Wikipedia:Reference desk/Archives/Computing/2006 September 12

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September 12

Dual core VS single core

I judge processor speed stricly by clock speed. that means, i dont consider an AMD 3500+ to be "equivalent" to a 3.5 GHz, but rather 2.something whatever its clock spead is. Similarly, i dont care if a processor is single core, dual core, or even quad core. id rather have a high-end Pentium 4 3.6 or 3.8 GHz than a Core 2 Duo 2.16 or 2.33 GHz. am i wrong?.   00:39, 12 September 2006 (UTC)

It depends on what you're doing. Different architectures have different advantages in different situations. What sort of application are you looking for? High performance gaming? Scientific computing? - Rainwarrior 02:21, 12 September 2006 (UTC)

Yes, you're wrong. See Instructions Per Cycle to get some insight into why. As rainwarrior says, it varies according to the task. In general, though, the performance differences between AMD and Intel chips at a given price point is not that large; if it was, word would get out and the sluggard would be forced to drop their prices. See also benchmark for more insight into the difficulties of comparing the performance of computer systems. --Robert Merkel 02:40, 12 September 2006 (UTC)

Indeed. Look at benchmarks first. Many would say you are wrong. --Proficient 06:33, 12 September 2006 (UTC)

I'm afraid processors are about more than just clock speed - for instance, the amount and type of cache makes quite a difference too. Different manufacturers build their processors differently, so an Intel clocked at 3GHz is not equivalent to an AMD clocked at 3GHz. Your best bet, as has been said before, is to check out benchmark test results for the applications or tasks you're likely to be using/doing (yes, this is important, as some architectures perform better in certain situations than others). You can get them in many PC magazines, or on sites like Tom's Hardware. — QuantumEleven 08:04, 12 September 2006 (UTC)

Yep, definetely. Although the clock speed may seem to be an easy indication on how fast a CPU performs, there are many, many other factors that need to be counted in. Without getting too complex, it is important to know that processors from Intel and AMD differ greatly in architecture, and you may have noticed that the new Core 2 Duos from Intel have had a dramatic drop in clock speed from its older generation Pentium 4s (using the 'Netburst' architecure')...yet perform so much better. This can be attributed to many different things, such as the L1 and L2 caches, FSB, number of cores, as well as the pipeline of the processor and how it arranges instructions to be processed. Additionally, it is important to realise that depending on the tasks you perform on the computer, you will get highly different results. As mentioned by QuantumEleven, it is a good idea to check out various sites and magazines to see how a selected processor performs compared to others. Ronaldh 11:50, 12 September 2006 (UTC)

Yes you're wrong!!! Check out this processor. Only 1.6 ghz. Sucky right? Look closer- 25MB of processor cache. Dual 333mhz FSB. 2 cores, 2 threads PER CORE that switch back and forth to continue processing during a cache miss. An array of 3 or 4 pentium fours would still be outperformed by a single Montecito die. A good rule of thumb is to never, ever compare clock speeds across architectures. --froth^{T C} 23:03, 24 September 2006 (UTC)

Latex help

Hi. I am writing up a document using latex, right now, everytime I start a new section it starts off on a new page, I was wondering if there was some way to change that so the new section would continue on the same page as the last. I'm using the "article" document class. Thanks. - Akamad 02:37, 12 September 2006 (UTC)

What command are you using to start the sections? \section shouldn't start a new page in that class, but I'd believe that \part (if it's even defined in article) and/or \chapter might. To actually change the commands would probably require an unpleasantly large host of \renewcommand calls. --Tardis 15:15, 12 September 2006 (UTC)

I just figured out what the problem was. I had each of my sections in seperate files and was using the \include command to put them into my main one. So it was actually the \include that was putting them on new pages and not the \section. I changed it to \input and it works fine. Thanks anyway, Tardis. - 08:34, 13 September 2006 (UTC)

ANSWERED -> Free Unzip Program ?

I had a trial version of a Zip/Unzip program, but is there one that's just permanently free with full functionality ? StuRat 05:15, 12 September 2006 (UTC)

FilZip is powerful and completely free.

Is Stuffit only demo/trial for Windows? On Mac it is fully functional. Actually Mac OS X has its own zip/unziping integrated. :P — [Mac Davis] (talk) (Desk|Help me improve)

Windows 98 here. StuRat 07:11, 12 September 2006 (UTC)

infoZIP, the granddaddy of all free ZIP implementations. -- Finlay McWalter | Talk 07:48, 12 September 2006 (UTC)

7-Zip supports ZIP (as well as lots of other compression formats) and is free. — QuantumEleven 07:58, 12 September 2006 (UTC)

See also List of file archivers and Comparison of file archivers. Weregerbil 08:04, 12 September 2006 (UTC)

Let me back up 7-Zip. Its 7z format is extremely effecient, and it has compatibility with a bunch of other formats. If not that, Winrar is fairly good (see below), but it has annoying nag screens unless you pay up. -- Consumed Crustacean (talk) 21:47, 13 September 2006 (UTC)

Use Winrar. It's permantely free with full functionality.--Taida 22:34, 12 September 2006 (UTC)

Since when? Take a look at WinRAR's website, you can download a trial version but are asked to pay for it if you want to continue using it. — QuantumEleven 08:44, 13 September 2006 (UTC)

The key word is 'asked' - it gives you a popup every time you start it, that's it. Still works fine. Tyrhinis 12:05, 13 September 2006 (UTC)

Thanks for the answers. :-) StuRat 10:09, 15 September 2006 (UTC)

Phishing

I know it's a bad idea to transmit one's credit card details by email, but what about sending one's bank details (account number and sort code) by email? Is this a bad idea? What is the nature and magnitude of the risk involved? --Richardrj ^{talk email} 06:21, 12 September 2006 (UTC)

That's probably even worse. They can likely drain your entire account and you may not be able to get it back. StuRat 07:09, 12 September 2006 (UTC)

I would be even more concerned about possible identity theft.

I think that is messier though—meaner and often reported in the news, but messier and more difficult. The best way is to drain. — [Mac Davis] (talk) (Desk|Help me improve)

Nobody who legitimatly needs that information would ask you to send it in an e-mail. They would want to use a secure method of communications. HighInBC 23:52, 20 September 2006 (UTC)

I know I may just be repeating what the others have said, but this is a well known scam. You get an email from what appears to be your bank (and they're REALLY good at the whole thing, they copy the logo, and sometimes even have a phony website that looks exactly like your bank's website) and they ask you to "confirm" "for security purposes" or something like that your account number and your PIN. It's actually one of the more sophisticated scams out there. By all means, DON'T REPLY AT ALL. And if you really want to make sure we're right, just call up you bank and ask them about it. They'll definitely tell you the same, and that they'd NEVER send such an email. Loomis 01:35, 24 September 2006 (UTC)

Credit card security

I occasionally see online vendors without secure websites suggesting that the buyer transmit their credit card details by email, but splitting the number into two emails. Is there any point to this? Surely, if a hacker can intercept one email, he can intercept two, and simply put them together. --Richardrj ^{talk email} 06:25, 12 September 2006 (UTC)

It might defeat some automatic filtering software that looks for credit card info in a single email, but doesn't know how to combine two emails to get the info. StuRat 07:08, 12 September 2006 (UTC)

Shrug, transmitting insecure email is a crappy way to do it anyway. Even a basic public-key cryptography scheme would have defeated an interception. And with software that automates it, it's not exactly hard to do. I wouldn't trust an online vendor that asks you to transmit emails in the clear. ColourBurst 14:07, 12 September 2006 (UTC)

What it comes down to is that you are interested in purchasing something from a vendor who doesn't want the electronic trail of credit card processing related to his/her website. Why? What is he/she hiding? If the business is shady enough that credit card processing has to be hidden, why trust that you will receive whatever it is you are interested in purchasing? --Kainaw ^(talk) 14:24, 12 September 2006 (UTC)

OK, here is the page I was talking about [1]. It's not a shady business at all, it's a perfectly respected and above-board operation. They say that they are working to launch secure credit card processing, so the suggestion of splitting the card number into two emails is just a temporary workaround. --Richardrj ^{talk email} 14:36, 12 September 2006 (UTC)

They accept PayPal. PayPal accepts credit cards securely online. What's the problem? Perhaps they should pay attention next time they are logged into PayPal. It has a rather cheap online "store" for small businesses. --Kainaw ^(talk) 14:39, 12 September 2006 (UTC)

Sure, but maybe they are trying to cater for people who (for whatever reason, and I admit I can't think of one) might not want to use Paypal. --Richardrj ^{talk email} 14:43, 12 September 2006 (UTC)

I know one. I have a senile bastard of a father-in-law. He went to EBay and bid on two items and won. They required payment by PayPal. He went there and saw the login/create an account screen. He did not see that he could submit payment with just a credit card. He didn't want to create an account, so he got mad and refused to pay for the items he bought on EBay. Then, he rebid on another item, which required payment by PayPal. He won it, and refused to pay for it. Finally, he was suspended by EBay for non-payment. Now, he refuses to use EBay or PayPal because he says they are all crooks. --Kainaw ^(talk) 14:46, 12 September 2006 (UTC)

There is a case against Paypal; read this. It's illiterately written but the point made is a good one, I think. --Richardrj ^{talk email} 14:53, 12 September 2006 (UTC)

How can you tell? I'm not even sure what the point is. (Kainaw's father-in-law seems to be a fairly average online shopper, in terms of sophistication.) --jpgordon^∇∆∇∆ 19:23, 12 September 2006 (UTC)

Net mlm

Is this recently-created article about a notable or a not notable neologism? --Dweller 12:32, 12 September 2006 (UTC)

This is the sort of word that is only ever used by mlm companies themselves; just like many other members of the corporate-speak language, especially in the computing biz, no real human uses it. Sourced information could be added to the Multi-level marketing article, though, on how the internet has changed the mlm industry, with maybe a sidenote about the term net mlm (right now this gets only a paragraph though it's probably the best thing ever to happen to mlm). Also, mlm should have a redirect to the article above. Fastfinge

"before" object property and the "Take" and "Give" actions in Inform 6

I've been making an "interactive fiction" game using Inform 6, and I have an animate object that has a before property overriding the Take action, basically along the lines of:

before [;
Take:
move self to Player;
print_ret "You got the object! Good for you.";
];

So that the user can pick up the animate object instead of getting the "I don't suppose [animate object] would like that" message. However, the problem I've encountered is that if the object is on the ground or in a container, and the user types something like "give object to Bill", the interpreter first calls the Take action on that object (so that it's in the player object), then performs the Give action. However, with the Take action for that object in its before property, if the user tries to give the object when they aren't carrying it, they get the object using the before Take routine, but then the Give action is never called as it would be with any normal object. The only way the Give action will proceed correctly if the player isn't holding the object before trying to Give it to something is if I use print "You got ... you."; instead of print_ret. However, then the message for an animate object, "I don't suppose ..." comes up when the player is simply taking the object normally (i.e. "take object"), which I don't want. I've checked all the Inform FAQs I can find, looked through the library files (oddly enough, it doesn't look like the Give action ever calls the take action or is even set up to deal with cases where the player doesn't have the object), and tried using the after property, but I've been unable to figure this out. If anyone has an ideas or has been able to fix this problem in a game they did, I'd greatly appreciate the assistance. Thanks!

hi,

This isn't a particularly good place for extremely spacific language questions; inform is a somewhat rare language, as is interactive fiction a somewhat rare art-form. I think your best bet is to take your question to the usenet group rec.arts.int-fiction. Last I checked google groups carries this group, so you shouldn't need a usenet server. Sorry I can't be of more help, but I'm a tads user, myself. Fastfinge

It's been a while since I worked with Inform, but a quick review of the library reference suggests that you might be able to handle the entire action before it's broken down into Take and Give. The life hook on the recipient seems like a good place, or perhaps trapping Give on the animate carryable. But it might be necessary to override the library's implementation of Give (I'm sure you can find it somewhere!) if none of these traps would run before the Take trap you already have. It's too bad that the before routine isn't trivalent: "process this normally" (currently false), "this action has already failed" (currently true), or "this action has succeeded" (currently not available). Does this help at all? --128.165.123.18 18:32, 12 September 2006 (UTC)

Sort of. I've already looked into the library extensively, and the verb definition for Give seems to have nothing to handle the case of the user trying to give an object they don't have to another (animate) object- there's only cases along the lines of held 'to' creature, creature held, etc (I actually went as far as to take the routine for Take out of the verb code library the normal verb library calls, but it doesn't seem to have anything to handle itself being called by Give). Your suggestion of getting into the life routines of the recipient objects might work, but I'd really rather have it handled by the one object with the actual before property for Take itself. Still, I appreciate the suggestions, and I might just check out the rec.arts groups FastFinge suggested. I'm rather surprised that Inform doesn't seem to have something to handle this type of situation, as it seems like something that could potentially crop up quite a bit.

Quick update: I checked the rec.arts.int-fiction group and found a workable solution (there's a variable action_to_be that identifies the next action, if there is one). Thanks for the help, everyone!

You could upgrade to Inform 7, it makes that sort of thing a bit easier. Luigi30 (Taλk) 13:04, 14 September 2006 (UTC)

how do i simulate the vc++ program that i had created for dc motor control?

i had created a program in vc++.this program is used to control the speed as well as direction of dc motor(12v) .Now i want to simulate the program for realization.... how to simulate it?..is there any software to simulate it? refer complete details of program ...etc in "http://www.multyremotes.com/DC-motor-control-in-VC++.htm"

I'm afraid I don't understand the question -- define "simulate the program for realization". If you want to run the program, but have precise control over how fast it runs and what it runs, and be able to see its internal state, you're talking about running the program under a debugger; VC++ has one integrated that probably does everything you want in that regard. If you're talking about simulating the operation of the motor, you probably want to write a separate program that reads and interprets the output of the existing program to check its validity. Does that help? --Tardis 15:27, 13 September 2006 (UTC)

my reply:

sorry i had asked the question wrongly!

tardis said that "simulating the operation of motor"....how it will be?.. can anyone help me?

i had clicked the link "Tardis" for help...but it is not reachable!...help me!

I imagine such a simulation program would need to know the parameters of the motor, such as it's size, and it could then take the inputs from the control program and use those to simulate the motor. If you don't already have such a simulation program, however, then I would think it would be easier to test on an actual motor. StuRat 16:17, 14 September 2006 (UTC)

Also, I've looked at your web site. It's full of spelling and grammar errors. You really need to have somebody proofread it for you. Do you know any native English speakers who could help you with that ? StuRat 16:24, 14 September 2006 (UTC)

Elementary Wikitable query

I'm sorry to ask you really clever guys such a basic question, but I know next to nothing about HTML. I have just made (what I consider to be) a nice wikitable here:

• Scottish_Parliament_election,_2007#Opinion_polls

I nicked it from various other tables of opinion polls for other elections. The problem is that Scotland has two votes (local constituency, plus regional), and thus two parameters are measured in (most of the) polls. How do I break the column for each party into "1st vote" and "2nd vote"?

(If I am asking this at completely the wrong page, please say!) Thanks. --Mais oui! 18:37, 12 September 2006 (UTC)

Hmm, try putting "colspan=2" as a parameter in front of the column headers, and replacing semicolons with double pipes where appropriate. The first row would then look like the below table. Hyenaste ^(tell) 18:52, 12 September 2006 (UTC)

Poll	Dates	Lab		SNP		Con		LD		Grn		SSP		oth
Sunday Times/YouGov	5-7 Sept 2006	30%	27%	29%	29%	14%	14%	18%	15%	-	-	-	-	10%	15%

Thanks. But I'm afraid that that doesn't seem to work: if I apply that then the table seems to progressively "squash up" towards the right hand side. Also, I was kind of hoping that we might be able to do a little sub-split in the header which said "1st vote" and "2nd vote". Any ideas?

Sorry: I was wrong - it does work! Many thanks! But I wonder if you can tell me how to put a wee split in the header to put in the "1st", "2nd" clarification? --Mais oui! 19:15, 12 September 2006 (UTC)

I've made that change, but you may adjust it if you wish. Hyenaste ^(tell) 19:19, 12 September 2006 (UTC)

Thanks. --Mais oui! 19:24, 12 September 2006 (UTC)

new itunes

with iTunes 7.0 out now i have heard that if you have an acount one one computer then install iTunes on a different one but then sign in to the account off the first computer; and then you plug your iPod into your new computer that it wont reset your iPod. is this true?

I don't think it use to reset your iPod. I believe that is true (your question). — [Mac Davis] (talk) (Desk|Help me improve)

it never usto reset the ipod... even with the old itunes.... it always prompted you asking if you wanted to copy the music from the new computer to your ipod.... you just simply clicked nopulo 13:22, 13 September 2006 (UTC)

The only problem with all forms of iTunes before a certain version is that JHymn won't work with it. (JHymn extracts iTunes files, strips their DRM, and creates a MP3 file for you to use on, say, WinAmp.) --Guroadrunner 06:03, 14 September 2006 (UTC)

ALi PCI to USB Open Host Controller issue

I recently bought and plugged in a PCI USB2 hub with a total of about seven ports. However, Windows XP says it had a problem during installation, USB devices I plug into it receive power but not data, and Device Manager lists "Ali PCI to USB Open Host Controller" three times, with a Code 10 (This device cannot start) error on each. I've tried uninstalling it and re-running Add Hardware, in which case the same error occurs; I've tried unplugging it and plugging it back in; and I've tried, in desperation, the Help Troubleshooter. As a second question, has anyone ever been helped by one of those troubleshooters?

Any Ideas? Any help would be very greatly appreciated. 84.66.1.88 21:02, 12 September 2006 (UTC)

My guess is the card is defective. If your card is still under warantee, I would reccommend returning it and getting a new one. I purchased a generic ALi PCI USB2 card and it failed(giving the problems you mentioned) about 1/2 year after installing it. After wasting time trying to fix(doing much what you have done) it, I went out and purchased a Belkin PCI USB2 card.

As for Windows Help Troubleshooters, I would say they are useful for people unknowledged about computers. They are the text equivalent of what I believe is usually called, "level one tech support", in customer tech support. In other words, they are common solutions to common user problems. Mitaphane _talk 21:53, 12 September 2006 (UTC)

html: want the code, not the link

I'm looking for the HTML equivalent of Wikipedia's "nowiki" tags. In other words, I want to type the "<a href=..." business of making a link to another page, without actually making a clickable link. (It will be used on a non-wiki site) The goal is that people can look at the code, cut and paste it, and have the link work then. (Too garbled? Or do you see what I mean?) Joyous! | Talk 23:29, 12 September 2006 (UTC)

PRE takes care of formatting, but beyond that you need to turn <, >, and & into their equivalent html entities (lest they be interpreted as html). So really there's no equivalent. -- Finlay McWalter | Talk 23:40, 12 September 2006 (UTC)

Use &lt; in place of <, and &gt; in place of >. --Serie 23:41, 12 September 2006 (UTC)

Here's an example of HTML source:

Visit scenic <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/">Wikipedia</a>.

and here's the way it appears on a page:

Visit scenic <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/">Wikipedia</a>.

Try your cut and paste; satisfaction guaranteed (or your money back). --KSmrq^T 10:56, 13 September 2006 (UTC)

Thanks to all! Joyous! | Talk 11:08, 13 September 2006 (UTC)

<xmp> would what you asked, but is deprecated. The suggestions above are better. Jon513 16:38, 13 September 2006 (UTC)