Talk:Jay Scott (saxophonist)

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Requested move 27 November 2022[edit]

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: Moved to Jay Scott (saxophonist), while Jay Scott (Canadian musician) is moved to Jay Scott (singer). — Amakuru (talk) 21:13, 5 December 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Jay Scott (musician) → Jay Scott (American musician) – Incomplete disambiguation, as another article now exists about Jay Scott (Canadian musician), and it's not at all clear that this one is highly meganotable enough to outprimary the other one for the generic "musician". In fact, this one might not even be sufficiently notable to have an article at all, as his article is completely unsourced and is staking his notability on having been a session musician on a Grammy-nominated recording for which Scott was not personally the nominee in his own right (which is in no way "inherently" notable enough to exempt him from actually having to pass WP:GNG on the sourcing), so taking it to AFD might be appropriate if no sourcing can be found to bolster it -- but at the very least, he's not markedly more notable than the Canadian guy. And for added bonus, Jay Scott (singer) also exists as a redirect to a band that yet another musician named Jay Scott was associated with, and is also going to have to be repointed to Jay Scott (disambiguation) because of the Canadian guy, so there's even less basis to claim that the American saxophonist outprimaries both of them. Bearcat (talk) 16:28, 27 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Move to Jay Scott (saxophonist) and move Jay Scott (Canadian musician) to Jay Scott (singer). 162 etc. (talk) 17:58, 27 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]
- Support this.--Ortizesp (talk) 19:02, 27 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]
- Since the Canadian musician is not just a singer, but also raps, I can't and won't support moving the Canadian musician to any title different than the one he currently has — and will in fact step in to revert any attempt to do any such thing. Bearcat (talk) 22:41, 27 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]
  See Talk:Jelly Roll (singer) for a recent RM discussion that supported such a move for a rapper turned singer. Or the recent move of Steve Lacy (guitarist) to Steve Lacy (singer). 162 etc. (talk) 23:15, 27 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]

I don't see that either of those things are equivalent situations. The Canadian Jay Scott is not principally a singer who occasionally also raps, he's principally a rapper who occasionally also sings — so "singer" would be disambiguating him by his side hustle instead of his primary day job. Bearcat (talk) 02:10, 28 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]

That's debatable. His album Ses plus grands succès won the award for Folk album of the year; he was not nominated in the rap category. [1]. This article [2] refers to him as chanteur (not rappeur) and his song "Copilote" as hip-pop. This review [3] of his cover album Rap Queb Vol. 1 calls him ex-rappeur and that he is "reinventing Quebec rap in a folk-pop style". 162 etc. (talk) 03:45, 28 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]

And every single thing he did up to that point, as well as the next thing he did after that, was straight hip hop and rap, which makes Ses plus grands succès a side hustle rather than his primary line of work. And the fact that there's even any debate to be had at all is precisely the reason why the most appropriate disambiguator for him is "musician" rather than arguing about whether he's "more a singer than a rapper" or "more a rapper than a singer". Like, why are we trying so hard to avoid a perfectly accurate term? Bearcat (talk) 04:29, 28 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]

I've cited reliable sources above indicating that "singer" is a perfectly accurate term. You're welcome to disagree, of course, or cite sources of your own to bolster your argument; that's what an RM is. 162 etc. (talk) 05:22, 28 November 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Move to Jay Scott (saxophonist). For the Canadian musician, I note that his name is stylized as "Jay Scøtt" in some sources, so I'd advocate moving the Canadian artist's page to Jay Scøtt as natural disambiguation. (Admittedly, the Scøtt spelling is used somewhat inconsistently, but I don't think that precludes us from using it as the title – see Mötley Crüe for a comparable situation.) ModernDayTrilobite (talk • contribs) 20:37, 1 December 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Support this one has 117 views but the Canadian one has 69[[4]] and the Canadian one was only created a few days ago so the rest of the time doesn't have data and now gets more daily views than the American one. No opinion on the alternative suggestion. Crouch, Swale (talk) 08:05, 2 December 2022 (UTC)[reply]

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.