Talk:Blind Tom Wiggins

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Untitled[edit]

This article doesn't even mention what instrument Tom Wiggins plays! Drums? Tuba? Harmonica?

Note-It has stated it was piano for awhile now, the above was an old message by an anonymous person.--T. Anthony 06:42, 5 February 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Posthumous comments[edit]

Critic Harold C. Schonberg stated in his book The Great Pianists that according to him Tom was simply an overrated child who could only play back certain tunes on the piano. His owner was also mentioned as Perry H. Oliver. Schonberg says that is the result of American naiveness at the time, including the White House's.(The Great Pianists, pages 201-202)

Hype?[edit]

In The Great Pianists, Harold C. Schonberg says that most of Blind Tom's supposed abilities did not really exist and were based on hype (Schonberg says something like "he could not do half the things people claimed"). He references statements by trained musicians saying that all Blind Tom could really do was hear a piece and play it back, "after a fashion," on the piano. Schonberg also notes that professional pianists in Europe (I forget who) verified Blind Tom's possession of absolute pitch, but nothing else. The WP article records these claims as if they were true and does not even note skepticism about them from Schonberg or others. Does anybody else have references to the contrary, or should the article be revised to reflect the skeptical view?

Hype? I think so[edit]

The gist of Schonberg's page on Blind Tom is that people without a clue about music judged Tom to be a remarkable talent, and that "qualified musical observers wrote in [to Dwight's Journal of Music] [making] it clear that the boy could not do a fiftieth of the things credited to him. As a matter of fact, he could not do anything except play back a few tunes he knew". Schonberg goes on to mention that Halle and Moscheles (trustworthy experts of the time) said that Blind Tom was judged to have absolute pitch when he visited England in 1866. But that's about it.

The article as it stands gives a distorted view of Blind Tom's life and significance. Instead of a remarkable musical prodigy, it seems he was more a pathetic curiosity for the racist and ignorant audiences he appeared before. Art Tatum was a musical genius and jazz piano super-virtuoso first, and a blind Black man second. It is no benefit to the estimation of Black musicians to exaggerate the talent of the poor, exploited, Blind Tom. --AlkanSite 03:24, 25 October 2006 (UTC)[reply]

But perhaps the racism is on the other foot. Maybe people who dismissed his talent didn't like the idea of such ability in a black man, especially a mentally deficient one. His reputed abilities are certainly not unbelievable, witness Leslie Lemke. 70.246.118.162 (talk) 00:58, 14 December 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Hype? I do not think so[edit]

In my judgment this entry is accurate. Actually we have a lot of reliable information on Tom, but still some questions exist. The books by Professor Geneva Handy Southhall (she taught at the University of Minnesota) are well documented and reflect a lifetime of study on Tom. I have read one of her books and many articles on Tom (and have also published one article on him in an academic journal). A lot of material exists and Professor Southhall's collection of material on Tom is very extensive. There is no question judging from the existing documents that he was multitalented. The only instrument he played, as far as I recall, was the piano. He also composed. He performed before many thousands and his work was evaluated by many experts. Many of their reports are still available, as are the reviews by those who attended his concerts. He was, judging from these many reports, clearly an enormous music talent. I reviewed Harold C. Schonberg's one page section in his book The Great Pianists and must conclude that it is not a reliable source. One of several examples is Tom's "owner" was not Perry H. Oliver as he claimed, although Perry did work with Tom. His "owner" was in fact a Mr. Bethune. Such basic mistakes (and there are many) lead me to conclude that Schonberg, who is not an academic, is not a reliable source. He gives no evidence of any research on Tom in primary sources. For this reason I would ignore all of the claims made on the basis of this source. Indeed, I have no idea where he got his material from as I have never come across his majors claims and I have a thick folder of scholarly articles on Tom . I would need some documentation before I give Schonberg's claims any credibility. If anyone has such, I would be glad to review it.

Oh?[edit]

With all due respect, the section headed "Professional Career" only shows one source. This doesn't make the section's claims any stronger than you claim Schonberg's to be.dr-t 19:19, 3 September 2016 (UTC)dr-t — Preceding unsigned comment added by Dr-t (talk • contribs)

Perry H. Oliver and "Blind Tom"[edit]

“Weekly Sumter Republican” Americus, Georgia August 12, 1871 “Death of P.H. Oliver”


“It is our sad office this morning to chronicle the death of Mr. Perry H. Oliver, at his residence in this city, about noon last Sunday, the 6th inst. He was buried at Oak Grove Cemetery on the afternoon of last Monday, the funeral and burial services being conducted by Dr. G.F. Cooper, of the Baptist Church.

“The large company of friends present to perform the last kindly offices, attested the high esteem in which Mr. Oliver was held by the citizens of this place and now the bereavements of his family is felt and regarded as a great affliction common to the whole city.

“For about seventeen years Mr. Oliver had been a valued member of this community, liberal, public-spirited, generous and enterprising. He had always been a popular man, and soon after his removal to our city, was honored with the office of Mayor by the vote of our people, having been elected the first Mayor of Americus.

“At one time of his life, Mr. Oliver was known throughout the world as the owner and exhibitor of the wonderful musical boy, Blind Tom, whom he first brought before the public in America and carried on a tour throughout Europe.

“Especially was he the friend of young men, ever ready to speak to them a kind word to cheer and to aid them, and generous and free in rendering them support in their endeavors and encouragement and assistance in their enterprises and efforts. We are sure there are not a few of these in our city to whom his cherished memory will always be a pleasant and a grateful recollection, and from whose hearts, now made shadowy by the gloom of this death, there comes forth the whispered and fervent good-bye: “Peace to his honored ashes.”

Mr. Oliver was born in the city of Macon, and was about forty-five years of age, and seemed from his find and robust appearance to have a long lease of days yet before him for usefulness and enjoyment; but suddenly and unexpectedly he has fallen by the blade of the unswerving reaper.

“His family has the heartfelt sympathy and condolences of the host of friends who honored and esteemed him in life, and now sincerely mourn him gone from them and this world forever.”

Transcribed by Alan Anderson, archivist, Sumter Historic Trust, Inc., Americus, Georgia —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 68.217.195.99 (talk) 23:16:45, August 18, 2007 (UTC)

reformatted as block quote--Da Stressor 21:34, 4 October 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Move page?[edit]

Is there a specific reason the page is titled "Blind Tom Wiggins" instead of "Thomas Wiggins"? Should the page be moved? Theadamgaskins (talk) 03:10, 10 May 2011 (UTC)[reply]

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Water in the Moonlight[edit]

--Frenouille (talk) 10:43, 14 April 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Wiki Education assignment: 19th Century Concert Life[edit]

This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 17 January 2023 and 12 May 2023. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): Kay1lovely (article contribs).

— Assignment last updated by Jmares3218 (talk) 03:40, 12 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Greene surname[edit]

What was the origin of the Greene surname? Was he believed to have been fathered by a slaveowner named Greene? I ask simply because Bethune's daughter Cherry married CSA Major Cornelius Boyle after his first wife (Greene, well connected in the CSA) had died and Boyle had begun listing himself immediately as a musician in the 1870 census despite no sign of any musical inclination whatsoever...except some level of relationship with Cherry Bethune that culminated in an 1877 marriage. IronicCaptchaToday (talk) 20:52, 9 July 2023 (UTC)[reply]

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