Talk:House of Silva

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Hoax

All of content of this article is a hoax. Mercedes Gusgus talk 20:23, 7 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Not all of it. It is a family. I stubbed it. Agricolae (talk) 20:33, 7 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Silva in Toledo

This new source is not talking about the founding of the Silva family. It is talking about the arcane politics of Toledo under Pedro the Cruel and the Trastamara. As such, when it says, "The first generation of the House of Silva was established in Toledo through Alfonso Tenorio de Silva . . . " It is not saying he was establishing (founding) the family. It is saying he established them in Toledo. As a family it had existed for about 200 years already by this time, and the first of the name in Toledo may be relevant to 15th century Toledo politics, but in the grand scheme of the family is of little importance. Agricolae (talk) 14:39, 20 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

And our content says "was founded in Toledo". If you have sources of earlier establishment, fine; or if you have sources that show that the source we are using or claim the article is making is incorrect, fine. Without that we state what the sources state. -- TRPoD aka The Red Pen of Doom 14:44, 20 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

It has been reworded so that it is not as easily read as "the initial establishment of the House". -- TRPoD aka The Red Pen of Doom 14:49, 20 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

There is more to WP:V than just blindly repeating text without taking its context into account. We state what the sources say, but we must actually figure out what they are saying. When it said they were "established in Toledo" it is referring to the family being established in Toledo, rather than to them being established in Toledo, and that is a big difference. Agricolae (talk) 15:21, 20 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

You are correct that I had started merely from the paragraph in the source starting "The first generation of the House of Silva was established in Toledo" and had not considered that there was any background in the contents before that line. -- TRPoD aka The Red Pen of Doom 16:25, 20 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Sources

This source says something about members of the Silva family being a long serving series of consuls for the Spanish Crown,^[1] Dont know enough to put it in appropriate context.

More stuff about the family and Toledo in international politics^[2]

a connection of the family to Joanna of Castile that I am not fluent enough in Spanish to translate^[3]

a family tree^[4]

References

^ Alimento, Antonella (2011). War, Trade and Neutrality: Europe and the Mediterranean in the Seventeenth and Eighteen Centuries. FrancoAngeli. pp. 258–. ISBN 9788856845143. Retrieved 20 May 2013.
^ Lynch, Hannah (1898). Toledo: The Story of an Old Spanish Capital. J. M. Dent & Company. pp. 310–. Retrieved 20 May 2013.
^ Balbina, Caviró y Martínez,. Las Casas Principales de los Silva, en Toledo. RAMHG. pp. 38–. Retrieved 20 May 2013.{{cite book}}: CS1 maint: extra punctuation (link) CS1 maint: multiple names: authors list (link)
^ Martz, Linda (2003). A network of converso families in early modern Toledo: assimilating a minority. University of Michigan Press. pp. 8–. ISBN 9780472112692. Retrieved 20 May 2013.

I have incorporated some of this, but we need to be a little careful - this Toledo group is just one branch of a much larger Portuguese family, and we don't want to give them undue weight. Agricolae (talk) 01:31, 28 May 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Even more sources

I found plenty of information about the House of Silva from this book: The Rosary Cantorial. Should it be included? 70.170.52.156 (talk) 06:38, 12 June 2013 (UTC)[reply]

[Alimento2011-1] Alimento, Antonella (2011). War, Trade and Neutrality: Europe and the Mediterranean in the Seventeenth and Eighteen Centuries. FrancoAngeli. pp. 258–. ISBN 9788856845143. Retrieved 20 May 2013.

[Lynch1898-2] Lynch, Hannah (1898). Toledo: The Story of an Old Spanish Capital. J. M. Dent & Company. pp. 310–. Retrieved 20 May 2013.

[Balbina-3] Balbina, Caviró y Martínez,. Las Casas Principales de los Silva, en Toledo. RAMHG. pp. 38–. Retrieved 20 May 2013.{{cite book}}: CS1 maint: extra punctuation (link) CS1 maint: multiple names: authors list (link)

[Martz2003-4] Martz, Linda (2003). A network of converso families in early modern Toledo: assimilating a minority. University of Michigan Press. pp. 8–. ISBN 9780472112692. Retrieved 20 May 2013.

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