Talk:19th Mechanized Division (Greece)/GA1

GA Review

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Reviewer: Sturmvogel 66 (talk · contribs) 05:15, 31 January 2017 (UTC)

I'll get to this shortly.--Sturmvogel 66 (talk) 05:15, 31 January 2017 (UTC)

• No DABs
• Images appropriately licensed.
• What's the literal translation of Army Section? I'm wondering if it's like the German Armee Abteilung (Army Detachment) which is roughly in between a corps and an army in strength.
  • That's what (I guess) the term comes from, borrowed from German WWI-era terminology. I don't have access to any English-language publications of the Army History Directorate, so I don't know how they translate it, but Swastika over the Acropolis uses the term "Field Army Section". Constantine ✍ 22:32, 9 February 2017 (UTC)
  • Strike that, the English-language "An abridged history of the Greek-Italian and Greek-German war, 1940-1941" of the Army History Directorate also uses "Field Army Section" as well. Constantine ✍ 22:37, 9 February 2017 (UTC)
• Don't capitalize the armour and cavalry here: Greek Armour combat arm, which inherited the traditions of the Greek Cavalry as they're not proper nouns. And this: Mechanized Regiment and Tank Company and a few others. Conversely Mechanized Cavalry Regiment is the full name of the unit and is a proper noun.
  • Hmm, is not "Cavalry" or "Armour" a proper name when speaking about them as specific combat arms rather than generically? Analogous to "Infantry"? On the unit names, as far as I can tell, they all are proper unit names; I clarified that "Mechanized Regiment" refers to the "Mech. Cavalry Regiment" throughout, however. Constantine ✍ 22:32, 9 February 2017 (UTC)
    • This is where things get kinda fuzzy as I've often seen Navy or Army capitalized in newspapers and magazines; sort of an implicit US that makes them proper names. Strictly speaking though, they're just plain nouns. I'm not sure how the rest of the world does things, but the US generally uses X Branch when referring to a specific combat arm, saving the term for collective use, forex: "there are X combat arms, everything else is either combat support or combat service support". So this is probably why "Greek Armour combat arm" strikes me badly. You could take Armour combat arm as a proper name, but then the whole thing would need to be capitalized. But I'm not going to fuss over it; you can decide for yourself what to do about it, if anything.--Sturmvogel 66 (talk) 00:39, 14 February 2017 (UTC)
• Use the template for circa
  • Done Constantine ✍ 22:32, 9 February 2017 (UTC)
• Light tanks of the United Kingdom#Commercial Carden Loyd tanks is the proper link for the Light Tank Mk IIIB "Dutchman"
  • Thanks a lot, included. Constantine ✍ 22:32, 9 February 2017 (UTC)
• Since you're giving the number for these units, they're proper nouns and should be capitalized. 1st and 4th mortar troops
  • Done. Constantine ✍ 22:32, 9 February 2017 (UTC)
• Car-mounted Skoda battery I'm very dubious that these were actually mounted on automobiles; I presume that they were actually towed and that this is a translation issue.
  • It is odd, but "φερόμενη επί αυτοκινήτων", means precisely that. I'll look into it. Constantine ✍ 22:32, 9 February 2017 (UTC)
    • While the Skoda 75mm gun is a mountain gun, it's still 600+ kg and I don't know many passenger cars of the time that could carry such a load. Does Greek distinguish between passenger cars and light cargo trucks? Any photos? They ought to clarify things.
      • I don't think that passenger cars are meant here; probably flatbed trucks were used. I couldn't find any photos, I'll keep looking. Constantine ✍ 12:42, 14 February 2017 (UTC)
        • Can the Greek term be used for trucks as well? If so, then I'd suggest "Truck-mounted" instead.--Sturmvogel 66 (talk) 13:49, 14 February 2017 (UTC)
          • Given the period, the term probably means "automobiles" in a generic sense. I've changed it in the main article. Constantine ✍ 14:30, 14 February 2017 (UTC)
• For the order of battle, I strongly suggest inserting a time sign (× in the Wiki markup menu below) between quantities of weapons and the name of the weapon to avoid confusing the eye with two sets of numbers in close conjunction. Alternatively you could spell out the quantities.
  • Good point, done. Constantine ✍ 22:32, 9 February 2017 (UTC)
• Delete the "the" here because it reads oddly with the "ing" form of the following verb: ; the covering of the Group of Divisions' retreat
  • Fixed. Constantine ✍ 22:32, 9 February 2017 (UTC)
• Down to 6 April. This is great stuff; I hope that you're going to work on the rest of the Greek Army during this period. I've read the English translation of the Staff History and it's grossly inadequate for tracking events, much less the order of battle changes between the Italian and German invasions. More later.--Sturmvogel 66 (talk) 02:00, 3 February 2017 (UTC)
  • I definitely hope to get my hands on the more detailed Greek-language histories of the Greek Army's History Directorate soon enough, and slowly work my way through the divisions, battles, etc. There's a ton of stuff that needs to be done on Greek participation in WWII, but what with my focus on Byzantine and early Islamic topics here on WP, and RL pressures and interests, it tends to stay on a permanent back burner... Looking forward to the rest :). Constantine ✍ 22:32, 9 February 2017 (UTC)
  • @Sturmvogel 66: Just a reminder :). Constantine ✍ 12:48, 13 February 2017 (UTC)
    • There are a few minor issues remaining, but nothing worth holding things up. I hope that you're able to continue working on the WW2-era Greeks, however intermittently, as there aren't nearly enough multi-lingual Wikipedians interested in the topic working on them.--Sturmvogel 66 (talk) 00:39, 14 February 2017 (UTC) (A former armored reconnaissance specialist)
      • Thanks a lot for the review. I am well aware of the lack of interest, and will definitely try to do more. The main problem, however, is a lack of sources, which I hope to rectify in a trip to an Athens bookstore in the near future. Constantine ✍ 12:42, 14 February 2017 (UTC)