Talk:December 2015 storm system
Accuracy dispute[edit]
There's far too many systems involved in this article for it to be cohesive. El Niño does not produce storms, it's a factor that influences them. It's not a driving force at all. This article leads readers to believe the opposite is true and that all these global events are easily linked to each other when in reality they're separate meteorological events. Something similar to this was attempted several years back—Global storm activity of 2010—and promptly abandoned due to how overbearing and absurd it was. I don't have a quick way to fix this off the top of my head, but this is not the right road to travel down for an encyclopedia. ~ Cyclonebiskit (chat) 18:48, 30 December 2015 (UTC)
- There is already an article on the El Nino event; I wouldn't be entirely opposed to just getting rid of this article and putting some of the information in there. However, as you say, it shouldn't be in the same fashion as this article. United States Man (talk) 19:04, 30 December 2015 (UTC)
- Agreed. It's pure original research (not to mention wholly inaccurate) to group all these discrete storms, weather patterns, and temperature anomalies together as one "storm system". Aside from being a non-viable topic, the content itself is in very rough shape. "The low pressure storm systems [created] a cyclone-like storm [...] causing intense storms"? That's borderline gibberish. I appreciate what the authors are trying to do here—create an introduction to the tangible effects of El Nino, a complicated and often misunderstood phenomenon—but such an article needs to be borne of high-integrity, scientific sources. It looks like the initial concept had some merit, but the article's scope has since been expanded and diluted to the point of being unworkable. I think the best option is to develop the 2015–2016 El Niño event article further, and redirect this page there. – Juliancolton | Talk 20:27, 30 December 2015 (UTC)
- Except there's two things tying these all togther: the dates (all happening these last two weeks) and that we do have sourcing that says the same weather systems that caused the tornadoes and flooding in the US is what will cause the flooding in the UK and the high temperatures in the article. While El Nino is the overall driver, it is from a single low pressure system that this has all generally happened. --MASEM (t) 20:55, 30 December 2015 (UTC)
- Not even close. There are at least eight systems involved here for North America and Europe. Extratropical cyclones are complex and often break apart into multiple systems.
(1) The first system involved in this article pulled into Canada and dissipated near Greenland on December 26. (2) A frontal boundary from the first system spawned a separate low south of Greenland on December 26, ultimately merging with storm 5 listed below. (3) A completely separate storm, dubbed Storm Eva, formed off Atlantic Canada—well east of the first storm—and raced across the Atlantic, impacting the British Isles, before pulling north of Scandinavia. (4) A weak system developed behind Eva and impacted the British Isles on Christmas. (5) Yet another system developed from a frontal boundary extending from the third storm and it rapidly pulled north toward Iceland. (6) Another system over the southern United States developed behind the first system—originating from an upper-level low—and is presently a weakening system over the Great Lakes. (7) A lingering frontal boundary left behind by a combination of storms 1 and 2 led to the formation of another storm off the Mid-Atlantic States on December 28. This system exploded into what's now known as Storm Frank, which is presently over Iceland. (8) another system recently developed over the North Atlantic on the heels of Storm Frank.
At best, there are at least three "families" of storm complexes, with some having multiple degrees of separation from the original. It would be disgustingly inappropriate, meteorologically speaking, to just lump all of these storms into a single event and say they were the same. ~ Cyclonebiskit (chat) 21:46, 30 December 2015 (UTC)
- Not even close. There are at least eight systems involved here for North America and Europe. Extratropical cyclones are complex and often break apart into multiple systems.
- Except there's two things tying these all togther: the dates (all happening these last two weeks) and that we do have sourcing that says the same weather systems that caused the tornadoes and flooding in the US is what will cause the flooding in the UK and the high temperatures in the article. While El Nino is the overall driver, it is from a single low pressure system that this has all generally happened. --MASEM (t) 20:55, 30 December 2015 (UTC)
Just a quick note, when I created the article, it was directly as a result of news results of mass fatalities in storms in the US, it was a news story, and not intended to be a meteorologically accurate description of what's happening globally. I would have no objections at all to this article being deleted, please work hard to come to a decent solution, there's no need for the hyperbolic language ("disgustingly inappropriate" etc), just fix it. The Rambling Man (talk) 22:07, 30 December 2015 (UTC)