Talk:George Butterworth

This is the talk page for discussing improvements to the George Butterworth article.
This is not a forum for general discussion of the article's subject.

Put new text under old text. Click here to start a new topic.
New to Wikipedia? Welcome! Learn to edit; get help.

Article policies

Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL

University of Oxford

	University of Oxford portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject University of Oxford, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of the University of Oxford on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.University of OxfordWikipedia:WikiProject University of OxfordTemplate:WikiProject University of OxfordUniversity of Oxford articles
???	This article has not yet received a rating on the project's importance scale.

Composers

This article is within the scope of the WikiProject Composers, a group of editors writing and developing biographical articles about composers of all eras and styles. The project discussion page is the place to talk about technical and editorial issues and exchange ideas. New members are welcome!ComposersWikipedia:WikiProject ComposersTemplate:WikiProject ComposersComposers articles

Classical music

This article is within the scope of WikiProject Classical music, which aims to improve, expand, copy edit, and maintain all articles related to classical music, that are not covered by other classical music related projects. Please read the guidelines for writing and maintaining articles. To participate, you can edit this article or visit the project page for more details.Classical musicWikipedia:WikiProject Classical musicTemplate:WikiProject Classical musicClassical music articles

Biography: Musicians / Military

	Biography portal This article is within the scope of WikiProject Biography, a collaborative effort to create, develop and organize Wikipedia's articles about people. All interested editors are invited to join the project and contribute to the discussion. For instructions on how to use this banner, please refer to the documentation.BiographyWikipedia:WikiProject BiographyTemplate:WikiProject Biographybiography articles
	This article is supported by WikiProject Musicians (assessed as Low-importance).
	This article is supported by the military biography work group (assessed as Low-importance).

Military history: Biography / British / European / World War I C‑class

This article is within the scope of the Military history WikiProject. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the project and see a list of open tasks. To use this banner, please see the full instructions.Military historyWikipedia:WikiProject Military historyTemplate:WikiProject Military historymilitary history articles

C

This article has been rated as C-class on the project's quality scale.

This article has been checked against the following criteria for B-class status:
Referencing and citation: criterion not met Coverage and accuracy: criterion met Structure: criterion met Grammar and style: criterion met Supporting materials: criterion met

Associated task forces:
/
	Military biography task force
	British military history task force
	European military history task force
	World War I task force

A fact from this article was featured on Wikipedia's Main Page in the On this day section on August 5, 2016.

Best known for[edit]

The default text for Butterworth seems to be "he is best known for his Shropshire Lad", or, as it is here, for "his works based on A. E. Housman's collection of poems", but is that still true? In his allmusic.com bio it is, "for his Shropshire Lad Rhapsody", which they list together with "The Banks of Green Willow" as highlights of his output. The rhapsody is based on the same folk melody as his "Loveliest of Trees" song and it is hard to say if the poem or the folk song were his main inspiration. Personally I wouldn't have known about him if it wasn't for his idyllic "Banks", with its breath-taking ending, and the fact that Vaughan Williams dedicated his London Symphony to him. Allmusic lists CD recordings for each of his 17 surviving works: there are just 5 CDs with the Bredon Hills song cycle, 7 with the Two English Idylls, 16 with the Rhapsody, 17 with the (6 song) Shropshire Lad song cycle (last one made in 2003), and 40 with the Banks of Green Willow. Won't most people these days more likely know him best or even only for the latter? Afasmit (talk) 14:05, 28 November 2008 (UTC)[reply]

I know him for the Vaughan Williams connection, and I suspect most persons who have heard of him do also. TheScotch (talk) 08:15, 30 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Anyway, this "best known for" phrase occurs throughout wikipedia and is rarely verifiable. I think it should be chucked--except in special cases. This is not a special case. TheScotch (talk) 05:40, 6 August 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Just to clarify Afasmit's comments above, Loveliest Of Trees is not based on a folk-song; it's original. The Shropshire Lad songs were written as one group of 11 songs, but published in two sets. The orchestral rhapsody came later, based on Loveliest of Trees and With Rue My Heart is Laden. The songs are some of the most frequently performed English art songs: there have been 11 recordings of all 11 of them, and a further 10 of the first set (Six Songs from A Shropshire Lad) only. There have been 14 recordings of the orchestral rhapsody [all figures as of 2012]Willowmusic (talk) 05:21, 31 July 2012 (UTC).[reply]

I have altered the first sentence to read: "...best known for the orchestral idyll The Banks of Green Willow and his song settings of A. E. Housman's poems from A Shropshire Lad". The possible confusion lies with A Shropshire Lad, which is the title of (1) a famous collection by Housman, (2) Butterworth's orchestral rhapsody, (3) the colloquial title of his best-known group of songs (strictly "Six songs from A Shropshire Lad") or (4) the colloquial name for the complete published Housman songs ("Eleven songs from A Shropshire Lad"). The new wording makes the link to Housman's poems more clear.Willowmusic (talk) 02:04, 3 August 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Service file[edit]

Sometime ago I photographed Butterworth's service file at The National Archives. The images can be found at http://www.flickr.com/photos/11226331@N05/sets/72157626145614787/ Obviously they don't meet WP:PRIMARY, but they might still be useful in some way. David Underdown (talk) 15:46, 5 July 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Sources[edit]

This article is in dire need of citation of sources. Most of the biographical information, such as the fact that he was a keen dancer, is unsourced. The entire introduction doesn't cite a single source. I feel it rather pointless to add a citation needed template after every sentence, so I'm mentioning it here instead. 129.1.199.13 (talk) 01:28, 31 October 2012 (UTC)[reply]

You are simply not correct. There are 21 different citations, several of them multiple citations, a total of 31. What is expected? This is a person of whom there have been only three biographies, most of the first being quoted in the second and third. Should we cite absolutely every possible fact? He was male - do we need that? However, I have added a further 22 citations, almost all to the premier biography. I have also cut down the introduction considerably, but I have not added any sources to that as I have been advised by an editor already that this is not necessary where the same fact is sourced in the main body.Willowmusic (talk) —Preceding undated comment added 10:34, 1 November 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Rediscovered song[edit]

A lost song by Butterworth has been rediscovered at the Bodleian Libraries: http://www.bodleian.ox.ac.uk/news/2016/dec-12

 --FeanorStar7 11:15, 22 December 2016 (UTC)