Talk:Deafheaven

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Two interviews[edit]

Just saving two interviews here that I might want to use in the future.[1][2] Fezmar9 (talk) 17:37, 16 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Genre switching[edit]

I guess this is going to be as persistent and tedious as it is on any other page. The latest edit has "black metal" back. I think we've had "rock", "metal" and "post-black metal" recently too. Genres are pretty subjective things: there is no right or wrong answer, and if you want to say "rely on sources", different sources will use varying terms at different times, so that doesn't always get a clear answer. Surely it would make sense to have whatever term is the broadest, clearest and least controversial for the very first description. That would seem to me to be "metal". They are undoubtedly a metal band, and that's the term under which most publications will file their features and reviews on the band. Black metal is surely both too precise and ultimately inaccurate: there is a real issue about whether they fall within that sub-genre as traditionally understood, and the band themselves reject the label. "Rock", although not inaccurate, seems too broad. The sub-sub-genres "post-black metal" or "blackgaze" are pretty niche and esoteric terms that are rarely seen or heard. They could be mentioned in any more detailed debate about the band's sound, but they don't seem to help the average reader much as a primary description. N-HH talk/edits 14:17, 19 September 2016 (UTC)[reply]

I agree with User:N-HH that just using "metal" makes sense. Bartash (talk) 15:42, 19 September 2016 (UTC)[reply]

External links modified[edit]

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I checked the change Bartash (talk) 17:48, 9 December 2016 (UTC)[reply]

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Post-black metal[edit]

I think this is a worthy addition to the genre list, as they are a pioneer of the movement, and several sources (such as these [1][2]) that state that they are this. SuperLuigi22 (talk|contribs) 03:05, 6 January 2018 (UTC)[reply]

References

  1. ^ Colin Kauffman (November 10, 2016). "Promises Kept: How Oathbreaker Have Raised The Bar for Post-Black Metal". Retrieved November 25, 2017.
  2. ^ Joe Sansone. "DEAFHEAVEN PROVE WHY THEY'RE LEADING THE POST-BLACK METAL PACK". Retrieved November 25, 2017.

Lead[edit]

Can we cone to a consensus that they are indeed a post-metal band, considering that all of their albums have been labeled under Blackgaze with their first being the only not labeled under Post-metal. I personally think post-metal is a nice lead but people tend to differ on how specific leads are and brtoader leads are typically used for more well known acts. Dekai Averett (talk) 07:35, 19 January 2018 (UTC)[reply]

I think for a band that is famous precisely for combining very different genres, and whose status as belonging entirely to any one of them is controversial, there is no harm in leaving the lead genre blank.--MASHAUNIX 15:25, 1 August 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Addition of screamo[edit]

I understand this is a term that people usually associate with people who have no idea what they're talking about, but it is a real genre and Deafheaven feature elements very commonly attributed to screamo, it's even cited in www.treblezine.com/20809-blurred-lines-evolution-of-genre/ music.avclub.com/deafheaven-sunbather-1798177040. Issan Sumisu (talk) 16:55, 30 May 2018 (UTC)[reply]
I'm up to debate it, but I think screamo is a bad label for the band used by people that think screamed vocals = screamo. Screamo is an emo subgenre, and I could sort of get the label if Deafheaven were metalcore or something else influenced by hardcore punk, but blackgaze is pretty far from anything to do with screamo. AM Woody (talk) 16:25, 25 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]
The context of these sources aren't using it in that way though, as they're comparing them to bands generally considered real screamo like Envy. Issan Sumisu (talk) 18:04, 25 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]
I understand this. While I don't know Envy, it seems like they started off as a standard screamo band, then incorporated more post-rock and shoegaze elements in (https://pitchfork.com/reviews/albums/heaven-in-her-arms-white-halo/), so it would make sense that Deafheaven can be compared to them, however I would hesitate to label Deafheaven as screamo because of this association, as the association seems more towards the post-rock sounds with screaming than the screamo genre itself. In Deafheaven's case they have always been more closely associated with Black Metal/Post-metal, and the sound that Alcest developed (Blackgaze), instead of starting off under the screamo subgenre like Envy did. At the end of the day, it doesn't matter too much (subgenres in metal are beyond a mess), I think that the label perpetuates the idea that screamed vocals = screamo. Maybe Post-screamo would be a better label? AM Woody (talk) 14:21, 27 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]
I can't seem to find any sources referring to the band as post-screamo, despite www.vice.com/en_us/article/r7py5q/city-of-caterpillar-retrospective drownedinsound.com/releases/18891/reviews/4149166 referencing the genres influence on the band, so including it would WP:Original Research. Part of this is definitely to do with how most outlets generally just don't differentiate between screamo and post-screamo, however because of this to call them post-screamo is unsourced. Personally, I'm not sure that having this band referenced as screamo would perpetuate that screamed vocals is screamo as their relationship to real screamo seems fairly well cited. Issan Sumisu (talk) 14:46, 29 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]
I think there is a case to be made for both inclusion and exclusion. The two sources cited do not call the band's sound screamo, but suggest that it shows a strong influence of screamo. From Neurosis to Isis, post-metal has always had a strong link to post-hardcore; Deafheaven merely extend this more in the direction of black metal.--MASHAUNIX 09:37, 26 May 2020 (UTC)[reply]
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