Talk:Athanasius III of Constantinople

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Gidulyanov, Pavel Vasilyevich[edit]

  • You wrote: "non-authoritive source of a "scientific atheist", which is pseudoscientific, there was no indulgency in Russia... also there was no Ukraine back then..." This is not true.

Gidulyanov, Pavel Vasilyevich was not a scientific atheist.

ru:Гидулянов, Павел Васильевич (12 (24) сентября 1874 — 17 октября 1937) — русский советский педагог-правовед, ординарный профессор и декан юридического факультета Московского университета. ((September 12 (24), 1874 - October 17, 1937) - Russian Soviet legal educator, ordinary professor and dean of the law faculty of Moscow University.)......

20 августа 1937 года арестован по обвинению в том, что «в 1933 г. организовал и возглавил в Алма-Ате антисоветскую монархическую террористически-повстанческую организацию церковников»; 17 октября 1937 года Особой тройкой УНКВД Казахской ССР по Алма-Атинской области был приговорен к расстрелу и в тот же день в окрестностях Алма-Аты вместе с епископом Тихоном (Шараповым) и другими обвиняемыми был расстрелян. Реабилитирован в 1958 году. (On August 20, 1937, he was arrested on charges that “in 1933 he organized and headed the anti-Soviet monarchist terrorist-insurgent organization of clergy in Alma-Ata”; On October 17, 1937, the Special Troop of the UNKVD (U - управление (administration) NKVD) of the Kazakh SSR in the Alma-Ata region was sentenced to death and on the same day in the suburbs of Alma-Ata together with Bishop Tikhon (Sharapov) and other defendants were shot. Rehabilitated in 1958.)


In the Orthodox Encyclopedia, which can not be suspected of atheism, it is written:

«ГИДУЛЯНОВ, Павел Васильевич (12.09.1874, Пятигорск - 17.10.1937, Алма-Ата), специалист по церковному праву (GIDULYANOV Pavel Vasilyevich (09/12/1874, Pyatigorsk - 10/17/1937, Alma-Ata), an expert in church law.)....


Г. (Гидулянов) опубликовал в изд-ве «Атеист» брошюры, из к-рых, несмотря на их одиозные названия, можно было получить сведения о происхождении колоколов, церковного звона, о богослужении и т. п. (G. (Gudulianov) published in the Atheist publishing house brochures from which, despite their odious names, it was possible to obtain information about the origin of the bells, the church bells, the divine service, and so on.)»


Even the Orthodox Encyclopedia recognizes Gidulyanov as a major scholar in the field of church law. Wlbw68 (talk) 10:26, 26 February 2019 (UTC)[reply]

Indulgence in Russia[edit]

Tomcat7 wrote: "there was no indulgency in Russia" Was there an indulgence in Russia? - Yes, of course it was.

ИНДУЛЬГЕНЦИИ В ИСТОРИИ ГРЕЧЕСКОЙ ЦЕРКВИ (INDULGENCES IN THE HISTORY OF THE GREEK CHURCH), author of the article: Sergey Govorun — Archimandrite Cyril (in the world Sergey Nikolayevich Govorun; born on January 28, 1974, Zolotonosha, Cherkasy region, Ukrainian SSR ) - priest of the Ukrainian Orthodox Church (Moscow Patriarchate), archimandrite, candidate of theology, Ph.D. publicist, professor at Loyola Marymount University in Los Angeles, senior lecturer at the Stockholm School of Theology; In the past - a researcher at Yale and Columbia Universities (USA).

Greek bishops used to come to Ukraine and Russia, where they were trading with indulgences. Indulgences of the 16-17th century in Russian are preserved as documents!Wlbw68 (talk) 14:24, 26 February 2019 (UTC)[reply]


Article «Indulgence» in the Orthodox Encyclopedia:

«В качестве довода в пользу индульгенции католические богословы и историки часто указывают их распространение не только на Западе, но и на Востоке. Действительно, начиная с XVI века православные христиане греческой Церкви довольно широко, хотя и не официально в покаянной практике использовали «разрешительные грамоты» (греч. συγχωροχάρτια), во многом схожие с индульгенциями (см.: Говорун. 2001). Статус офиц. церковного документа эти грамоты получают на Константинопольском Соборе 1727 г., постановление которого гласит: «Оставление грехов в письменной форме, которое Восточная Христова Церковь именует «разрешительными грамотами», а латиняне - «индульгенциями»… дается Христом в святой Церкви. Эти разрешительные грамоты выдаются во всей Соборной Церкви четырьмя святейшими патриархами: Константинопольским, Александрийским, Антиохийским и Иерусалимским» (Говорун. 2001. С. 46). Практика использования «разрешительных грамот» просуществовала в Греции до середины ХХ в. С XIII по XVII в. она применялась и на Руси.» — «As an argument in favor of indulgences, Catholic theologians and historians often point out their distribution not only in the West, but also in the East. Indeed, starting from the 16th century, Orthodox Christians of the Greek Church rather extensively, although not officially in penitential practice, used “permits” (Greek συγχωροχάρτια), in many ways similar to indulgences (see: Govorun. 2001). The status of an official ecclesiastical document is obtained at the Council of Constantinople in 1727, the resolution of which reads: “Writing of sins in writing, which the Eastern Church of Christ calls“ permissive letters ”, and the Latin people“ indulgences ”... is given by Christ in the holy Church. These permits are issued throughout the Catholic Church by the four holiest patriarchs: Constantinople, Alexandria, Antioch, and Jerusalem ”(Govorun. 2001, p. 46). The practice of using "permits" existed in Greece until the middle of the twentieth century. From XIII to XVII century, it was used in Russia.»Wlbw68 (talk) 15:29, 26 February 2019 (UTC)[reply]

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