Talk:Coon song

A fact from Coon song appeared on Wikipedia's Main Page in the Did you know column on 17 May 2007. The text of the entry was as follows:

Did you know... that racist coon songs (sheet music book pictured) paved the way for popular acceptance of ragtime music?

A record of the entry may be seen at Wikipedia:Recent additions/2007/May.

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Untitled[edit]

May sound controversial but there is nothing beyond a blanket statement that explains how these songs were racist (examples from lyrics, or the like). If someone is to write "such and such is racist" then there should also be an explanation of why or how this fits, otherwise it's hardly encyclopedic.stan goldsmith 02:02, 17 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Kinda puts gangsta rap in a new light, doesn't it? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.73.70.113 (talk) 04:42, 12 May 2010 (UTC)[reply]

new category needed[edit]

'Category: interesting articles that make you want to vomit' Decora (talk) 23:56, 6 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]

No mention of the late 1820s-to-1830s song "Zip Coon"[edit]

"Zip Coon" was a popular song featured at minstrel shows starting the late 1820s that white blackface performers used to caricature free black men who were trying to fit in with upper class white society.

http://www.npr.org/sections/codeswitch/2014/05/11/310708342/recall-that-ice-cream-truck-song-we-have-unpleasant-news-for-you

71.93.120.216 (talk) 20:14, 13 August 2015 (UTC)RandomRacialSlurResearcher[reply]

Etymology[edit]

I am little doubtful about the Whigs and raccoon etymology. When arriving in English speaking New World colonies, slaves were held in large dormitories called baracoons (similar to barracks). This term was around well before the 1830s. Haitians on H2A visas are still detained overnight in a similar fashion.14.202.248.58 (talk) 00:14, 6 December 2015 (UTC)[reply]

I consulted a few standard reference works and was suprised to not find any thoughts about the term's derivation. Can someone suggest some sources? - kosboot (talk) 13:58, 6 December 2015 (UTC)[reply]

There is some belief that the term came from the Protuguese word "barracoon", a word used to describe the rough enclosure black slaves were kept in upon arrival in Brazil and Cuba. It is derrived from the Portuguese "barraco" (shack), from which the English word "barracks" also derrives. ("barraco" to "barracoon" to "'coon", to "coon) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.95.43.253 (talk) 01:14, 21 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]

I second the need for a Zip Coon reference[edit]

As pointed out above, the song "Zip Coon" is too important to the history of the topic to not feature in this article in a major way. Why is it left out? Could not a source to use as a reference be found? Also, including a section on Zip Coon will necessitate rewriting the section on the term's Etymology. Using the phrase "coon" to parody free blacks pre-dates the formation of the Whig Party. ShelbyMarion (talk) 03:25, 20 April 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Irving Berlin and "Coon Songs"[edit]

Not all sources appear to agree that Irving Berlin wrote "coon songs", at least not as defined in this article. In fact, I found a source that purports Berlin's work help to deconstruct the coon song by applying the stereotypes found in those songs to a general subject. The article by music historian Jurgen Kloss is here: http://www.justanothertune.com/html/berlin-rhythmicballads.html

SunriseEarth (talk) 09:29, 18 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

"Extremely racist"[edit]

I've now reverted (twice) this wording, that describes coon songs in the opening sentence as "extremely racist". While that is unquestionably true in terms of modern thinking, they were a product of their times and I'm unsure whether that wording is supported by most sources that discuss them. What are other editors' views? Ghmyrtle (talk) 08:21, 27 September 2020 (UTC)[reply]

I agree. Applying modern moral judgement to a historical genre, out of context, as it were, would seem to violate the Wikipedia stricture to avoid POV in articles. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.95.43.253 (talk) 01:17, 21 November 2020 (UTC)[reply]