Talk:Borrowed scenery

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Untitled[edit]

I intended to just add some linguistic information into this article, but it needed lots of cleanup. If anybody is familiar with the Picturesque Style, would you please help rewrite the last section? Keahapana (talk) 02:28, 21 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Cleanup and Expansion[edit]

I was bold and moved this article from "Shakkei and the picturesque", a title no one would ever search for or link to, to the far more common and straightforward "borrowed scenery". I have done a little to bring a more worldwide view (i.e. not just Japan) into the intro sentence, and added the East Asian languages template, to represent the different ways this term is pronounced in different languages.

A lot of work needs to be done to expand this out to cover the Chinese, Korean, and Vietnamese (and other?) applications of this concept, not just the Japanese, and the Korean and Vietnamese words need to be added to the language template at the top.

I am no expert on this subject, especially not on the non-Japanese aspects/versions of it, and so I apologize for leaving it in this half-done state, and implore anyone with an interest and an expertise to contribute whatever you can. Thank you. LordAmeth (talk) 17:15, 31 July 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Hi LordAmeth, and thanks for your edits. I agree that "Borrowed scenery" is a better title but I'm not sure if the East Asian languages template is needed. I can't find any Vietnamese usages of 借景, all of the Chinese and Korean examples I find refer to Japanese shakkei. I wrote that "The Chinese counterpart of shakkei (借景) is jiejing (借景)" paragraph, but this word jiejing is extremely rare. It's apparently not listed in any large Chinese-Chinese or Chinese-English dictionaries. The only exception seems to be the Chinese expression jiejing shengqing 借景生情, which is included in the Dai Kan-Wa Jiten (p. 839, with Chinese pronunciation but not on'yomi) and Hanyu Da Cidian (p. 1451). I wonder if it would be better to remove the template and change the lead sentence to something like "Borrowed scenery (from Japanese shakkei 借景 "borrow/lend scenery") is … ". What do you think? Best wishes, Keahapana (talk) 02:03, 5 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Well, that's interesting. I didn't think that it was originally or exclusively a Japanese concept. The Wikipedia article on Chinese gardens indicates that one of the essential elements is "borrowed scenery", so I assumed it was just as prominent a concept in Chinese gardens as in Japanese, and that therefore it might be a prominent concept in Korea and Vietnam as well. I guess I was wrong. Please make whatever changes you feel are appropriate, including getting rid of the languages template, if you think it unnecessary. Thank you. LordAmeth (talk) 02:13, 5 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I changed the lead and deleted the infobox. Do you think the Globalize tag should be removed? What about the above WikiProject China, Korean, and Vietnam? Thanks. Keahapana (talk) 20:48, 5 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I'm still fairly certain that this concept must play some role in Chinese culture at least, if not Korean and Vietnamese as well. I recognize that the globalize tag is a tad unsightly, but I see no harm in keeping the WikiProject banners. If we're lucky, they'll attract the attention of editors who can add to the Chinese/Korean/Vietnamese applications/versions of the concept. Thanks for your efforts. LordAmeth (talk) 02:24, 6 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Wikiproject Korea[edit]

I have absolutely no idea why this is part of Wikiproject Korea. Therefore, I have deleted the banner. For example, if the idea of Borrowed scenery is taking the mountain into one's backyard, Korea embraced more the idea of placing oneself in the mountain (referenced from 먼 나라 이웃나라, a well known educational comic book about 10 nations in the world and their history, including Germany, Japan, Korea itself, the US, England, and France.)

Proposed Merge[edit]

Somebody created a new article Borrowing of scenery ("shakkei") which aligns pretty clearly with this article. Another editor put a merge tag on Borrowing of scenery ("shakkei") but didn't complete the job, which I am doing now. PK T(alk) 13:58, 12 December 2015 (UTC)[reply]

I Support merging these articles. PK T(alk) 13:58, 12 December 2015 (UTC)[reply]
Support - just stumbled across this. While I have no expertise to give to WikiProject architecture, I can say the two articles are almost obviously about the same topic. DaltonCastle (talk) 01:30, 31 December 2015 (UTC)[reply]