Talk:Fort Walker

Request for help with editing

On July 7, 2022 Lt. Col. Jason P. Duffy will take over command of USAG Fort A.P. Hill. URL to follow.

Fort A.P. Hill now has an Explosive Ordnance Disposal Training Center:

The Explosive Ordnance Disposal Training Center was renamed on Nov. 6, 2013 to honor Capt. Jason T. McMahon, an EOD Soldier who was killed in action in Afghanistan on Sept. 5, 2010. McMahon was the company commander of the 744th Explosive Ordnance Disposal Company, 184th Explosive Ordnance Disposal Battalion at the time of his death.

URL: http://www.army.mil/article/114630/Fort_A_P__Hill_Explosive_Ordnance_Disposal_Training_Center_honors_a_fallen_hero/

Citation: McElroy, Bob. "Fort A.P. Hill Explosive Ordnance Disposal Training Center Honors a Fallen Hero." Online news article. Army.mil. U.S. Army, 06 Nov. 2013. Web. <http://www.army.mil/article/114630/Fort_A_P__Hill_Explosive_Ordnance_Disposal_Training_Center_honors_a_fallen_hero/>.

US Amy Asymmetric Warfare Group has opened the Asymmetric Warfare Training Center on Fort A.P. Hill:

The US Amy Asymmetric Warfare Group officially opened its $90.1 million Asymmetric Warfare Training Center on Jan. 24 2014. The complex features state-of-the art training and range facilities that support the AWG mission of rapid material and non-material solution development as well as adaptability and resiliency training. The 300-acre training complex includes a headquarters, barracks, administrative, training and maintenance facilities, an Urban Area, a 12-mile Mobility Range, an 800 meter Known Distance Range, a light demolitions range and an indoor range.

URL: http://www.army.mil/article/118796/Asymmetric_Warfare_Training_Center_opens_at_Fort_A_P__Hill/

Citation: McElroy, Bob. "Asymmetric Warfare Training Center Opens at Fort A.P. Hill." Online news article. Army.mil. U.S. Army, 24 Jan. 2014. Web. <http://www.army.mil/article/118796/Asymmetric_Warfare_Training_Center_opens_at_Fort_A_P__Hill/>.

Here are some excellent research references that could be posted on the page (MLA citation format):

URL:http://www.dtic.mil/cgi-bin/GetTRDoc?Location=U2&doc=GetTRDoc.pdf&AD=ADA544134

Citation: Morton, Marie B., Allan T. Morton, and Jerrell Blake, Jr., eds. Wealthy in Heart: Oral History of Life Before Fort A.P. Hill. Comp. Meg Green-Malvasi and Royce McNeal. FAIRFAX VA: PACIULLI SIMMONS AND ASSOCIATES LTD CULTURAL RESOURCES DIV, 2011. Print.

URL:http://www.aphill.army.mil/docs/history/HistoryOfFortAPHill.pdf

Citation: Payne, Richard C., Ph.D, and Theo M. Boland. History of Fort A.P. Hill. Ed. Gary W. Long. 22 May 1991. Condensed history of U.S. Army Garrison Fort A.P. Hill.

I placed a “Help me” call in order to gain some insight on how best to ask for help deleting resource materials. I am relatively sure the folks that answered my call did not have time to review the page to see that this article is not about Fort A.P. Hill. Should this illogical citation be removed?

"Fort A.P. Hill, Virginia". Office of Economic Adjustment. Retrieved 18 March 2013

Meisberger (talk) 12:31, 30 September 2014 (UTC)

Meisberger, Wikipedia:Contributing to Wikipedia will give you more advice, but to take your first example, the Explosive Ordnance Disposal Training Center. Before you add something in, you need to consider:

• How does it relate to the subject of article? What is the key information I need include for a reader of an encyclopaedia article? Is it a neutral account?
• Am I writing this in my own words (i.e. not plagiarising or "cut and pasting" from the source?)
• How are other items in the article referenced? What style are they using?

So... you might read the link you've included, and conclude that the key information is that there is an Explosive Ordnance Center, and that it is named after Capt. Jason T. McMahon; we don't know when the centre was first built though, and its renaming ceremony, although naturally important to the participants and the family involved, isn't necessarily a major historical event in and of itself. So you could edit the article and explain that:

"The Explosive Ordnance Disposal Training Center at the fort is named after Captain Jason McMahon, who died in Afghanistan in 2010."

You'd then want to reference it. The other webpages mentioned in the article use the following format:

{{cite web|title=Fort A.P. Hill History|url=http://www.aphill.army.mil/history.asp|publisher=U.S. Army|accessdate=18 March 2013}}

If you replaced these fields with your citation, you'd have:

{{cite web|title=Fort A.P. Hill Explosive Ordnance Disposal Training Center honors a fallen hero|url=http://www.army.mil/article/114630/Fort_A_P__Hill_Explosive_Ordnance_Disposal_Training_Center_honors_a_fallen_hero/|publisher=U.S. Army|accessdate=30 September 2014}}

Combine the two, putting "ref" tags around the citation, and you'll have:

The Explosive Ordnance Disposal Training Center at the fort is named after Captain Jason McMahon, who died in Afghanistan in 2010.<ref>{{cite web|title=Fort A.P. Hill Explosive Ordnance Disposal Training Center honors a fallen hero|url=http://www.army.mil/article/114630/Fort_A_P__Hill_Explosive_Ordnance_Disposal_Training_Center_honors_a_fallen_hero/|publisher=U.S. Army|accessdate=30 September 2014}}</ref>

Cut and paste that into the relevant bit of the article, press Save Page, and you're away. It'll appear on the final screen as:

The Explosive Ordnance Disposal Training Center at the fort is named after Captain Jason McMahon, who died in Afghanistan in 2010.

In terms of deleting a source, it's best to challenge it first and wait for a few days (as I've done with the bit you've highlighted above); if no-one comes forward to reference it properly, and you aren't sure the information is correct, then it is usually safe to delete it, explaining why in the edit summary. Hchc2009 (talk) 16:12, 30 September 2014 (UTC)

Using your code examples I created the following:

Construction of the Explosive Ordnance Disposal training center was completed in July 2011 with the first day of class being October 17, 2011. The Explosive Ordnance Disposal Training Center at the fort is named after Captain Jason McMahon, who died in Afghanistan in 2010.

The US Amy Asymmetric Warfare Group officially opened its $90.1 million Asymmetric Warfare Training Center on Jan. 24 2014. The 300-acre training complex includes a headquarters, barracks, administrative, training and maintenance facilities, an urban training area, a 12-mile mobility range, an 800 meter known distance range, a light demolitions range and an indoor shooting range.

I can't thank enough for your guidance! Meisberger (talk) 17:33, 3 October 2014 (UTC)

Happy to help! Hchc2009 (talk) 17:41, 3 October 2014 (UTC)

References

External links modified

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Possible illustrations for 25 August 2023

The redesignation is scheduled for 25 August 2023.

• File:Capsarius_(Trajansäule).jpg for role of combat support hospital
• 52nd Ohio Infantry Regiment service as female U.S. Army surgeon
• Mary Edwards Walker#American Civil War
• Geneva Medical College#Geneva Medical College of Hobart College. Served at 1st battle of Bull Run, etc in Mobile Army Surgical Hospital
• George Henry Thomas hired Dr. Walker to serve as surgeon in 1863, captured by Confederacy in 1864, released in a prisoner exchange
• Image of Dr. Walker from The Naming Commission -- the most viable choice She wore her MOH everyday after it was awarded

-- Ancheta Wis   (talk | contribs) 09:08, 18 August 2023 (UTC)

References

Requested move 25 August 2023

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: moved. Per consensus. (closed by non-admin page mover) – robertsky (talk) 12:49, 10 September 2023 (UTC)

---

• Fort A.P. Hill → Fort Walker
• Fort Walker → Fort Walker (disambiguation)

– Today 25 August 2023 is the Redesignation day when the new name becomes official. Ancheta Wis   (talk | contribs) 13:58, 25 August 2023 (UTC)— Relisting. —usernamekiran (talk) 13:53, 3 September 2023 (UTC)

Note: The latter part of move request is added to ask for a consensus if Fort A.P. Hill can take up the primary topic. NmWTfs85lXusaybq (talk) 04:42, 26 August 2023 (UTC)

(NmWTfs85lXusaybq is referring to "Fort Walker → Fort Walker (disambiguation)", which was added to the request in order to express all associated moves explicitly, since the existing disambiguation page would have to be moved in order for the first move to take place.) SilverLocust 💬 03:51, 27 August 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose. [Edit: No need to delay this further for my sake. S.L. 💬 03:54, 6 September 2023 (UTC)]
  Too soon. Per WP:NAMECHANGE and WP:COMMONNAME policy, we usually wait a while after the official name change to see that it has become the common name in independent sources. Plus, this would require WP:PRIMARYTOPIC to be satisfied, since there are two other articles of that name linked from Fort Walker, which is currently a disambiguation page that would need to be moved to Fort Walker (disambiguation) as part of this request. SilverLocust 💬 00:57, 26 August 2023 (UTC)
  • Really? The name has changed, and every other base that has been renamed was moved almost immediately, and reliable sources took it up from that point on. Are you expecting things to be different this time? See Fort Liberty, Fort Moore,, etc. Acroterion (talk) 01:08, 26 August 2023 (UTC)

    It doesn't have to be a long while afterwards, but Wikipedia does not just change article titles whenever something is renamed. I didn't make up WP:NAMECHANGE, I am just interested in applying it consistently whether the subject being renamed is a company, a city in India, or a fort in the United States. SilverLocust 💬 01:26, 26 August 2023 (UTC)

    Seems like process for process's sake to me. I think all the others were moved within a day or two, with no objection from anyone but the South-will-rise-again diehards. Acroterion (talk) 01:33, 26 August 2023 (UTC)

    That's bordering on incivility toward several editors at Talk:Fort Liberty#Requested move 3 June 2023 whom you are calling confederate sympathizers. SilverLocust 💬 01:39, 26 August 2023 (UTC)

    No, a little AGF would be appreciated, but it's not. It's borderline incivility aimed at the parade of IPs and vandals who have been trolling that range of renamed articles, which you've probably not seen. Acroterion (talk) 22:30, 28 August 2023 (UTC)

• Support. Oppose. Don't do this often, but in this case ready to get out of myself and go full bore IAR! Doc Walker is just one of those people who does that to me. NAMECHANGES is part of WP article titling policy, and I should not have to explain to an editor who's been here years longer than I have that WP policy represents the consensus of the Wikipedia community. (period) And the community says we wait until reliable sources routinely use the new name. (period) Consider this a gentle reminder, because I'm more of a Civility-will-rise-again diehard, myself. Ya'll stay healthy. <<< grin >>> P.I. Ellsworth , ed. ^{put'er there} 04:28, 27 August 2023 (UTC) 14:13, 3 September 2023 (UTC)
  • On a side note, been readin' up on the Doc for whom this place was renamed, and I like her! Here's hoping that sources start using this new name very quickly. Hats off to General Hill, for whom this fort was previously named, but Dr. Mary Walker certainly deserves to be remembered. Was a gutsy lady! P.I. Ellsworth , ed. ^{put'er there} 06:04, 27 August 2023 (UTC)

    Can't they honor the "Doc" up yonder where she came from? Why impose this on Virginians OR those who just love driving into Virginia, reading historical markers, etc.? ? ? I am 78 years old, and it has been "A. P. Hill" for as long as I can remember. 71.246.80.218 (talk) 14:59, 8 September 2023 (UTC)

They probably do honor her where she came from. Guess you'll have to take up the fort's renaming with the folks who did it. I understand where you're coming from, though. Not far behind you at 73, and I've seen many, many renamings of streets, forts and such in my lifetime. Some made sense to me and some didn't. Change doesn't always come easy. P.I. Ellsworth , ed. ^{put'er there} 15:12, 8 September 2023 (UTC)

• Support. Technically, yes, we should wait a month and let some more sources come in. But the odds of the new name not becoming the COMMONNAME in the media are basically zero. Stuff like military bases tends to follow "official" usage somewhat more closely, and when it doesn't, it's usually for some nickname rather than "the old official name." SnowFire (talk) 20:08, 28 August 2023 (UTC)
• Oppose instead use Fort Walker, Virginia -- 65.92.244.99 (talk) 05:28, 29 August 2023 (UTC)
• Support. The change is real, live, official and purposeful. The current name is misleading as such a place no longer exists. There are seven other bases serving as examples in Wikipedia. — Preceding unsigned comment added by A.Troubled.Middle-Aged.Man (talk • contribs) 02:58, 31 August 2023 (UTC)
• Support Not sure why this has to be so hard or so rule-bound - all of the others have long since been moved. It's not like this one's any different. Acroterion (talk) 13:57, 3 September 2023 (UTC)
• Support: Probably already the clear primary topic for this title, since the other places with this name no longer exist and don't seem to have been especially important. 3 kids in a trenchcoat (talk) 04:04, 5 September 2023 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.