Talk:Aiden Aslin

Lots to add

https://www.google.ca/search?q=Aiden+Aslin
Lots to add out now folks, please get to it.
24.78.228.96 (talk) 07:47, 13 April 2022 (UTC)

Yea, guys, someone could be saved at least. Other couple thousand lads should know he is safe before they are going to Sibir to prosper it. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 89.109.46.120 (talk) 19:22, 18 April 2022 (UTC)

Beaten Up

Here is a notable youtube video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rNizGwjZbo0 released 18 April 2022. There aren't any wounds on his head or hand. So I would suggest to take out the claim of "beaten up". --2A02:908:957:A340:145C:A80F:AF2C:BA8A (talk) 22:55, 18 April 2022 (UTC)

The article describes a video from 14 April, as supported by two reliable sources we trust to give us accurate information. On 14 April, in Russian captivity, he appeared in a video in handcuffs and appeared to have been beaten up, as he appeared to have a head injury, swollen hands and was slurring his words. And there is no doubt he had a facial injury on that day – see this image. His being uninjured, in your words, 4 days later has nothing to do with the description the article used. If it did, it would need to be supported by a reliable source, otherwise it's original research or the views of individual Wikipedians and hence not permitted, no matter how well intentioned. Best wishes, Solipsism 101 (talk) 00:18, 19 April 2022 (UTC)

Not in source

I have restored two {{not in source}} templates. A source mentioning "Aiden Aslin, 23, from Newark" with title "Nottinghamshire man" neither confirms a year of birth, nor a birth place. Andy Mabbett (Pigsonthewing); Talk to Andy; Andy's edits 19:23, 24 April 2022 (UTC)

British-Ukrainian?

He is referred to in the article as ‘British-Ukrainian’ but major western media outlets overwhelmingly refer to him as ‘British volunteer fighter’ ‘British fighter’ ‘British volunteer’, ‘British man fighting in Ukraine’ etc.

It is understandable that his family have recently been stressing his ties to Ukraine and that his fiancé is Ukrainian to counter Russia’s claim that he is a mercenary. But Wikipedia is supposed to be impartial and rely only on published facts. Referring to him as ‘British’, as Wikipedia approved reliable sources do, does not put him in any additional danger.

The article could mention that his family says he’s lived in Ukraine since 2018 and joined the Ukrainian Marines, there are plenty of references for that. But ‘British-Ukrainian’ is a stretch and it’s not reflected in any major media outlet I’ve looked at. User2346 (talk) 00:29, 26 April 2022 (UTC)

It is not really a question if he is described as "British solider" or "Briton" (as the headlines in the reflist refer to him as), but what his current nationalities are (from MOS:FIRSTBIO). The MOS aside, there is an obvious reason his being both British and Ukrainian are relevant to his situation and useful to note to the reader. Solipsism 101 (talk) 10:42, 26 April 2022 (UTC)

Was just given death penalty

I got an alert from Apple News he’s been given the death penalty, I’m going back. Screw this. 92.40.200.40 (talk) 19:11, 7 June 2022 (UTC)

Russian backed separatists

There is a paywall, so I do not know what exactly the reference says, bur Russia controls the alleged 'separatists', not only 'backs' them.Xx236 (talk) 07:00, 28 June 2022 (UTC)

Interview with defense lawyers

Added two links to an interview with defense lawyers - links are in Russian - if somebody needs to translate something - ask here. Manyareasexpert (talk) 21:26, 30 June 2022 (UTC)

@Nicosa77, thanks for your edits. Could you please reintroduce some more info regarding defense into the article, the part that they didnt spoke during the hearing. Also consider re-introducing dividing Trial chapter into sections, thanks! Manyareasexpert (talk) 08:29, 13 July 2022 (UTC)

Can you give me the exact quote regarding not speaking in court, both in Russian and your translation into English, as well as lawyer Ershov's full name? I have found relevant information regarding the rights of the accused in pre-2014 Ukraine, which is supposed to be the basis of DPR law. I will be able to reintroduce that text as well as put it in context once you do. Thanks. Nicosa77 (talk) 22:35, 13 July 2022 (UTC)

Its Ershov Dmitry Yevgenyevich.

https://meduza.io/paragraph/2022/06/30/zhiteley-moskvy-pora-gnat-kopat-okopy

Вагин: В ДНР мы участвовали только в допросах наших подзащитных, на целую ночь — с 22 до 5 утра. Затем все материалы передали ДНР, потому в суде мы не выступали.

Vagin: In DPR, we participated in the interrogations of our clients only, for the whole night - from 22 to 5 in the morning. Then all the materials were transferred to the DPR, so we did not spoke in court.

https://advstreet.ru/interview/my-ne-pridatok-sledstviya/

– Давайте вернёмся к вопросу защиты трёх военнопленных, которые приговорены к смертной казни. Расскажите, чьи интересы вы представляли – и на каких этапах?

Вагин: Я вёл [21-летнего] марокканца Брагима Саадуна. Дмитрий Евгеньевич [Ершов] вёл британцев – [48-летнего] Шона Пиннера и [28-летнего] Эйдена Аслина. Мы осуществляли защиту в рамках уголовного дела, возбуждённого военным следствием. Повторюсь, в рамках российского дела их допрашивали в качестве подозреваемых то ли по 356-й (применение запрещенных средств и методов ведения войны. – «АУ»), то ли по 359-й (наёмничество. – «АУ») УК РФ; одно из двух. Но российское следствие никаких других следственных действий в отношении этих военнослужащих, этих наёмников, не вело – кроме допросов. Которые проходили на территории Генпрокуратуры ДНР и на которых Пиннер, Саадун и Аслин находились в качестве подозреваемых. Очень длинные допросы на самом деле были, на целую ночь – с 22 вечера до 5 утра продолжались. Потом все материалы были переданы в прокуратуру ДНР. И дальнейшее следствие уже было дэнээровское – и защитники тоже. Поэтому в суде ДНР мы не выступали.

- Let's return to the issue of protecting three prisoners of war who were sentenced to death. Tell us whose interests you represented – and at what stages?

Vagin: I had [21-year-old] Moroccan Bragim Saadoun. Dmitry Yevgenyevich [Ershov] had the British – [48-year-old] Sean Pinner and [28-year-old] Aiden Aslin. We did the defence in the framework of a criminal case initiated by a military investigation. I repeat, within the framework of the russian case, they were interrogated as suspects either under the 356th (the use of prohibited means and methods of warfare. - "AU"), or under the 359th (mercenarism. - "AU") of the Criminal Code of the Russian Federation; one of two things. But the russian investigation did not conduct any other investigative actions against these servicemen, these mercenaries, except for interrogations. Which took place on the territory of the DPR Prosecutor General's Office and where Pinner, Saadun and Aslin were suspects. There were actually very long interrogations, for the whole night – from 10 pm to 5 am. Then all the materials were transferred to the DPR Prosecutor's Office. And the further investigation was already DPR's – and the defenders too. Therefore, we did not speak in the DPR court.

I want to highlight the last two sentences - And the further investigation was already DPR's – and the defenders too. Therefore, we did not speak in the DPR court. So it turns out they actually weren't those who were defended the accused in DPR court. What was their role then? Manyareasexpert (talk) 08:44, 14 July 2022 (UTC)

To a native English speaker, the phrase "And the further investigation was already DPR's - and the defenders too" is a bit confusing. The previous information suggests that the Russian military conducted the initial interrogations, at which the lawyers were present, then forwarded the information to the DPR prosecutor.

My reading of the lawyer's statement is that he is qualifying his representation of the Moroccan defendant as solely "within the context of the Russian investigation," that is he did not represent Saadoun once the Russians released him to DPR custody. This suggests to me that the Russians provided lawyers to the defendants to comply with Russian, not Ukrainian, law (to ensure their interrogations were valid under international law and thus not tainted by unfairness to the defendant). It also suggests the Russians regard everything that occurs afterward (i.e., the trial itself) to be a DPR matter with which they have no real concern.

The criminal law of the DPR is based upon the pre-2014 law of Ukraine. The article suggests that the rights of the accused were largely respected during the preliminary investigation stage. However, a 1993 analysis of Ukrainian criminal law states as follows:

At trial, the accused has the right: a) to make a motion on decline; b) to have legal counsel or act as his own defense lawyer; c) to make motions and express an opinion on motions of other participants of the trial; d) to ask the court to include case documents, summon witnesses, employ forensic research and obtain other evidence; e) to provide his explanations at any moment of judicial investigation; f) to ask questions of other suspects, witnesses, forensic experts, and the victim(s); g) to participate in overview of the crime scene and documents; h) to participate inthe court's debates if he/she is not legally represented.

Assistance to the accused. The counselor may be contracted or assigned to represent a defendant at trial. Usually, the defense counselor is chosen by the accused or the accused's relatives. If the defendant does not have the money to pay a counselor, the investigator, procurator, judge, or chair of a law firm may partially or completely release the defendant from payment obligations for legal assistance.

In situations where the case legally requires a counselor to participate in a trial, but the defendant or his relatives have not contracted for one, the investigator or the court could assign one through a law firm. The cost for this defense counselor is born by the state, although the accused might be required to reimburse the state at a later time.

Legal counsel is also required in cases involving minors and persons who because of their physical or mental disabilities cannot exercise their right for defense; persons accused of capital crimes; or when the procurator participates at trial. (Clause 45).

Defense counselors include admitted attorneys, representatives of trade unions and other non-profit organizations for cases with participation of their members, persons chosen by the judge, or persons whom the defendant and/or nearest relatives trust to defend his interests. There is no legal limit as to how many counselors can simultaneously be involved in the accused's defense.

-- So, my understanding is that the article confirms that the Russians provided lawyers to the accused during the interrogations, which made the interrogations valid evidence for use thereafter. But there is nothing in the articles that suggest the DPR provided assistance to the accused during the actual trial. Is that your understanding of the article as well?Nicosa77 (talk) 18:54, 14 July 2022 (UTC)

It appears so, given the poor factology of the sources.

Google translate works pretty well and if you need to clarify something please let me know. Manyareasexpert (talk) 18:26, 15 July 2022 (UTC)

Status

Article incorrectly states (without cite) he was taken as a prisoner of war. That is inaccurate. He was taken as a combatant and tried as a mercenary. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Nicosa77 (talk • contribs) 00:53, 11 July 2022 (UTC)

Saved text

who previously fought with the Kurdish People's Defense Units (YPG) militia in Rojava, northern Syria, where he fought against the Islamic State. His nom de guerre was "Rojhat Rojava" and he served in the Lions of Rojava group which is a part of the YPG. In 2018 he travelled to Ukraine and enlisted in the Armed Forces of Ukraine. 04:41, 12 July 2022 (UTC)

References

Execution

I have read that he and other two mercenaries got executed by firing squad. Donetsk People’s Republic authorities don’t show any video of execution. Does someone know is he is still alive or he is dead? 95.232.128.73 (talk) 22:53, 29 July 2022 (UTC)

• I couldn't find anything other than dubious tweets talking about his execution, so for now we'll assume he's alive. Kleinpecan (talk) 23:12, 29 July 2022 (UTC)

Not a dual citizen yet

The BBC may have inaccurately reported that he has Ukrainian citizenship, but he himself stated in his interview with Graham Phillips that he doesn't. He said he is in the process of applying for it, which is not the same thing as having it. I won't even bother to correct the text, seeing as all Wikipedia articles are guarded by a coterie of antifa leftists who aren't interested in the truth. He is NOT a Ukrainian citizen. 2A00:23C8:A7A3:4801:733E:646C:63DA:CF9D (talk) 06:27, 31 July 2022 (UTC)

The Kyiv Post reports today (April 24th 2023) that he is not a Ukrainian citizen. " Despite his veteran status, Aslin is not yet a citizen of Ukraine, which he would like. “I’m in the process of becoming a Ukrainian citizen, however it’s currently frozen since I cannot travel to Ukraine,” he says." See https://www.kyivpost.com/post/16201 It is weird that someone keeps on reverting to misreporting on this matter. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2A00:23C8:A7A3:4801:733E:646C:63DA:CF9D (talk) 10:46, 24 April 2023 (UTC)

Return to combat?

It looks like Mr.Aslin is back in the AFU from recent combat footage in Ukraine. If this is true, it should be added. Edweirdo the k (talk) 15:41, 10 March 2023 (UTC)

Sources needed. Manyareasexpert (talk) 16:28, 10 March 2023 (UTC)

Mild POV tone issues

The article as currently written uses POV language at various points. RadioactiveBoulevardier (talk) 20:59, 20 June 2023 (UTC)

Could you indicate where so we can improve the article? BeŻet (talk) 16:34, 27 July 2023 (UTC)

New source - abc.net.au

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2023-07-20/aiden-aslin-russian-propaganda-ukraine-prisoner-of-war-730/102611406 somebody please add to the article Manyareasexpert (talk) 21:44, 20 July 2023 (UTC)