Talk:Flemish Hunting Deck

A fact from Flemish Hunting Deck appeared on Wikipedia's Main Page in the Did you know column on 31 May 2015 (check views). The text of the entry was as follows:

Did you know... that a set of cards had a police escort?

A record of the entry may be seen at Wikipedia:Recent additions/2015/May. The nomination discussion and review may be seen at Template:Did you know nominations/Flemish Hunting Deck.

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Rename?

The Hofjaren Jachtpakket is an acceptable name and probably simpler than the current one. Its German name is the Flämisches Jagdkartenspiel. Reproductions are often sold as "Flemish Hunting Deck". Similar articles about 15th century decks keep their native language names like the Ambraser Hofjagdspiel and the Hofamterspiel.--Countakeshi (talk) 15:40, 20 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

I am okay with that. When I named the article I just went with the description of the Museum as I did not find much coverage under the Dutch title. Crispulop (talk) 18:38, 20 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

I think "Flemish Hunting Deck" should be the title as it has the most hits on google. There are barely any sites that use the Dutch name.--Countakeshi (talk) 21:50, 20 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

That is maybe even better because it is in English. I see three names appear: Flemish Hunting Deck, the Hofjager Hunting Pack, or the Cloisters Pack. Crispulop (talk) 17:57, 21 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Wiki Education assignment: Medieval Art

This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 22 January 2024 and 17 May 2024. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): Moozicle (article contribs).

— Assignment last updated by Jackhoal (talk) 23:34, 14 February 2024 (UTC)[reply]

“Hofjaren Jachtpakket”?!

I am trying to get my head around whoever came up with the name “Hofjaren Jachtpakket” and what they meant by it. It is Dutch in form, but it does not make any real sense in Dutch. It rather feels as if someone, having heard the German term Hofjagdspiel (as in Ambraser Hofjagdspiel, which often occurs in discussions on this pack) and the English term ‘hunting pack’ (as in “Flemish Hunting Pack”, an alternative to “Flemish Hunting Deck”), conflated them and tried to translate the result into Dutch without knowing anything about Dutch playing card terminology. Pakket means ‘packet’ or ‘package’, as one in the mail, and has no relation to playing cards. The Dutch translation of ‘pack’ or ‘deck (of cards)’ is kaartspel, spel (kaarten) or stok (kaarten). And hofjaren, meaning ‘court years’, has no conceivable relation to playing cards, or to hunting.

So, I have googled a bit. The name seems to have first occurred in the news item from 12 May 2015 on NOS cited in the second reference. Now NOS is a proper and usually reliable journalistic source (main newscaster on Dutch public tv), but this is just a short news item on its website that doesn’t give any sources itself. The name “Hofjager Hunting Pack”, that Crispulop mentions above, seems to appear a few weeks to months earlier. That name makes some relevant sense, hofjager in Dutch means ‘court hunter’ or ‘court huntmaster’, which the knave of tethers clearly is, and the knaves of horns and collars may also be.

The most plausible idea I have come up with, is that a source for the NOS news item mentioned the “Hofjager Hunting Pack”. Possibly, the source did not speak Dutch, and pronounced hofjager somewhat ideosyncratically, possibly, the notes were taken somewhat hurriedly and later misread. In this way, hofjager turned into hofjaren. The writer of the news item wanted the name to be in Dutch; not having much knowledge of the subject of playing cards they did not realise that hofjaren made no sense in the context, and thought that jachtpakket was a useable translation of ‘hunting pack’ (I have only found it as an advertising term for a set of auxilliary equipment for hunters). This resulted in the bogus Dutch name that we got stuck with.

The proper fully Dutch version of “Hofjager Hunting Pack” would be Hofjager Jachtkaartspel. There being apparently no public, reliable source for this, it can of course not be introduced into the article. But the name “Hofjaren Jachtpakket’ is ridiculous and should not be given any further airtime. — Mithrennaith (talk) 05:15, 16 August 2024 (UTC)[reply]