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Talk:2009 Hungarian Grand Prix

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Track Map

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The track map shown here isn't quite right. Firstly, the 'old' chicane is no longer in use (marked in black on the diagram) - the correct layout should follow the dotted line. Also, the turn numbering is wrong - turns 2 and 5 as marked on the map are not actual turns, ie what is marked as turn 3 is actually turn 2, what is marked as 6 is actually turn 4 and so on. (source: formula1.com) I don't have the skill to correct the maps unfortunately, if anyone is able to do so it would be appreciated Oli.meggitt (talk) 11:04, 21 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]

This message referred to the old SVG version, it's now fixed. ArwinJ (talk) 18:50, 30 July 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Intro para, Stewards' enquiry into car. no. 4 at start

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Much of the lead paragraph is concerned with the standings prior to the race and is therefore not a summary of the article's contents. I suggest that it be pared down and amended to reflect more accurately the content of the article. Since the F1 standings prior to the race are relevant, they could be presented in a separate section, perhaps in tabular form, in the article proper.

The article doesn't mention the stewards' investigation of "an incident involving car no. four" at the start. --TraceyR (talk) 09:06, 27 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Edited the race summary to include Raikkonen being investigated, also added Renault being suspended. If you want to have a look at this and edit it as you wish.
Will get to the intro paragraph when I have the time. --Troggy (talk) 12:21, 27 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Some comments

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  • The article often uses the form "Driver X of Team Y", which sounds a bit unsuitable to me, as it sounds like a nationality.
  • Alguersuari's reaction to the comments about him being too experienced, or his general thoughts on making his debut, would be a good addition to the background paragraph on him.
  • There is some inconsistency in whether an F1 team is treaty as a singular or plural entity, e.g. "The Japanese constructor was only", "McLaren were the pace-setters". I'd prefer the former, but others might not agree.
  • The part-sentence "just two weeks after he claimed the first win of his 130-race Grand Prix career at the German Grand Prix", would work better if it was moved to the background section, where it could be expanded into a brief summation of the previous race.
  • There are some paragraphs in the qualifying section which are not referenced.
  • "Toyota, Renault and BMW Sauber posted mid-range times, Force India and Toro Rosso posted some of the slowest times, whilst Ferrari enjoyed mixed results, performing well in the first practice and not so well in the second." This sounds incredibly vague, and should be sharpened up.
  • Information from the Notes section should be integrated into the main body of the article, and then the section should be removed.
  • "As time expired, the Ferrari of Massa..." Does this mean "as time passed" or "as the session ended"?
  • Massa's accident needs to be described more clearly. At the moment it sounds as if the engine cut (and did it even cut out before he hit the barrer? I remember hearing the throttle open after he had come to rest) caused him to crash into the barriers, which is incorrect. Ideally someone could make an overhead diagram of what happened and upload it, but better prose will have to suffice for the moment!
  • Is there any information on weather conditions for the other sessions to accompany the temperatures for the race?
  • "Alonso's Renault was suffering from graining on its rear tyres" - for the layman, what does "graining" mean? Needs a link (if a suitable one exists) or a quick explanation.
  • I know that "pit lane" is sometimes referred to without a definite article in motorsport, but it might be easier to insert a couple of "the"s to avoid confusion at a potential future GAN or FAC, especially as the usage is not consistent throughout the article.
  • I would mention the rest of the finishers outside the points at the end of the race section.
  • The "incident" between Hamilton and Räikkönen at the start is mentioned only in that it was investigated after the race, but the incident itself is not mentioned during the race section.
  • The paragraph about Massa's recovery needs to be updated.

Aside from these issues, the article looks in good shape!--Midgrid(talk) 18:31, 8 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

A note about treating F1 teams as singular or plural - it rather depends on the context. To say "the Japanese constructor was..." is clearly the only grammatical way since 'constructor' is unequivocably a singular noun. However, in British English, it's correct to use groups of people as mass nouns or plural nouns, e.g. "McLaren were..." since McLaren are a group of people. To say "McLaren was..." is something of an Americanism. Same with football teams, same with musical groups - hence the Wikipedia convention of American groups being one way and British groups being the other, e.g. "Van Halen is a band", and Black Sabbath are a band". Slightly irritating, but there it is. Bretonbanquet (talk) 16:16, 9 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks, I wasn't aware of that grammatical convention.--Midgrid(talk) 22:07, 9 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Neither was I until I started to use Wikipedia! haha Bretonbanquet (talk) 22:16, 9 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Haha! Apterygial 23:30, 9 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Haha!! I didn't realise it had come up before! It's something that many people are aware of, but it's still hard to know exactly what the rules are. If only the Americans had just come to their senses and used British English... hehe.. Bretonbanquet (talk) 23:36, 9 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Oh dear, short memory. I'll try to remember it this time. ;) --Midgrid(talk) 00:22, 10 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Finally, we are complete. Cs-wolves(talk) 16:47, 12 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Well done, it looks much better now! :) Just one minor point - you describe Massa and Surtees's engines "ticking over" after their cars had come to rest. Ticking over, to me, suggests that the engine is just idling, i.e. that the accelerator is not being pressed, which was not the case in either accident. Could the wording be altered to reflect this?--Midgrid(talk) 18:08, 12 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]
I was trying to think of a better way to describe it, but words were failing me. You think you can have a shot at it? Cs-wolves(talk) 19:05, 12 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]
I've given it a go.--Midgrid(talk) 19:27, 12 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Had a look, and it's better than mine. ;) Cs-wolves(talk) 19:36, 12 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]
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