.195} 90.200.40.9 (talk) 23:54, 27 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

So the term "Realtor" is used two ways. The CAPITAL R version is meant to signify a certified professional that has maintained certain standards, passed certain trainings and assessments, has certifications. The lowercase r version is a genericized trademark akin to words like zipper or bandaid or kleenex or the like; in common speech people use the terms generically. The National Association of Realtors has an interest in making sure its trademark is protected against genericization, because the designation has a real meaning; like any other certification program it represents a level of training. Any person can sell you a house, but a Realtor is certified in aspects of real estate law and practices and ethics and all sorts of other things. So, in official usages, the Capital R version really should only refer to a person who has earned the correct certifications. The lowercase r version, however, is just a synonym for "estate agent" or "real estate broker" or whatever. --Jayron 32 16:17, 27 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

That is, it is if you don't mind violating a trademark or if you live in a country where the trademark isn't used. Otherwise it's an error. --142.112.149.107 (talk) 16:34, 27 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Jayron32 -- In the United States, the word "kleenex" is genericized to the degree that many people use it to mean "facial tissue" in general, but NOT to the degree that any competing company could sell facial tissue under the name "Kleenex" without being the target of major lawsuits. "Realtor" has the same status... AnonMoos (talk) 17:30, 27 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Yes, that is how genericized trademarks work. I thought I explained that. There is a difference between use in a professional setting and use by people chatting with each other. --Jayron 32 20:12, 27 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Well, you grouped together "zipper" and "kleenex", but I think those two have different legal statuses in the United States. AnonMoos (talk) 01:58, 28 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

There's no police breaking down my door because I call my off-brand facial tissues "kleenexes". I have been using the term for years, and faced no legal ramifications at all. Sometimes, even in front of the police! --Jayron 32 17:21, 28 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

As has been discussed here before (see "06:41, 27 January 2021" and "17:30, 27 January 2021" above) the purpose of trademark restrictions is not to control ordinary people's speech, but to prevent a competing product or service from being offered for sale under the trademarked name.. AnonMoos (talk) 15:07, 29 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Right, the type species for a US genericized trademark is "aspirin". Any company can sell acetylsalicylic acid as "aspirin" without paying a dime to Bayer. I don't think the corresponding statement is true for "kleenex", though I haven't specifically tried to find out. -Trovatore (talk) 04:30, 30 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

If the above is correct the term's use on Wikipedia would be subject to WP:HONORIFIC; just like Doctor, Colonel, Professor, Duchess, President, etc. Roger (Dodger67) (talk) 16:26, 27 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

It's an occupational credential. In a number of the states of the US, you can't legally advertise yourself as a cosmetologist without being a licensed and certified cosmetologist, and "realtor" is similar. It has very little in common with a pure honorific such as "Esquire"... AnonMoos (talk) 17:30, 27 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

"Esquire" is often used to signify "attorney at law", though this is inconsistent and as far as I know unregulated by government or regulatory bodies. --47.152.93.24 (talk) 19:36, 27 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]